Is this going to work (chainsuck plate)?

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  • Is this going to work (chainsuck plate)?
  • reggiegasket
    Member

    frames should come with a mounting point. Simple as that.

    Even if your drivetrain is sorted, and you're careful, you can still get chainsuck occasionally when you need to drop a gear quickly and attack a climb. And when it happens it can score the frame. Over time the score can work itself into a crack and then it's goodbye frame. I lost an old Kona frame this way and I got chainsuck on Sunday which has chewed the chainstay of my 456.

    I'd say give it a go. As long as the bolt's tight it should stay put. You could roughen up the frame a bit to get more purchase, or even use araldite alongside the bolt.

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    IME chainsuck plates never work. It might protect your frame, but you'll still get the chain jamming between the plate and the chainrings.
    As our old bike shop man told us – you've just got to be a smooooth as possible with your shifting and never use worn rings and/or chain.

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    As our old bike shop man told us – you've just got to be a smooooth as possible with your shifting and never use worn rings and/or chain.

    Good point Dez, but it really isn't that simple with these 853 Inbreds….

    PJay, have you seen my reply on your other thread? ๐Ÿ™‚

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    Good point Dez, but it really isn't that simple with these 853 Inbreds….

    Dump it then ๐Ÿ˜‰

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    ….Or fix it. Properly. Like I did.
    ๐Ÿ˜€

    PJay
    Member

    As in an earlier post, I'm trying to minimise the damage to my 853 Inbred from chainsuck. It's occassional but due to the tiny amount of chainstay/ring clearance damage can marked and the chain seems to cut through the inner tube and ziptie armouring I've put on. I have an anti-chainsuck plate but the extra-wide chainstays again pose a trouble as it's hard to fit. I have got it fit with a lot of fiddling and by angling the top plate in. It's ugly (but then so's a mangled chainstay) but will it work? The other question is how tight do I do it up. It's only got a single bolt and the way the plates have to be angled it can only take one bolt. I don't want it working lose and catching the rings, or being driven into the rings should chainsuck occur but equally I don't want to damage the tubing, the plates are also sat on top of the welds for the little chainstay gussets and I don't want to damage this.

    Is there a practical way of protecting the chainstay on a bridgeless stayed Inbred, or should I stop trying and buy something else if it fails?


    ๐Ÿ™„

    stick some new good quality chainrings and a chain on there? Surely treating the casue is better than trying to mitigate the consequences?

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    stick some new good quality chainrings and a chain on there? Surely treating the casue is better than trying to mitigate the consequences?

    I'll ask one question – Do you have an 853 Inbred?

    If not (which I suspect) than you just don't understand.

    Yes yes, frames don't CAUSE chainsuck but the design of the 853 makes the consequences of the slightest suck very bad indeed. See PJay's other thread for my more lenghty explanation…. ๐Ÿ™‚

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    See PJay's other thread for my more lenghty explanation….

    I did and it looks a most sensible suggestion. The joy of steel frames eh.

    devs
    Member

    Hmmm. Frames might not cause chainsuck but the design of some makes it inevitable. This has obviously be recognised and addressed in the latest evolution; the Ragleys with their fancy fingery chainstay thing. Does the 456 tactical dent work on 853s?

    nope, it was the niche fawning of Brant that put me off, got an 853 sanderson instead.

    If it's that bad have you tried a longer BB and/or a compact/double chainset?

    Why on earth would you put up with a frame that has such chain suck issues???

    There is so much choice in the cheap steel frame market that if there is a known issue then surely it would be dropped like a hot brick.

    The modification looks gastly.

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    If it's that bad have you tried a longer BB and/or a compact/double chainset?

    Longer BB won't work as the chainline isn't very good with the right length.

    Why on earth would you put up with a frame that has such chain suck issues???

    I didn't. I fixed it properly. I contacted On One (Brant at the time) and I was offered a Scandal for ยฃ100, but I politely declined, because I didn't want a Scandal mainly.

    The 853s are fantastic bikes to ride and I love mine, but the rear end was a shockingly poor design. If someone who knows sod-all about bike design (ME!) can improve them as much as I have, what does that say about the basic design? Lack of thought and lack of testing, IMO

    I might buy another On-One because they are so cheap, but I wouldn't touch a Ragley with a barge pole. I can see shoddy design in those as well.

    Right I agree 100% with pp. And if you don't have an 853 inbred you wont quite appreciate the problem.

    I took a different approach. Nicely indented my chainstay with suitably shaped object (long socket on its side and hammer). Ditch the triple, they are way more prone to suck imho, went for 22/36, this is tightish even with the chainstay indented (I suppose 34 might have been better, but I like 36). Run an 8 speed drivetrain with 9 speed blackspire chainrings, the granny being stainless. Run a medium cage mech and a nice tight chain.

    That saw me through about 2 years with no chainsuck at all. When it did finally suck again its because the 36t chainring was fecked, as was the chain, so my own fault at that point.

    They are great frames, with superb mud clearance but at the expense of chainring clearance. A shame the back end wasn't a bit better thought through. Even knowing that I think I'd buy it again simply because it rides so well, fits me nicely, is comfortable and adaptable. However if I ever snap it I don't know if I'd bother with a new chainstay because considering it was only ยฃ250 new I have already had value out of it.

    Gratuitous drivetrainish shot

    Premier Icon Terrydactyl
    Subscriber

    FWIW,

    I had megga chain suck for a time. Always happened on the the granny ring.

    A wise man told me to change the granny from aluminium to stainless steel.

    No more problems.

