Complex.

Do I want to remember the dead? Yes. But All the dead.
Would I prefer it if the whole poppy thing had become less socially obligatory and therefore no longer a mark of genuine thought about the fallen? Again – yes.
But the poppies around the ToL last year were one of the most moving things I have seen.
But perhaps the poppy imagery and links to the RBL add a parochial jingoistic element to remembrance?

But I am with the OP. On that plane it’s wrong.

Poppy on an armed forces plane to remind us about the scarifices of the armed forces doesn’t seem wrong in my opinion. Perhaps current members of the armed forces shouldn’t be allowed to promote the poppy.

You lot think too much … You either wear one or you don’t. Simple.
I wear one if I feel like and I don’t wear one if I don’t feel like, not because I don’t respect the dead but because I am in the wrong mood of the day.

Last few years I wore one but this year I have not as I was just not in the mood.

🙄

You lot think too much … You either wear one or you don’t. Simple.

Shh, chewkw, shh…. 😀

You lot think too much

Better than the alternative of bowing to social pressure and just wearing one without thinking about it at all.

Steady now chewk and THM think we should not think about this. Granted it has taken 4 pages of them thinking* and commenting on this to decide that but who am I to argue that we should just act without thinking

Junkyard – lazarus

Steady now chewk and THM think we should not think about this. Granted it has taken 4 pages of them thinking* and commenting on this to decide that but who am I to argue that we should just act without thinking

Few days ago I think I saw a clip of Barbara Windsor (think somewhere on the interweb) commented on those people who didn’t wear poppy, she basically said ” … they can better sod off …” something like that. Why is she important?

To be honest I think people should just simply relax as we all respect the dead.

No need to go high horse nor go about disrespecting like stamping on the poppy …

If you are in the mood of wearing one then wear one otherwise as you are.

Are some folk genuinely trying to assert that there is no pressure to conform to the poppy-wearing rule?

Walk down your high street, go to the pub, sit on a train. Try to work out what percentage of the average population was wearing a poppy.

Now switch on the TV and watch the news, sports etc. What percentage of presenters are wearing a poppy?

The ones that annoy me tend to be those that …

1. Insist on others to wear one.

2. The one openly disrespecting others who wear one.

I rather like to put them in a tiny room to see how they deal with each others.

Well the Beeb seemed to get the mood right – just caught the edited coverage of the Cenotaph

Dimbelby concluded along the lines – “its not the glory but the horror of war that we are remembering – lest we forget”

Well said that man!

But did Corbyn bow enough?

Dimbelby concluded along the lines – “its not the glory but the horror of war that we are remembering – lest we forget”

So I’d imagine they didn’t forget to have plents of groups representing the main victims of war in the ceremony – which is civilians.

So read the first page then jumped in here.

Not sure about the modern significance of the poppy but in todays service we had a poinient (sp) serman about the first soilder killed in bosnia trying to help some pregnant women.

I was more annoyed by the people feeling the need to document the part of the service at the the mamorial, even in the minutes silence that stupid camera sound comming from peoples phones.

Now if only some had written a song questioning war and purpose.

No point when this has already been done

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntt3wy-L8Ok[/video]

But did Corbyn bow enough?

I think it was the jacket that upset everyone

The thing that always sits funny in my head is that you never see a politician not wearing one but they are the **** sending people to die. Them and the queen at the cenotaph, without them we wouldnt be having wars. Wearing a poppy is not working for them, they have their 2 min silence then go off to send more to die.

anagallis_arvensis – Member
Them and the queen at the cenotaph, without them we wouldnt be having wars.

What if wars come to you?
Would you be willing to change your identity to one that is dictated to you?

Thats a different story and I suppose as those that lived through WW2 pass away I just worry that thecevents of the last 20 yrs mean kessons havent been learnt.

chewkw – Member
What if wars come to you?…

Got any examples involving the UK? (Not counting those where we were stirring the pot first)

anyone know what NCB means?

Jeremy Corbyn went up to Horseguards to meet/talk with WW2 veterans while the other politicians went for VIP lunch

National Coal Board

anyone know what NCB means?

Just someone being a prize t1t. Again.

cheers, so it was just someone using Remembrance Sunday to score a cheap political point

classy

but relevant to the OP as it sums up how much its become an idealogical football that (mostly) the rightwing nutters use as a weapon to attack those they dislike

cheers, so it was just someone using Remembrance Sunday to score a cheap political point

Ah, the ignorance of the young!

