This is the policy the voters of places like SunderlandHartlepool, Manchester and St Albans have been waiting for.

FTFY

Can’t believe I missed that opportunity!

*hangs head in shame*

You can always rely on Corbyn and the Labour party to be campaigning on the issues that really matter.

You can always rely on Corbyn and the Labour party to be campaigning on the issues that really matter.

So what do you think of his speech and the various proposals in that or, as a random other labour action today, the request for the updated Yellowhammer strategy to be published?

The monkey story made me chuckle, until I wondered what they plan to do with the 5000 monkeys.

I assume the government won’t be releasing them all into the wild so I guess the plan is to kill them all and Labour will enter the next Gen election [1] campaigning on a “kill 5000 monkey’s” ticket.

Once again you have to wonder if Labour’s strategy is to lose so a) Brexit happens b) Labour don’t get the blame.

[1] Which could be any day now.

Trump has said he’s planning on buying the monkeys. He wants to repopulate Greenland with those more likely to support him.

It’s almost like the author of this has been reading this forum 🙂

They’d rather see Britain crash out of the EU under Boris Johnson than risk departing from neoliberalism under Jeremy Corbyn.

False dichotomy fallacy.

Ken Clarke & Harriet Harman are available plus any number of other candidates. It’s not JC or nothing. (Mind you, JC knows that and is just using it as a way to get the Brexit he’s been advocating for 40 years.)

Nor has JC said its him or nothing! But of course this is all part of the false narrative around him.

Nor has JC said its him or nothing!

All the more reason why it’s a false dichotomy.

It’s almost like the author of this has been reading this forum

Oh, it’s by Dawn Foster…If you mean written with all the style and substance of a 6th former, then yes, I agree with you, Centerist Ultras, I ask you…

Jezza uniting the nation again.

Centerist Ultras

Oh how I laughed. So so so funny.
If you’re not quite at uni but have finished your GCSEs. 😊

If you’re not quite at uni but have finished your GCSEs

Yup, about as mature as using the word comrade to belittle anyone with a faintly left of centre view on anything.

I don’t look at politics news much because it just indicates the same paralysis most days, but excluding the Tory leadership circus, what I’ve picked up from the past six months or so is:

– A few MPs stand down, the Labour ones citing their deep and principled hatred of racism as the cause, and form what eventually becomes Change UK
– At their launch, one of the Change UK MPs immediately says something racist on stage
– Lib Dems demand second referendum
– Jeremy Corbyn says he’d back a second referendum
– New Lib-Dem leader loudly states absolute refusal to work with Jeremy Corbyn.
– Not many weeks later: Lib Dems and Tom Watson condemn Jeremy Corbyn for not working with others
– Corbyn very explicitly states willingness to work with others, making specific concessions
– Everyone stares at their feet before resuming mutters of “corbyn iz bad”
– Change UK polling at 0%

So we appear to have commies willing to actually make concessions to centrists for the sake of progress. Meanwhile, the Extremely Sensible Centrists seem continuously willing to set everything on fire and drive it off a cliff while going “LALALA NOT LISTENING”, and not even trying to hide their hypocrisy. While claiming they’re the adults.

You’re all **** bonkers.

– New Lib-Dem leader loudly states absolute refusal to work with Jeremy Corbyn

Or more to the point won’t put him into number 10.

I don’t think anyone sensible would, the simple reality being, corbyn is the least* liked person in Westminster behind even bojo. No matter how sensible he might be in practice he’d not make it past the gates of downing Street before any government he led (given the current make up of Parliament) was subject to a no confidence vote. He’d have a margin no bigger than Boris consisting of mainly people who don’t trust or like him and he wouldn’t get to Brussels to negotiate an extension before he wasn’t in charge of negotiating one any more. He’s simply to devisive.

