Life if your dog kills someone, a ban if your car does?

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  • Life if your dog kills someone, a ban if your car does?
  • warton
    Member

    You’re missing the same thing I am mate.

    Premier Icon bails
    Subscriber

    Yes, “we” are drivers who have momentary lapses of concentration, could happen to anyone your honour, didn’t mean any harm. “They” are dangerous dog breeding council estate scroungers who deserve to be punished.

    camo16
    Member

    On the upside, it sounds like a pretty effective deterent for folks who like to big themselves up by owning throat-ripping, ankle crushing, spit hurling mega beasts from hell big, tough dogs.

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    Interesting the old boy on BBC this morning said your dog attacking someone/thing was like driving your car at them/it. Well, not really – dog is a hell of a lot less dangerous.

    soobalias
    Member

    perhaps the government would like to consult cyclists with a view to changing the rules of the road.

    about 15 people dead in 8years from dog attacks.
    how many cyclists dead this year from hgv attack in london?

    Premier Icon footflaps
    Subscriber

    The key difference is the voters they are appealing to own cars but not ‘dangerous’ dogs. Ie throw the chav scum in jail but let the middle classes off with just a slap on the wrist…..

    Premier Icon woody2000
    Subscriber

    Sixteen people have been killed by dogs in the UK since 2005.

    There have been 19,500 road deaths in the same period. Knee jerk anyone?

    Even taking into account the numbers (~8 million dogs vs ~35 million vehicles), that’s a staggering over reaction!

    <shakes head>

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    throw the chav scum in jail

    No problem with that 😉

    Premier Icon gofasterstripes
    Subscriber

    bails – Member
    Yes, “we” are drivers who have momentary lapses of concentration, could happen to anyone your honour, didn’t mean any harm. “They” are dangerous dog breeding council estate scroungers who deserve to be punished.

    THAT, my friend, is a 5* quote and I will be using as much as possible.

    Thank you.

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    its just another pointless headline grabber from the government (along with high profile harassing of brown folks at tube stations, bashing benefit scroungers etc)
    all goes back to torry panic over ukip

    sad thing is I uspect that itll go down well with the elctorate

    andyl
    Member

    I can’t see my spaniel ever killing anyone so I think I’m safe.

    There is a difference as there is no real need to won certain breeds of dogs but accidents do happen when driving.

    BUT

    I do think that driving offences are dealt with badly and there should be much more lifetime bans given out. I think the driving test should be harder too and possibly done in several tests that include motorways not one high stress one.

    micky
    Member

    As a cyclist the amount of times I have been bitten and chased by dogs is numerous. There are so many irresponsible owners out there that let dogs off the lead that know they hate bikes etc. This quite often leads to problems with the owners as they 9/10 turn out to be morons if they are letting a dangerous dog off the lead. Any increase in the punishment for killer dog owners is 100% welcome. It might make some owners stop & think. I don’t understand the significance of comparing this to another different type of crime?

    camo16
    Member

    It won’t become law and – even if it does – people won’t actually get life sentences. As such, it’s attention grabbing tat designed for the ears of voters who dream of safe, friendly neighbourhoods, like we had in the 1950s.

    On the other hand, there’s dogs and there’s dogs. I wouldn’t mind seeing some hefty punishments doled out to owners of red-eyed hell hounds that, at some point, will scent blood and go bananas all over the place.

    samuri
    Member

    I don’t understand the significance of comparing this to another different type of crime?

    Priorities innit. Why mess around fixing an issue which has a very small impact (comparatively), while simultaneously ignoring the huge massive great elephant in the room which is 20,000 dead people.

    allthegear
    Member

    It has got me thinking that the anti-dog campaign has been interesting, though. They singled out particular breeds of dog to accuse of being inherently dangerous, regardless of any evidence.

    Maybe, just maybe, we could do something similar? I wonder how much more action would be possible if we were to start accusing certain makes of vehicle (BMW? Iveco?) of being inherently dangerous to cycles? If it was a sustained campaign, I wonder how the PR departments of the targeted makes would react? Would it help bring things to the forefront of the minds of those that can change things?

