1) Ride within your abilities
2) Improve your abilities
3) Learn how to hit the deck without hurting yourself
4) Learn how to read the trail better

There are times I’ll push it because I know what the likely risks are. I will notice what’s around me and what the likely consequences of a crash are. I’ve been doing this for so long that I can look at my line and automatically understand what the potential crashes are and where I’ll land if they happen.

I only once crashed completely unexpectedly; that was on the Rideway where it was long flat and straight, so I was zoning out like you do on road rides. There was a 2″ sapling stump in the middle of the trail that I hadn’t even seen. I was on the deck before I knew what was going on.

If it’s at all cold enough for there to be ice at any point, I’ll back off.

I think that with modern full suspension bikes and tyres the speeds are now higher so when you fall off the impact is higher than say 10 years ago.

This is true. Try changing to a hardtail with 80mm travel 🙂

3) Learn how to hit the deck without hurting yourself

This is something I’ve heard said before, don’t you learn to roll/crash by spending most of your childhood riding and crashing skateboards and BMX, didn’t think you could learn it once out of your teens.

Take up some judo training.. great for teaching you how to fall
It’s the unexpected falls that are always going to be the worst… It’s front wheel washouts that I find leave you no time to react and more potential for collar bone, rib or wrist injury.

Get some grippier tyres and get back on it.

Roverpig:

I have said for a while now that I either need to get better at staying on – or falling off.

the outcome has been getting better at falling off. keeping arms and legs in and sliding down the trail on my shoulder/back/arse. For OTB it’s better to go with it once you’ve lost it and let your feet come right over your head and hopefully land on your side/arse etc.

But rocks are rocks.

3) Learn how to hit the deck without hurting yourself

This always gets trotted out, but my last two broken arms were so fast there was no time to react. And a couple of friends who crashed their tandem in similar style not long after maybe did react and tuck their arms in, and got matching collar bone fractures as a result. I’m not sure which is worse, but collar bones never look right afterwards do they?

didn’t think you could learn it once out of your teens.

What? You can learn anything at any time!

You just need to be quick of thought. So the moment you see the thing you’re not going to be able to avoid, you start making preparations for landing.

It’s if you don’t see it that you have a problem. If you aren’t seeing the trail then you need to get better at reading it, which comes with practice. Or you’re not concentrating 🙂

When I hit the deck, I find myself instinctively putting my arms out but not to take the impact, just to steer my fall. I always end up landing on my torso. I don’t know if this is ideal or not, but it seems to work for me apart from having grazed nipples a lot 🙂

I’m sitting here at home reading this, having broken my back in two places a couple of weeks ago – one minute I was having a pleasant winter ride, next I was eating gravel and lying in a cold stream.

It could have been an awful lot worse; as it is, I’m likely to be off work for 6 months or so, but will hopefully make a full recovery.

If/when the time comes that I’m able to ride a bike I’m going to be in a real dilemma; I love my riding, but the thought of going through this again is pretty unbearable. I understand that the risk is very low, but having experienced that very low risk makes you assess things in a different way.

I’m pretty sure everyone is convinced they have great skills and know how to crash well up until the moment they hurt themselves in an unexpected crash.

Not wanting to jinx any of the immortals, of course.

😉

BigDummy, I’m an average rider at best, who rides without taking unnecessary risks and ( shhh, don’t tell anyone) occasionally walk sections which psyche me out.
The inconvenient truth is that anyone can get caught out ; most of the time we ride our luck, occasionally it bites us.

I know the bit you mean and I think molgrips has it above, if you didn’t know you were in trouble, at least for a split second, you are riding too fast or not paying enough attention.
If when you say that you just need to commit, your interpretation of commit is go for it past the point where you are fully in control, you are doing it wrong and asking for crashes. What it should mean is knowing exactly what you are going to try and do and how and then seeing it in your head and knowing you can do it. The commit part is then simply putting the fear of crashing aside because you know you can do it, and coming in nice and loose and relaxed and doing what you planned. If, for you, it means simply go faster and it feels faster than feels comfortable, you are over-doing it.
It shouldn’t feel sketchy, or fast, even when it is, it should feel neat and in control and like there is plenty of time.
My rule is that if I look at something and I can’t picture myself doing it, I don’t. Particularly when I’m out on my own. Likewise, never take more than one practise run-up for something, if you haven’t done it by then you will be too tense and you’ll crash. Both of these work for me, I know I could be a lot quicker but I do o.k (you’ll find me on Strava for a lot of the local stuff including Kirkhill if you are curious) and much as I hesitate to ask for trouble by typing it, I hardly ever crash hard.
Much as you seem to like riding alone, hooking up with some other riders sometimes, particularly if they are quicker than you might help, you have someone to pick you up if it goes pear shaped and more importantly you have a model to watch of how, or how quick to hit things which can be a big help as sometimes the fastest way through a section is not as fast as you may think…