Like him or loathe him, at present he’s not capable of doing the job he’s offering to do if only because not enough people would let him. Petty tribal infantile behaviour it may be but the that’s the reality. I’m not alone in continually expecting the children in the playground to suddenly behave like adults only to be surprised when they continue to behave like children exactly as they always have in the past, but let’s be honest, that makes me the fool not them.

As for him making concessions, when he publicly backs [before the 11th hour] someone with a chance of forming some sort of united unity government I’ll be happy to to eat my hat however being the man/party who “saved Britain from brexit” is too much of a prize for him or anyone else in his position to give it to someone else.

(I’m also not convinced that, in a wonderful parody of bj’s blaming the EU for brexit because of the backstop, JCs not quite happy to watch brexit happen so long as the tories are to blame, especially with the now added bonus of being able to blame the centre for not backing him to save the day)

*maybe not least, but certainly of those who might head a unity government.

Lib dems simply are scared of an election knowing they will lose seats including likely their leader. Thats why they oppose corbyn – he wants an election

You know those people who think middle of the road leftwing poilicies are communist sixth form nonsense? Well it’s not a new thing..

“The similarities between Corbyn and Miliband are close, as people in both camps agree. One Labour frontbencher told me recently, “Our 2017 manifesto was basically the programme Miliband would have loved to have presented” – and when I ran that by a senior adviser to the previous Labour leader, they agreed. For all the hard-left epithets flung at today’s opposition, it offers the kind of European social democracy that Angela Merkel would recognise.”

Thats why they oppose corbyn – he wants an election

If he’s put into number 10 he’ll be given one quicker than he can call for it.

(and I’m not honestly sure he does, unless he’s a fool. What he wants is a JC led labour government which an election at the moment isn’t especially likely to deliver. If he does get into government via a no confidence motion and he calls a GE within a month I’ll buy you a beer TJ, at the moment shouting for a GE knowing he’s not going to get one is easy. It’ll be like clegg all over again [though JC is too old for a job in an evil empire afterwards]).

For what it’s worth I think the LD are less bothered about losing seats than the firm realisation that a change in parliamentary arithmetic could see a very probrexit Westminster. I don’t believe the great hype that is the brexit party landslide but I don’t have to, just enough MPs worried about their 2nd home allowance do.

If you look at the polling in Scotland Swinson is going to loose her seat – and she is scared of that. SNP will put a huge effort into her seat.

I do love the way that whatever Corbyn says he must want the opposite. corbyn wants a short term interim government that gets an extension then a GE then a referendum

~Swinson wants it the other way round so she can present herself as the saviour of the county and maybe save her seat.

If he’s put into number 10 he’ll be given one quicker than he can call for it.

Since he would be going in and calling it the same day I find that somewhat unlikely.
Remember all he is saying right now is a government lasting five or so weeks which will
a)ask for an extension
b)call for a GE
c)in that GE Labour would be campaigning on the basis of a referendum.

For what it’s worth I think the LD are less bothered about losing seats than the firm realisation that a change in parliamentary arithmetic could see a very probrexit Westminster

No I think Swinson and a couple of others are deeply concerned about their seats.
They are highly vulnerable and although the libdems might do better overall that wont help their own political careers.
That they seem happy to risk hard brexit rather than compromise is rather telling.

Lib dems simply are scared of an election knowing they will lose seats including likely their leader.

I’m sure that’s true. But Labour are *way* more scared of the Libdems. As soon as Swinson took over the Party Labour turned their guns on the liberals in a big way. The only reason they’d do that is if they saw the Liberals as their main threat. Given the lib dems are a non entity who won a mere 12 seats in 2017 and 8 in 2015!!! The were so inconsequential they haven’t been worth a mention from the two main parties since 2015! Corbyn has run the party down to the point where a party that was on the edge of oblivion look like serious competition.

