Jumping – Educate me

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  • Jumping – Educate me
  • ryanctj
    Member

    How to jump with Fabian Barel

    I can’t help you personally as I normally sail through the air unintentionally (then crash) but I was just watching some good vids by Fabian Barel which you might find useful.

    Premier Icon piedi di formaggio
    Subscriber

    Tip 1 – Go see Jedi, no really!
    Tip 2 – Look where you are going to take off from
    Tip 3 – Don’t look where you are going to land – look at where you are going after you land
    Tip 4 – have two 9’s pre-entered on your mobile, so there’s just the last one to press if it all goes wrong ๐Ÿ˜‰

    eightyeight
    Member

    Thanks ryan – though that video doesn’t actually tell me how to jump with Fabien Barel ๐Ÿ˜€ Though seriously, I found that he doesn’t go into enough detail on the take off and where your weight should be when you’re in the air.

    Piedi – Like I said, am well keen and it’s my bday coming up so fingers crossed. But realistically won’t be until next year and I would like to reach a personal plateu before getting tuition

    Premier Icon colournoise
    Subscriber

    The Barel video is good. A day with Jedi is better.

    Start on something really small (even a kerb) and only move on to bigger stuff once your brain and body are confident.

    Weight centred (stood up, pedals level, hips over BB).
    Don’t pull up on the bars to take off!
    Unweight the bike a bit before the lip of whatever you’re jumping off.
    Look at where you’re going AFTER the landing.

    _tom_
    Member

    Stay loose/relaxed and push rather than pull. Pump the transition and look ahead.

    eightyeight
    Member

    After some big offs, I’ve decided i’m going to focus on my jumping for a few hours this weekend.

    What better way to prepare myself for repeatedly smashing my face into the dirt than calling on the contradictory collecetive knowledge of the STW community.

    So tips, pointers, step by steps or links to good vids would be much appreciated.

    (I know coaching would be an idea – i’m saving up!)

    smcicr
    Member

    – start small
    – practice your ‘push’ (as it sounds – pushing the bars forward – you can use the technique to lift the front wheel over obstacles by way of practice)
    – speed is important – too much is as bad as not enough. Jedi had me clearing his six foot double from a shortish roll in down a slight slope – no pedalling required ๐Ÿ™‚ So try a smallish jump at lowish speed and gradually increase depending on your results
    – pedals level as you approach, stood up, knees bent a little
    – pick the point you’re going to push – before the lip / take off point and once that’s done you should be looking where you’re going and where you’ll be landing

    think that’s it – best of luck!

    Being able to do proper bunnyhops helps. And then just do what tom said.

    Although people saying “push” rather than “pull” may confuse you. You want to be pumping (pushing I guess) through the bottom of the take off and then soaring off the top of the lip. Pull up if you want to go really high.

    If you push off the top of the lip you tend to go really low which is good if you’re going very fast but it isnt really jumping.

    Premier Icon mudfish
    Subscriber

    It seems that it’s tough to learn with a transition (take off ramp) shorter than the bike length.
    Can you bunny hop, some jumpers bunny off the lip.

    Maybe go to a BMX track, or pump track, observe and try copy.
    “pump” the transition. (lower your weight into the bike (just like you’d do if jumping on the spot without a bike)
    If you ride a pump track you’ll likely start to get off the ground naturally as you learn to pump.
    If landing back wheel first (typical fault) then pull your head forward in the air, I know it sounds weird but it works, start that move in small steps though.
    Spot the landing.
    enjoy
    wear pads and a good helmet.

    Euro
    Member

    If you push off the top of the lip you tend to go really low which is good if you’re going very fast but it isnt really jumping.

    Totally agree DT, with that and also the pulling up on the bars bit. If i’m going for it i’m generally pulling up like frig. I’m not just pulling though, combined with a bit of a push (to get the distance – more push equals more length) and a bit of tuck for more height.

