was thinking 506 now its 405 or the hemlock. I think the hemlock, any body want to change my mind.

Yes, I've ridden both and the 405 is way better and what I own. The Hemlock is okay, but unremarkable, feels like any other four-bar imo and slightly dead feeling.

The 405 is short, chuckable and very, very quick. But honestly, you need to go and demo them both because what suits my style of riding won't necessarily suit yours and I'm biased and I own a Pace. He said, somewhat unhelpfully, but with a certain amount of truth :-/? sorry…

Joking aside, what I like about the Pace is that it's short, with a low front end, doesn't bob, accelerates faster than it has any right to, and likes being stuffed into things rather than sat on like a mobile sofa. The Hemlock to me felt more stable and planted maybe, but less lively.

i agree with BWD about the pace i love mine and cant see me changing it for a long time i dont have any experience of the hemlock im afraid.

Why are Pace naming their bikes after old Peugeots?

can get a pace demo from big bear but hemlock ?

I would have to disagree with the Hemlock feeling unremarkable.In my experience having owned an 09 frame for the last few months im finding it the best of all worlds.Ive owned several good bikes over the last few years,including a 5 spot,Intense 5.5 and the latest Yeti 575[which i found very average].So u can see ive got a few good bikes to compare it to.I think the Hemlocks a great peddler and very lively on singletrack.The 4 bar suspensions still the best,most neutral of all the suspension systems going around.Thing that makes the Hemlock such a good bike in my opinion is the well thought out geometry.Combine short chainstays and a low front end with any fork of your choice and u cant go wrong and dont get me started on the choise of travel options at the back.A winner in my opinion.

Well 18bikes in Hope can certainly do Hemlock demos.

The full dealer list is on the Cotic site here

Thanks jon I'll have to go and see then at york as hope is a bit of a trek.

I was thinking 120 at the back and a pair Lyrik 2step up front and some low rise 750 bars.

That would be my setup too – the 150 rockers feel a bit too linear for my liking, and I have a U-turn Lyric. It's a 1.5 head tube so you could run an external lower bearing for extra slackness and an internal reducer at the top for lower stack height! (in fact the new Hope stepdown headset comes like that!)

I would have to disagree with the Hemlock feeling unremarkable.I

Like I said, it's all subjective and different bikes suit different people. I'm not saying the Hemlock's not good, it just didn't really stand out for me in the way that the Pace does. If I were a better rider perhaps, it might be a different story.

I'm 6'1" with a long reach was thinking the 405 might be a bit short. I ride a xl chameleon.

I'm 6ft with a medium reach and ride a large 405. I've not ridden a Hemlock but love the pace to bits. The sizing is spot on for me and I use a 90mm stem. I got mine through Big Bear and can't recommend their service enough.

It looks its turning in to a very good bike shop

I have not ridden the hemlock but owned the 405- good pedaling platform for on the up's and the rear felt very plush. Quite short on the TT I'm 5 11' and had to ride the large with a 90mm stem which was great for xc stuff but I always felt it didn't have the 'chuckibility' that I wanted hence why I changed it. My bike had a fairly bling build and still weighed 29lbs so I was dissapointed with how much It weighed ( I now have a 2009 five AM built with 36's/ tech m4's / saint etc and it only weighs a lb more) so bear that in mind!

Why are Pace naming their bikes after old Peugeots?

Hahaha, if they're trying to get rid of their reputation for selling unreliable tat, they're going about it the wrong way.

I was considering the same bikes a month or so ago. Never got to a test ride of either, but found the following reviews which gave me a bit of an idea.
Hemlock
405
both compared
Hope this helps

I doubt you can go wrong with either.
Hemlock wins for me with the short 120 travel rear and long 160 front set up. Did run 140 forks with a 10mm spacer below the headtube which was also ace but now have the internal cups with 160 forks. I wouldn't want anymore length on the front end when riding around. Maybe if I were going downhilling in the Alps but I like to be able to climb too.

Erm Hemlock looks nicer than the Pace?