If he does get into government via a no confidence motion and he calls a GE within a month I’ll buy you a beer TJ,

I’ll take you up on that. Mind you its very unlikely that the lib dems will allow this to happen as they are resolutely opposed to a corbyn led interim government and a election

Remember all he is saying right now is a government lasting five or so weeks which will
a)ask for an extension
b)call for a GE
c)in that GE Labour would be campaigning on the basis of a referendum.

…and D, he must be the PM.

If he dropped D then everyone could get behind a caretaker PM and achieve A,B & C. [1] Arguing the problem isn’t Corbyn it’s everyone else is flawed.

[1] Well I’m not sure that would work, [2] but for the sake of argument lets assume it would.
[2] Because any remainer Torys who voted against the govt would cease to be Torys at the next election. Essentially supporting a GOvt of National Unity would involve remainer Tory’s purging the party of Remainer MPs. (Themselves.)

I see according to Swinson logic, Ken Clarke, who voted for Theresa May’s brexit deal every time, is a remainer, and Corbyn, who voted against it every time, is a brexiteer. Right, got it. Nothing weird going on there at all.

That they seem happy to risk hard brexit rather than compromise is rather telling.

As someone much funnier than me said of the Lib Dems plans: “Hard brexit and a 5p tax on plastic straws”

Corbyn has not said he must be PM. He said he is the obvious choice. I am certain he would agree another figure if and only if the numbers looked right.

I see according to Swinson logic, Ken Clarke, who voted for Theresa May’s brexit deal every time, is a remainer, and Corbyn, who voted against it every time, is a brexiteer.

She’s right. Ken Clarke is a lifelong Europhile. Jeremy Corbyn is a lifelong Euroskeptic. HTH.

Corbyn has not said he must be PM. He said he is the obvious choice.

Great, he can simply suggest another candidate and it can happen or if it doesn’t he will have publically done his best to make it happen.

Since he would be going in and calling it the same day I find that somewhat unlikely.

Unless I’m very much mistaken be can’t do that. Extension needs parliamentary approval, in order to call a GE he has to go through the motions of closing parliament. Calling a GE has to wait until after the extension is agreed unless its forced by a VonC then we get hard brexit.

Remember all he is saying right now is a government lasting five or so weeks which will
a)ask for an extension
b)call for a GE
c)in that GE Labour would be campaigning on the basis of a referendum.

5 weeks or so is a lot longer than an extension should require, but that aside, the only mechanism for ensuring he goes to the polls is a VonC, he can’t time limit his tenure in advance any more because of the fixed term parliament act. So it comes down to trust, trusting him to go and or trusting him not to do anything else.

Trust is one thing i assume we can all agree isn’t in great supply in the Hoc, especially of JC.

whatever Corbyn says he must want the opposite.

I don’t think that, just I don’t think he’s a fool and I do think a GE would be a foolish thing to do (especially before a 2nd ref because there’s every chance will end up with a house that doesn’t support one [so we don’t get one] after any GE even though it supported JC into power now to get one)

He said he is the obvious choice. I am certain he would agree another figure if and only if the numbers looked right.

He’s only the obvious choice to the Labour front bench, and whilst I don’t think the numbers look right for A N other they very definitely look wrong for JC.

I see the Lib Dems just announced their own shadow cabinet.

If only evil Jezza would just stop blocking Jo from leading a fantasy government with no mandate.

a fantasy government with no mandate.

We’ve currently got a government of fantasy, that depending on your opinion of where its derived from, has no mandate.

It’s unlikely anybody but a true procedural geek would argue without at least a little doubt that any government resulting from a VonC has a mandate so why not let the lib dems in on the pantomime.

(conceivably a unity government/rainbow coalition could have a very strong mandate of course by picking a representative cabinet from across the house. Never happen though.)

I see the Lib Dems just announced their own shadow cabinet.

Having followed the link they’d be a strange party that didn’t propose some form of cabinet prior to a GE.

I have never heard of the lib dems picking a shadow cabinet. They normally have spokepersons for each area of policy. this is just Swinson trying to big herself up.