    Or am I just thinking weird stuff again?

    Rachel

    grim168
    Member

    I’m gonna teach my dog to drive….

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    As a cyclist the amount of times I have been bitten and chased by dogs is numerous

    Really? Blimey in 25 years I can count the number of times on er, well, 2 fingers… and one of them was a very noisy but very tiny terrier!

    camo16
    Member

    They singled out particular breeds of dog to accuse of being inherently dangerous, regardless of any evidence.

    I think that previous cases of death-by-large-rabid-muscle-dog is the evidence you’re looking for.

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    They singled out particular breeds of dog to accuse of being inherently dangerous, regardless of any evidence.

    Blind bloke’s guide dog got attacked by one from what I could make out. (Wasn’t paying the maximum of attention)

    Premier Icon MSP
    Subscriber

    I can’t see my spaniel ever killing anyone so I think I’m safe.

    Perfect example of the atitude stated above

    A recent study carried out on 6,000 dogs and their owners found out 33 of the most aggressive dogs, and also those which have good temperaments. The study involved collecting data from two different groups. The first group consisted of 11 different breeds and the second was an online survey mainly involving owners, including 33 breeds. The conclusions from both groups were similar. It looked at the different types of aggression such as towards other dogs, towards strangers and towards owners. Some of the results were surprising, below are the top ten most aggressive breed:

    Dachshunds
    Chihuahua
    Jack Russell
    Australian Cattle Dog
    Cocker Spaniel
    Beagle
    Border Collie
    Pit Bull Terrier
    Great Dane
    English Springer Spaniel

    soobalias
    Member

    there is no doubt that the 1991 dangerous dogs act was one of the worst thought out laws – ever.

    im with you Rachel, big dogs kill, big trucks kill

    2014 Dangerous Trucks Act. Its got a nice ring to it eh?

    samuri
    Member

    While aggression levels might be true, only a couple of those dogs are capable of killing someone.

    camo16
    Member

    Yeah, a Chihuaha might have an almighty pog on, but it’s not gonna tear some kid’s arm off.

    Premier Icon MSP
    Subscriber

    Most of the “deaths” I have seen in the news have been toddlers, most of the dogs in the list could kill a toddler. It’s only the pit bulls that get reported because they are devil dogs 🙄

    camo16
    Member

    Whereas pit bulls are really just misunderstood, MSP?

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    Pit Bull Terrier

    I thought they were banned anyway?

    Premier Icon votchy
    Subscriber

    Strange how the dogs that this is aimed at are the ones I have had least problems with, I have been chased and bitten by Jack Russells, Labradors, Border Collies, Yorkshire Terriers and Poodles, never by a Staffie, Alsation, Rottweiler etc so am hoping that any change to the law is across the patch and not just the ‘alleged’ dangerous dogs

    Premier Icon MSP
    Subscriber

    Whereas pit bulls are really just misunderstood, MSP?

    Mainly so, yes. I would rather be near a properly trained pit bull, than a badly trained border collie.

    camo16
    Member

    @ votchy – that’s a good point

    My one experience with mutt-violence was a sudden attack from the pub dog in my old village. It was a red setter… and apparently red setters are always placid, loving Buddhist dogs – as dog-lovers keep telling me.

    This blighter wasn’t and I still have the noughts and crosses scars on my hand to testify that red setters are blood-lusting thugs. At least one was. 👿

    Mainly so, yes. I would rather be near a well trained pit bull, than a badly trained border collie.

    You’re possibly right. The guy-gangs I see hanging around in my home area don’t seem to have good obedience training at the forefront of their minds, though.

    allthegear
    Member

    By lack of evidence, I wasn’t saying dogs don’t attack, I was saying there’s little evidence that one particular breed is more likely to attack than another, after taking other factors into consideration (like the chav-factor of the owner)

    andyl
    Member

    Perfect example of the atitude stated above

    But you are incorrectly assuming that MY spaniel correlates to the average in those ‘studies’.

    So therefore my attitude is correct and you can shove that comment up your bottom!

    camo16
    Member

    allthegear – apologies. Reading back on that, my comment feels unduly abrasive.