    OP – Its hard to explain jumping in words without doing the actions, but if it helps, i’m doing them now.

    mudfish – lower your weight into the bike (just like you’d do if jumping on the spot without a bike

    Practice off the bike too. Roll your hips backwards and down when pumping and forwards and up when boosting off. Think circular rather than up and down movements. Works a treat for me.

    Thing is, all that ^^ takes good timing and that only comes with practice. Lots of practice.

    If your just learning keep it simple. Get used to how it feels being weightless and try to keep loose and centred over the bike in the air. It doesn’t take much body movement to affect your trajectory as you’ve probably discovered ๐Ÿ˜€ .

    TheBrick
    Member

    1. Buy monster(TM) trucker hat.
    2. There is no step 2. With monster(TM) in your life you will have all the skills you need for rad^sick.

    eightyeight
    Member

    Thanks chaps – some really helpful stuff here. Especially the pre-take off stuff.

    I will put it all into action this weekend / annoy Bowland Mountain Rescue even more ๐Ÿ™‚

    Trimix
    Member

    If you only remember two things, try to remember these:

    1 Stay relaxed / loose on the bike.
    2 Dont pull up.

    If you can do these two things you can get away with a lot of the rest and slowly build up. Its also a good idea to have someone watch and tell you how you look in the air or how you land.

    Stevelol
    Member

    I don’t know if anyone has mentioned it yet but try and practise on a table top too, once you’re clearing the table and landing with your front wheel (slightly) first on the downslope and feel in control in the air then you’re probably going OK.

    nealy
    Member

    The below extract from Mastering Mountain Bike Skills made it click for me, you pretty much just push down with your legs on the up ramp, keep your arms loose and stay relaxed.

    1. Coast in a neutral position. Center yourself over your pedals, arms and legs
    slightly bent. Pedals should be level.
    2. Crouch down as you approach the jump. This is all in your legs. Let your arms
    follow.
    3. Your crouch should be lowest when you reach the bottom of the face. Note
    how the front tire is on the face and the rear tire is just reaching it.
    4. From your low position, immediately begin to spring upward. Donโ€™t hang out in
    a crouch. Bend down and then immediately pop back up like youโ€™re bouncing
    on a trampoline. This is the crux move.
    5. Push down with your legs as you ride up the face. The harder you cram your
    bike into the face of the jump, the more lift youโ€™ll get. Push all the way up the
    face. Big jumps require a longer, slower push than tiny jumps. For max lift,
    straighten your legs all the way as you reach the lip. This should be almost all
    leg power; your arms follow.
    6. As you leave the lip, bend your arms and legs to let your bike rise into your
    body. This gives you added clearance, and it helps to keep you loose in the
    air.

    eightyeight
    Member

    Nealy – fasntastic! Thanks a lot. I’ve actually got that book (which is excellent btw), but your notes and the added context on the other posters means it makes a lot more sense.

    There are 2-3 back to back table tops on the Hope Line at Gisburn, so hopefully by the end of Sunday i’ll be clearing them (hopefully not getting ahead of myself)

    Happy riding!

    After breaking some bones and getting a metal plate in my shoulder last year I turned into a scardy cat on jumps.

    I asked people for advice, read lots of stuff online, all that, but when it came to it I ran out of bottle. Really the only way to learn is to repeat the same jumps loads till you’re faster/higher.

    I got over my irrational fear by spending the day alone at Innerleithen pushing up Make or Brake, gradually getting more confident. I now need a bigger chainring if I’m going to ride them quicker. After my 17th run at them I learned to love jumping again ๐Ÿ™‚

    TLDR: Find some wee ones, repeat till happy, move on to bigger ones.

    Premier Icon DoctorRad
    Subscriber

    Okay then, how about jumping things like logs where there’s no lip or face to the jump? I can sort-of get the back wheel off the ground by pulling up on my SPDs, but how can I improve things?

    Okay then, how about jumping things like logs where there’s no lip or face to the jump? I can sort-of get the back wheel off the ground by pulling up on my SPDs, but how can I improve things?

