Long travel carbon hardtail options

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  • Long travel carbon hardtail options
  • Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    There’s a new c456 on the way I think – with updated angles

    nowthen
    Member

    Hi all,

    Apart from the 456 carbon, is there any other comparable carbon hard tails around, looking for something to take 140-160mm forks and a 30.9 or 31.6mm dropper post

    Many thanks

    nowthen

    nowthen
    Member

    But when…. not sure I have the patience!

    why do you want a lt carbon ht…? The fact that the market doesn’t cater for you (much) implies you might have unusual/wrong ideas about what you want and what you want the bike to do……

    nowthen
    Member

    Erm ok thanks for that, very helpful…

    Premier Icon tomhoward
    Subscriber

    He’s got a point though…

    I reckon the reason that lt hts tend not to be made of carbon is the type of riding they encourage, ie hooning about in the woods, on rougher terrain, isn’t what carbon does very well without the aid of a rear shock to stop all that lovely stiffness from drop kicking you repeatedly in the plums. What attributes of carbon do you want? Light weight? Means the bike won’t be that durable (and flexy) on terrain requiring the 160mm fork. Super Stiffness? See above re your plums, and it won’t be ‘that’ light.

    IMO you’d have more choice, and a better bike, if you picked a different material. Or if you need carbon, go full sus.

    nowthen
    Member

    So many professional bike designers on here, never realised!

    Am I to assume that its a 456 Carbon or nothing then?

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    nowthen,

    yep, pretty much that’s it.

    (you’re not allowed light, strong with lot of travel, on a HT) 😉

    I had a chameleon that was 140mm travel and 27lbs. It was ‘flicky’ and speedy but got pinged around just as much.

    Junkyard
    Member

    I swapped from an alloy Rock lobster B52 and the Carbon 456 is far more forgiving that that ever was. It is not zingy like steel [ then again it weighs 2 lb less than my steel frame [ to be fair it has an EBB in it]

    As for choices it would appear limited but I like my 456 though it gets more rocks than woods

    maxtorque
    Member

    tomhoward

    I reckon the reason that lt hts tend not to be made of carbon is the type of riding they encourage, ie hooning about in the woods, on rougher terrain, isn’t what carbon does very well without the aid of a rear shock to stop all that lovely stiffness from drop kicking you repeatedly in the plums. What attributes of carbon do you want? Light weight? Means the bike won’t be that durable (and flexy) on terrain requiring the 160mm fork. Super Stiffness? See above re your plums, and it won’t be ‘that’ light.

    And once again, someone fails to grasp the concept of “Specific Stiffness/Strength”……….

    (i.e. Stiffness or Strength per unit of mass).

    You can easily make a CF frame less stiff and less strong than a steel one.

    It’s also worth noting that in order to “absorb” terrain inputs, you’d be talking about a frame that could deflect in the order of INCHES (like a shock/damper) at low frequencies. I’m sure at say >200Hz & 0.1mm a CF frame has a different damping co-efficient than a steel one, but at 1Hz & 25mm it isn’t any different!

    TBH, the whole “CF frames are stiff and buzzy” is pretty much marketing / reviewer rubbish! Do the maths and that much is obvious.

    So, the real reason you don’t see too many Cf long travel hardtails is the development costs and hence frame costs. If you’re going to all that effort, then most designers are going to include rear suspension in the design whilst they are there. Few people are going to spend say £1500 on a CF hardtail when you could have an Ally FS for the same money (which the general public see as better value for money etc)

    Premier Icon ampthill
    Subscriber

    I think outside of the Uk it makes no sense

    So people haven’t bothered making one. It has been done and the material must offer potential, particularly with Kevlar mixed in

    mangatank
    Member

    I understand the draw of a carbon HT, but I just wouldn’t buy one again. The ride is lovely, and the lightness makes a big difference. But…

    …bits will come off. Probably nothing serious, but you’ll always be thinking…’damn, that rock really whacked the downtube…’

    Steel and Titanium, that’s where it’s at for the sort of bike you want. Of the two, Ti is the closest to the feel of carbon, but little matches the sparkle of a high-end steel frame

    dantsw13
    Member

    My C456 was probably the toughest bike I owned. Mine was the Raw Carbon Matt Black finish, which seems key to me, as the paint job seems flaky on the coloured ones.

    plyphon
    Member

    Agreeing with dantsw13, my raw carbon one seems fine, nothing flaking off or anything.

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