    We have plenty of Tory-sterotyped chav gangs with mahoosive dogs straining on leashes in our area. Our neighbour has one, who (the owner said, to reassure me) “only goes for strangers or people he thinks are threatening me”. 😯

    Needless to say, this scares my son sh!tless and mrscamo16, too.

    Now, I’m a dog person by and large, but some of these beasts are tragedies waiting to happen.

    TuckerUK
    Member

    Killer dogs’ owners in England and Wales could face life in prison

    So, your dog (which has a mind of it’s own, and therefore in theory, you can never control 100%) kills someone, you could face life in prison. Your car (which you should be controlling 100%) kills someone, you’ll get an inconvenient ban.

    And I missing something?

    Premier Icon tomhoward
    Subscriber

    gofasterstripes – Member

    bails – Member
    Yes, “we” are drivers who have momentary lapses of concentration, could happen to anyone your honour, didn’t mean any harm. “They” are dangerous dog breeding council estate scroungers who deserve to be punished.

    THAT, my friend, is a 5* quote and I will be using as much as possible.

    Thank you.

    Best judge the situation first though eh? If someone askes you if ‘you want fries with that?’, pick a different response.

    +1 op

    As a cyclist the amount of times I have been bitten and chased by dogs is numerous.

    I have been chased and bitten by Jack Russells, Labradors, Border Collies, Yorkshire Terriers and Poodles

    seriously? WTF do you do tie steaks to your ankles?
    I was nipped by a terrier as young kid and once took my mums Cairn to the vets and the vet for some unknown reason shoved his finger up her arse and she turned round and bit me, which I couldn’t really blame her for, other than that I have never been bitten and cannot think of a time I have been chased either on my bike or not.

    Premier Icon gofasterstripes
    Subscriber

    Dunno….

    TBH I’m more likely to be bitten by a dog then eat a takeaway that comes with fries.

    micky
    Member

    As a cyclist the amount of times I have been bitten and chased by dogs is numerous

    Really? Blimey in 25 years I can count the number of times on er, well, 2 fingers… and one of them was a very noisy but very tiny terrier!

    I suspect it’s the area I ride being the nearest woodland to a major city and attracting huge amounts of dog owners. As a paper boy i used to get chased daily and sometimes worse. Often outside of the owners property. I find collies the worst for actual biting. I suspect the nip on the ankle is the herding instint in them.

    @allthegear – what about Audi or would that disadvantage too great a proportion of STWers?

    I like the idea of a concerted campaign, if anyone does decide to kick it off then use social media to get the message out and be relentless. The good pr departments will be tracking their #tags and watching for negative comments. We used this on BT when they dicked us about last year, it was surprising how quickly they acted in order to pacify us.

    mrlebowski
    Member

    I’m gonna teach my dog to drive….

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

    TurnerGuy
    Member

    what if your dog kills someone that is attacking you???

    camo16
    Member

    You get life, the ‘someone’ doesn’t.

    Premier Icon gofasterstripes
    Subscriber

    What if your dog attacks a car?

    What if your dog attacks someone who is attacking you with a car [with open windows – let’s keep this plausible]?

    Oh, the possibilities!

    camo16
    Member

    What if your dog attacks someone who is attacking you with a car [with open windows – let’s keep this plausible]?

    Oh, the possibilities!

    A completely different law shall apply to Ninja Dog

    Strange how the dogs that this is aimed at are the ones I have had least problems with, I have been chased and bitten by Jack Russells, Labradors, Border Collies, Yorkshire Terriers and Poodles

    I’m not saying you bring it on yourself, but I’ve been arround dogs since I was a toddler (and probably before that, but I don’t remember)and whilst you get the odd one run up on the trails shouting it’s head off (lets face it, mountainbikers look wierd and probably smell funny too) I’ve never been chased, bitten or attacked on the bike or anywhere else.

    Premier Icon cb
    Subscriber

    How about compulsory dog training. No certificate, no dog & a fine. Won’t solve everything but might encourage a bit more thought before buying a dog. Bit beyond a licence type scheme and will at least ensure the “dangerous” dogs have had some training.

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