    You need to learn to bunny hop. You don’t pull up with your spuds, you lean back to lift the front wheel (like a manual) then lift the rear wheel using a scooping motion in your ankles.

    Watching youtube or reading about it will only confuse things. Get someone who can bunny to show you how – it’s dead easy

    Premier Icon DoctorRad
    Subscriber

    I’ve been told it’s dead easy before now and never got the hang of it… will perhaps learn to manual and then ask someone tame to help out…

    eightyeight
    Member

    Manualling, for me, is harder than bunny-hopping. It’s the ultimate test of bike control – and something no matter how many hours I spend practising I only manage to get going for a few seconds ๐Ÿ™

    With jumping, bottle isn’t the problem (my mrs. would say I’ve got too much), from ski-ing i’m happy to be in the air for a long time. It’s just skill and ability I lack ๐Ÿ˜‰

    dans160
    Member

    Start off small, say a curb and get used to that. Don’t try for the big gap jumps first! Later if you can find a nice, not too high table top use that to practice on.
    Remember to pump rather than pull up on the bars. That diagram in a previous post is pretty good.
    Approach at a speed you are comfortable with and one where you are balanced.
    Drop your saddle right down.
    Check the rebound on your suspension, make sure it’s not at the full zebedee, you don’t want any suprises e.g. if the back end of the bike is bucking you slow the rear rebound down. If you are running a CCDB it’s the HSR circuit you need to tinker with.
    Tell someone where you are and when you will be back, take a phone and keep it with you.
    Take food and plenty to drink. Repeating the same run over and over again is actually very tiring.
    If you have all the protection gear, wear it e.g. full face helmet.
    Jedi is your man.
    I am not an expert so if you fall off and hurt yourself it’s your own silly fault, nobody made you do this!

    eightyeight
    Member

    Check the rebound on your suspension, make sure it’s not at the full zebedee, you don’t want any suprises e.g. if the back end of the bike is bucking you slow the rear rebound down. If you are running a CCDB it’s the HSR circuit you need to tinker with.

    My rear suss is Rock Shox Monarch RL, but i’m really struggling to figure out how to adjust it properly?! Only ever ridden hard-tail before, so struggling with all the new knobs!

    slowrider
    Member

    The contradictory advice on these threads always worries me a little as the OP has no way of knowing how good the person giving the advice actually is! Great to see you are already planning on getting some coaching, hopefully they will put right all us lot have made wrong ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Go see Jedi. You’ll be flying in no time!

    eightyeight
    Member

    Slowrider – I found, on this thread at least, the advise to be incredibly consistent. I guess with jumping there is a right way and a wrong way, gravity doesn’t allow for opinions!

    Euro
    Member

    [i]takes willy out[/i]

    Mine (and DTs) tip of pulling on the bars works. Granted, it’s not for beginners and not something most coaches will tell you. They’ll be showing you the basics and that’s the way it should be.

    slowrider – the OP has no way of knowing how good the person giving the advice actually is!

    True.

    [i]waves it a bit[/i]

    This pic was taken of me almost 20 years ago at a comp. My mate Will (owner/editor of DigBMX) asked me along and despite having not ridden a bmx in almost 18 months I entered the KOD and won, beating several english pros.

    Midway though a table 360…

    [i]puts it away[/i] ๐Ÿ˜‰

    tracknicko
    Member

    mid way through a table 3.

    (not me)

    Euro
    Member

    That’s a much nicer pic than mine. Git has more style too ๐Ÿ™‚

    _tom_
    Member

    Any excuse to post my favourite riding photo ever. Someone (not me) roasting a fat double!

    tracknicko
    Member

    all 360s must now be done at this angle, otherwise sufficient style has not been achieved.

    IMO etc.

    (still not me)

    dans160
    Member

    This is me. And next week, if I remember the camera, I’ll post up the night version. Dirt jumps freak me out though, so respect to anyone who does that!