If you don’t understand the relevance of donkey jackets at remembrance parades to left wing labour leaders then you want to get reading your political history Kimbers. (Indeed, if you didn’t recognise a coal board Donkey jacket at a hundred paces, you might want to do the same)

I’m now educated ninfan

Funnily enough no labour leader ever wore one,? but some right wingers tried to use that lie as a political weapon to attack Michael foot with, well I never

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7361078/Michael-Foot-and-the-donkey-jacket-that-wasnt.html

Every day is a school day

Erm, yes, that would be my point (hence the highly convincing mocked up photo worthy of NASA/CIA black ops)

but relevant to the OP as it sums up how much its become an idealogical football that (mostly) the rightwing nutters use as a weapon to attack those they dislike

In the same way that we are all free to mark today as we see fit, we are also free to read this thread – very clear where the vitriol (mostly) comes from. Sad and unnecessary…

The Poppy is a symbol of rememberence for those who have given their lives in service for their country in time of war and comflict. Poppy’s grow on broken ground and where widely seen on the battlefields of WW1 and the colour is a poignant reminder to the blood that was split. They have thus become the symbol of rememberence. Not for a single second do they represent to me anything about the folly of war OP. It is entirely appropriate for Poppy’s to appear on military uniform and equipment.

I personally wear one every year and always donate to collectors, I also donate to other military related charities. I always observe the silence at 11 on the 11th. Many people died for our right to live in freedom, if some wish not to recognise that sacrifice that’s their choice. A choice provided to them by those that died.

epicyclo – Member

chewkw – Member
What if wars come to you?…

Got any examples involving the UK? (Not counting those where we were stirring the pot first) [/quote]

Second round with Argentina or with Spain over the Rock?

Ya, you are asking the crystal ball question …

Your point was he did not wear one so you mocked up someone else wearing one telling us it was left wing history…christ you dont have scribble some shit on here.

very clear where (most of) the vitriol comes from. Sad and unnecessary…

TBH i have not seen much just you getting upset about it whilst claiming others are “frothing”. You are still doing it but no one is frothing its a pretty temperate debate for STW I assume due to the subject with the odd bit of RW jingoistic tub thumbing about dying for our freedom eg Jamby below your post and some LW criticism of what the event has come to mean and the pressure to wear one and how it has changed from remembering the fallen of WW1 to glorifying /supporting our forces

The remembrance poppy is especially prominent in the UK. In the weeks leading up to Remembrance Sunday, they are distributed by The Royal British Legion in return for donations to their “Poppy Appeal”, which supports all current and former British military personnel. During this time, all public figures and people appearing on television are expected to wear them, and those who do not have been criticized. Some have berated this as “poppy fascism” and argued that the Appeal is being used to justify and glorify current wars.

very clear where the vitriol (mostly) comes from. Sad and unnecessary…

Agreed:

If you want froth, buy a bloody cappuccino

Not for a single second do they represent to me anything about the folly of war OP.

I bet they don’t.

Oh **** off you patronising ****.

I stand by that comment. He was being patronising and pompous in the extreme (as usual) and dismissing people’s perfectly valid opinions as ‘froth’.

And I’d like to hear his response to the ‘frothing’ of the 91-year-old war veteran that he’s been conveniently ignoring.

😀

Ignoring you grum, not the question. There are rules (that are supposed) to be adhered to….

except he is not and he was.

WHy is this issue such a divisive debate between RW and left wing on here?

I bet THM arrives to quote and add emojis to your reply-EDIT to be clear I wrote that before seeing his reply but so predicatble

I’m still waiting.

It’s hilarious isn’t it THM, that a 91-year-old war veteran feels this way:

However, I am afraid it will be the last time that I will bear witness to those soldiers, airmen and sailors who are no more, at my local cenotaph. From now on, I will lament their passing in private because my despair is for those who live in this present world. I will no longer allow my obligation as a veteran to remember those who died in the great wars to be co-opted by current or former politicians to justify our folly in Iraq, our morally dubious war on terror and our elimination of one’s right to privacy.

If only someone like you would tell him to ‘buy a bloody cappuccino if you want froth’.

You really are the most pompous person I have ever encountered on the internet. Well done.

There are rules that are supposed to be adhered to..

Is that you forthing then 😆

Bless have a coffee

QED

Anyway enough, it’s a day of respect and remembrance not this….

Junkyard – lazarus
WHy is this issue such a divisive debate between RW and left wing on here?

You are wrong! Said Peter Griffin from the Family Guy. 😆

Hey JY … I am beginning to like coz you must be TJ’s twin.

grum – Member
It’s hilarious isn’t it THM, that a 91-year-old war veteran feels this way:

I would tell the old chap that’s part of the condition for being human. You have a great global cull once in a while. It is very sad when it happens but nothing much you can do but either join in to fight or die being hunted down. No biggie. We all must die one day but it is the way we die that can explain how we live.

Frothing with added flounce QED