    PJay
    Member

    Well, I don't have a rampant chainsuck problem, I had a few hits early on which I 'solved' with steel rings and a less gloopy lube. I hadn't had chainsuck for well over a year until yesterday, so I'm not trying to paper over the cracks here, but it is alarming how much damage can be caused with this frame designs (I don't think that it's just the 853, the bridgeless stay design seems the problem) so I'm trying to mitigate the damage when it does occur. I had chainsuck on my old DN6 Inbred occassionally but only scraped the paint, there was plenty of clearance on a 47.5 chainline (even with a 34,36,48 setup). I think too that it's not just the Inbred that suffers, there was talk of Cove Hummers having a problem (and the 2010 model has a flat plate a bit like the Ragleys) and Pace bikes too.

    Ultimately a new frame might be the way to go, as in the other thread, I like the Genesis Altitude, but for the time being I'd like the frame to last.

    I agree that sometimes chainsuck just can't be avoided. I'm convinced that my drivechain is good, the problem yesterday was ham fisted gear changing on my part. I was riding in the big ring at speed down a cycle path and had to stop suddendly to let another cyclist pass from the other direction. Rather foolishly as I slowed I tried to drop down into the middle ring so I wouldn't be stuck in too high a gear to pull away and ended up with the chain jammed. It was my fault and the other instances of 'suck have been down to bad shifting, notibly getting caught out on climbs I though I could clear in the middle ring and dropping into the granny under load (I got told of by Brant for my bad shifting on a older thread). 4 or 5 bad shifts in a few years of regular riding probably isn't too bad but sometimes we get caught out and do things wrong. I'd just like to keep the damage to a minimum when it happens.

    I'll give the plate a try as my chain seems able to cut through any protection it fit, although I did wonder about trying some P-Clips as they have a metal layer.

    I'd like a bike where I didn't have to worry about all this though.

    Premier Icon Seamus
    Subscriber

    Going to a 36/22 front ring combination, shorter chain and using a dry lube (squirt) seems to have cured most of the chainsuck issues I was having with my 853 inbred. I have thought abut the indent and med cage mech as suggested by restlessnative and will probably do this if the problem comes back. The only time I have had chainsuck since was in really claggy conditions, a jubilee clip fitted behind the middle ring stopped the chain from jamming and causing damage, it isn't pretty but is hidden behind the rings.

    Premier Icon Speshpaul
    Subscriber

    I have used 5mm thick wall rubber hose in the past. It was clear and more a rectangle shape with round corners than round. I slit the back and fitted it over the chain stay, with some thick zips. these were positioned with the heads down to catch the chain first.
    Seemed to work.

    Premier Icon Speshpaul
    Subscriber

    Oh ment to add, don't over fix the plates on. If the chain gets jammed in there you might need to take if off on the trail.

    coffeeking
    Member

    I had loads of issues with an old bike years and years ago, the plates pictured above stopped the suck causing damage but regularly fell off despite being tightened to mental amounts and having the stays covered in self-amalg tape.

    Pjay/Coffeeking – where do you get those plates from? CRC don't seem to have them, but I'm not sure what they are called. Any clues?

    PJay
    Member

    I got mine second hand off of ebay, it's a Ringle plate I think, occassionally new ones turn up. There's a Tektro one available too I think.

    I hope mine doesn't drop off!

    I've not looked at the other thread but have seen posts about the chainsuck on these frames before, be a good idea for on-one to put some chainsuck things on the driveside chainstay like the old Bontragers used to have? Remember those? Was like a couple of bottle cage bosses under the chainstay with a small adjustable plate, just on the driveside so you could still have the mud clearance. Can't be that expensive or difficult to include can it? ๐Ÿ˜•

    PJay
    Member

    I think that some sort of chainsuck plate mounting point would be great on frame, but it doesn't help my current frame so I'll just have to try the plate and see how it goes.

    Fortunately chainsuck is fairly infrequent so it might be enough to reduce damage when it does. To be fair I don't think that it's just the Inbreds that get damaged by chainsuck when it happens it happens to other frames too with tight clearance.

    PJay
    Member

    Well, it actually does seem to work! I had a spot of chainsuck today and the plate did actually seem to knock the chain off the rings and didn't twist into the rings itself – result. It still look ugly though.

    The chainsuck was, as always, my fault, I wasn't paying attention and found myself climbing in the middle ring and having to shift down under load (in fact all the incidents of chainsuck I've had seem to have been shifting related and indeed, hamfist shifting related). Anyway, I suppose that half a dozen or so 'suck in several years isn't too bad.

    I'm suprised though that these chainsuck plates aren't readily available any more, I'm sure that there's a market.

    You are only treating the effect not the cause. I'd rather get my drivetrain setup nicely so it doesn't suck. Even if I do get caught and mash mine through a gear change it doesn't suck.

    I hate triples ๐Ÿ™‚

    PJay
    Member

    Well, I reckon my drivetrain's pretty solid, like I said, there've only be a bit instances over a couple of years and I'd probably attribute all of them to bad shifting. To be honest, I doubt that any drivetrain can be guaranteed chainsuck free, and my legs definately need a granny ring!

    I do treat the cause and steel rings seem to help along with good chain maintenace and regular replacement but the tiny chainring clearance of the 853 Inbreds do need something 'just in case'.

    If you legs "definately need a granny ring" then I'd wager they don't need a big ring !

    crotchrocket
    Member

    Why not take a piece if thin plate steel (baked been can?) cut to a 5cm by 7cm rectangle. roll it into a tube & tie wrap/jubilee clip it to the chain stay. Then, when you get chain suck it chews up the old tin can rather than the chainstay?

    Trek used a similar idea on earlier carbon hardtail (9.9) frames using glue – but at the 1st sign of chainsuck the piece of ally came off the frame.
    Apparently on the 2010 remedy they've molded pieces of ally into the carbon to protect it from chipping (that may only be on the down tube tho).

    DanEvs
    Member

    I wouldn't put up with something like that, I'd flog it and buy a decent bike.

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