    [video]http://vimeo.com/52199197[/video]

    dans160
    Member

    “My rear suss is Rock Shox Monarch RL, but i’m really struggling to figure out how to adjust it properly?! Only ever ridden hard-tail before, so struggling with all the new knobs!”

    1. Set the sag properly. Wear all you kit and gently get on the bike and leaning against a sturdy wall/fence get into your normal riding position or the ‘attack’ position letting the bike settle, some gentle (very gentle) bouncing is fine to help this. Your shock should have a rubber O ring on the piston. Check to see how much that has moved. Somewhere around 25 to 33% is fine.
    2. Set the rebound. Find out how many clicks of adjustment there are so go from fully out to fully in counting the clicks. Initially start about half way.
    3. Find a piece of trail that you are familiar with and ride it over and over again making small changes to the shock, noting what change you make each time. Keep doing this until you are happy and comfortable on the bike.
    4. If you are into jumping you don’t want to be bucked and also on steep hills (going down them) you don’t want the back of the bike pushing you forwards. If this happens slow the rebound down. If the opposite is happening i.e. the back of the bike, feels dead/wooden speed the rebound up.

    Don’t go too mad, your suspension settings will always be a compromise i.e. don’t stress about it juts get it so it works well most of the time.

    I’m not sure if you have compression adjusters on your shock?

    Mine (and DTs) tip of pulling on the bars works. Granted, it’s not for beginners and not something most coaches will tell you. They’ll be showing you the basics and that’s the way it should be.

    Yup, theres a difference between the jumping a coachwill teach you and actually being able to jump properly (or at least I imagine there is)

    A good coach like jedi will get you clearing small gaps with mellow take offs and landings without bother. You dont need to pull up oto do this, its just a case of floating over it. Most of it is in your head.

    However, jumping high over steep dirt jumps and spines/volcanos (proper jumps?) requires a different approach.

    For example, heres a table picture at Burnley skatepark (before it closed :(). It was done off some pissy flat bank which is basically just a flat wedge at about a 45 degree angle. Theres no way I would have got that high if I’d just pushed forward off the take off.

    Tomdowie
    Member

    I tend to avoid the “push” with the arms. Use your legs and your arms will follow, you have barely any weight going through your arms so pushing with them will only make for stiff arms when you unweight the bike off the takeoff.

    I coach people to use different points of the takeoff to apply weight to to change height and length etc rather than keeping one standard pump and then having to manipulate the bike causing you to stiffen and take too much control. Dial the takeoff and stay relaxed through. Spot the bottom of your landing and not the top to line you up with it.

    Hope this helps in any way.

    eightyeight
    Member

    Thanks Tom.

    That actually makes a lot of sense, because sometimes I miss judge the takeoff and found that having pumped my arms I’m in a rigid position.

    I’ve found my improvement has been gradual over the weeks as opposed to any step change after a big sesh.

    Thanks for all the tips!

    Tomdowie
    Member

    no worries bud. Glad it makes sense. See if it helps you out.

    The more you working on pumping and pumping with your legs the better jumper you’ll be.

    Good luck!

    Tom

    xiphon
    Member

    Never thought about ‘how’ I jump – been doing it for so long!

    My parents still have a video from when I was 6, clearing some home-made doubles out of planks of wood…

    ayles1983
    Member

    My advice would be to book yourself in with Tom dowie for a 2 hour jump session. I race Bmx and felt my jumping was holding me back as I didn’t like to hit the bigger jumps. I can honestly say that after practicing what we went through on the session I’m hitting bigger jumps safely with confidence. Obviously practice makes perfect but it’s practicing the ”right” technique that’s important.
    Get booked in. Very reasonable prices too.

    eightyeight
    Member

    You won’t believe me, but I’ve got Tom’s website on my favourite’s tab, just waiting for the right time to book.

    What’s the STW discount rate Tom? Hello….

    Tomdowie
    Member

    Awesome :).

    Afraid no discount but my 2 hour jump courses are ยฃ45!

    Hopefully seen you soon bud

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