Unless you’re training for something turn strava/computer off (even if you are training, remember 90% of riding mountain bikes is about fun not numbers). Faster is not funner. Slow down and find all the lumps and bumps to hop off etc, do wheelies/endo turns (or try to in my case), occasional skids don’t hurt either – on the fireroads of course. Basically be juvenile. Don’t ride the scary bits if you don’t want to.

If you crash alot something is wrong with your technique. When I’m getting better and better I never crash, or even close- I’m more relaxed and my balance is way better on the bike.

Having said that, Youth, Junior and Elite riders often go through a period of frequent crashing to get into the top 10. You can have all the skills in the world but to develop and eek out a second on a run you have to push beyond your own limit.

For me its making it down a section and feeling good/enjoying the section- riding as fast as **** and laughing nervously at the bottom as that was really close just isn’t worth it if you have to drive ALOT of miles aday to work and back. Sick pay only lasts so long and heaven forbid you **** your face/jaw.

Some people actually get off on finding the limits of their ability and pushing beyond them, others get enjoyment from the same sport for different reasons.

Hey trekEx8 what did you do to your back? i broke mine over christmas, 5 transverse process fractures. fell off going slow, on easy bit of trail rolled and hit a tree/rock combo. Rolling helps but not if your luck’s out. As the wise have noted injuries just happen no matter what.

What? You can learn anything at any time!

Badly written by me, you probably can learn it I’m just not sure how practical it is. I thought crashing “well” was mostly autopilot, your body subconsciously learns how to roll from going through the motions many, many times. Going through the motions of crashing a lot when you are older and don’t bounce so well anyway whilst trying to hold down a day job to pay for your food, family, mortgage etc possibly not the most practical idea.

Actually if you could do it safely…..
maybe jedi et al could get a load of crash mats out and get middle aged IT consultants to pay to ride passed him while he pushes them off, repeatedly. Could be a new syllabus for the skills course.
🙂

Stavaigan, I’ve fractured two vertebrae, done quite a good job if it – I’m now 1cm shorter due compression of T6! Loose teeth, black eyes and so on.
Unfortunately, no matter how careful/competent/good at falling etc., if it’s going to get you, it’s going to get you.
Mine was on a bridle way that I’ve ridden many times – I honestly don’t know what happened, will have to hi back one day and see if I can work it out.
Healing vibes to you!

Badly written by me, you probably can learn it I’m just not sure how practical it is. I thought it was mosty autopilot, your body subconsciously learns how to roll from going through the motions many many times. Going through the motions of crashing a lot when you are older and don’t bounce so well anyway whilst trying to hold down a day job to pay for your food, family, mortgage etc possibly not the most practical idea.

This is why a certain level of body armour can be nice though, the good stuff (eg poc) might not stop you from snapping a limb in a nasty crash but it can reduce you chances of serious bruising, small fractures and various back injuries. At a beginners speed it will certainly help.

I know there is something to be said for the fact body armour can increase risk taking but I don’t see why mountain bikers have to be so judgemental when we see someone on the trail who is wearing say, a back protector when they aren’t deemed to be “fast enough” (even though the pro’s tend not to wear them).

Me? As soon as I can afford it I will be buying one of these and a neck brace for Glentress, Inners, Wales, Peaks etc…basically everwhere where I’m looking to have fun on the downs. I don’t see why I should just be wearing a full face on a downhill track as the speed I carry is usually the same! In reality there’s not that much difference between a rocky descent in the peaks and Fort William in terms of injury risk!