Well yeah, usually it’s “the opposition” that picks the shadow cabinet, because doesn’t the shadow cabinet mean an “actual job”?

Anyway. Presumably, if there is some cross party cabinet being chosen, LD can say they have this lot all ready to go. I guess simply having a spokesperson for each area wouldn’t be ready enough for the VoNC which might or might not happen. Potentially.

Yep, shadow cabinet is an actual job, they get paid extra for it. The LDs won’t though, that’s just posturing. Pretty hilarious really given that they’ve only got 14 MPs and a good few of them are in a precarious position.

Well yeah, usually it’s “the opposition” that picks the shadow cabinet, because doesn’t the shadow cabinet mean an “actual job”?

Interesting they chose to call it a shadow cabinet rather than anything else but (maybe they’re not pretending they stand a chance of being elected to government), strictly speaking it’s not a job in the way cabinet minister is though it serves a specific purpose of mirroring the cabinet proper (spokesperson is the equivalent position in the Lords to shadow minister in the commons).

It’s certainly just for the “upcoming election” though and has rather more members than their current 12 sitting MPs.

Unless I’m very much mistaken be can’t do that. Extension needs parliamentary approval, in order to call a GE he has to go through the motions of closing parliament

if he has the support of enough then he can call it. There may be a few days delay but nothing significant. It could be scheduled in easily enough (unless Macron trying to cover up how he is screwing over anyone stupid enough to vote for him messes things up in the hope it will make him more popular).

So it comes down to trust, trusting him to go and or trusting him not to do anything else.

No trust required. They can just vote him out.
There seems to be a determined effort on the part of some to completely demonise him as some evil dictator ready to take over the world whilst, simultaneously being unable to run his own party.
It would be amusing if it wasnt letting Johnson and his disaster capitalist backers run amok.
The problem seems to be the “moderates” are worried a)about losing their own seats (Swinson who the likelihood is would get slaughter by SNP especially since chances are Labour would back off) or b)are completely incapable of accepting Corbyn for a few weeks for whatever reason. In most cases I suspect its because they realise their demonisation of him would fail in the face of him not usurping all power and setting up a dictatorship.

He said he is the obvious choice

Good latter from Corbyn to all those interested in stopping brexit to meet for discussions. No preconditions. I’ll bet that Swinson makes some grandstanding ploy

CFH – he is the leader of the second biggest party

Yep, shadow cabinet is an actual job, they get paid extra for it

Maybe by their party but as far as the Hoc salary goes it’s the same as a back bencher.

he is the leader of the second biggest party

Whilst I completely agree leader of the opposition is the obvious choice a) the irony of pointing out BJ is unelected isn’t wasted on me. B) anyone who managed to loose to May isn’t really the obvious choice to be in charge of anything.

I’ll take you up on that

Careful what you wish for, an hour in the pub with me and you might be wishing you’d voted farage in an effort to get the border twixt Scotland and England closed quicker than an snp voter can name two types of fish.

They can just vote him out.

Only if he has either already successfully sought an extension from the EU, or cancelled our exit from the EU… otherwise… time up… No Deal Brexit… no government… and an election… chaos. What if… no wait, bare with me, I’m not a hater… what if… he might not be considered by MPs to be the best person to go and talk to the EU in our current situation, given his past public distain for the EU… and also might not be someone who is universally trusted by MPs to recall our A50 notification if it comes to it.

Good latter from Corbyn to all those interested in stopping brexit to meet for discussions. No preconditions. I’ll bet that Swinson makes some grandstanding ploy.

Perhaps Swinson made the point that needs making… that others should be considered as the caretaker PM if this is going to work. Making that point before talks, rather than during or after, might well be “grandstanding”, or it might have been essential to move the Labour leadership towards a position that it needs to be in before Parliament sits… not further down the line.

he is the leader of the second biggest party

& that’ll be about as good as Labour will get whilst JC is at the wheel!