Nice to know I’m not alone. It sounds as though there are a few of us off with injuries or just returning. I’m sure those who put it all down to skill and technique make some good points. But let’s be honest; if you ride down rocky trails at any speed then sooner or later you’re going to come a cropper and hurt yourself.

I’m actually quite happy with the way I fell. I’m not sure I could have done much to anticipate the fall. The front wheel slid a bit and hit a rock. I hadn’t paid much attention to the rock as it wasn’t on my line and by the time the wheel slipped I was looking well down the trail. Maybe I should have anticipated the slide, but that’s asking a lot at that speed. Given that I went straight out the front it could easily have been a nasty faceplant so I’m pleased that I instinctively managed to roll enough to take the fall on my shoulder. Unfortunately at 49 I guess my bones don’t give as much as they used to.

Obviously the bike wasn’t at fault, but I do fit the stereotype of the middle age man with limited off-road experience on a bouncy skill compensator. I’ll see how I feel in a few weeks, but it might be worth spending some time riding the hardtail slowly down trails and working on bike handling and trail reading skills.

I hadn’t paid much attention to the rock as it wasn’t on my line and by the time the wheel slipped

You need to pay attention to it all to avoid crashing 🙂 You should be looking out for where your wheel might slip, and where it’ll go if it does.

Obviously the bike wasn’t at fault

Hmm.. not necessarily. If your weight distribution is all wrong and your contact points are in the wrong places you’ll find it a lot harder to deal with incidents. Not sure about this case of course, but I’ve had bikes that were hard to stay on until I change stem/bars etc.

Also, certain tyres can be awful in certain situations. I put mud tyres on in the winter, but there’s a certain descent in my local woods that’s got slimy polished limestone under trees, so you need something really sticky to not slip everywhere. A tyre can be generally pretty good but scary on that one section.

Or maybe something as simple as suspension setup.

No real point in switching to the hardtail to practise. Practise on the bike you’ll be pushing harder on, the technique and line choices are going to be different on the different bikes.

It sounds a bit clichéd but are you tensing up when you jettison yourself OTB?

I seem to be well renowned by my mates for going OTB, but (touch wood) I have yet to break anything of significance when doing so, granted a couple of fingers and some minor concussion isn’t ideal but it never stopped me going to work.

All fair points. I dare say that a zen like ability to be aware of every possible danger on the trail is achievable by some, but with the trails as slippery as they are, trying to keep track of all the possible places where you might slide is more than my little brain can handle 🙂

As for the bike; I was thinking about this last night. I bought the Five in September and I’m pretty sure that this is the first crash I’ve had on it. That’s part of the problem I suspect. I feel a bit unstable on the FF29 when things get tricky and have put it down a few times. Bit never at any speed. The Five just seems so stable that I was starting to feel invincible, which is usually a recipe for disaster.

I’m also trying to work out whether turning the rebound damping on the forks right down earlier in the ride might have been a contributing factor, but that’s a long shot.

By the way, I’d never look down on anybody for wearing whatever protective gear they need to feel comfortable. But I ride as much for exercise as anything and like to give it some on the climbs, so any decent armour is going to be too hot I fear.

Too much rebound damping means the forks pack down and don’t extend, so at a given point your weight may be too far forward, your HA too steep, which can encourage you over the bars.

Hard to say if that was a factor in your crash though.

The Five just seems so stable that I was starting to feel invincible, which is usually a recipe for disaster.

Sounds like it!

You need to pay attention to it all to avoid crashing You should be looking out for where your wheel might slip, and where it’ll go if it does.

Way to encourage him to look 5 feet in front of his wheel. Don’t look at trail obstacles, ever. Let your peirpheral vision do the work and look as far down the track as you can. You should be able to do things like hitting rocks/roots at a good angle without paying attention to it.

Sod thinking about where your wheel might slip when riding, you shouldn’t be conciously thinking at all. Doing that and looking for trail obstacles is going to have you impacting a tree in no time. It’s all just a feeling, which you develop with practice and repetition.

I’d reduced the damping (so it came back more quickly) precisely because it seemed to be packing down a bit on faster lumpy sections. It may have been a factor in the front wheel sliding in the first place, but probably not.

I don’t see why mountain bikers have to be so judgemental

despite almost never wearing protection (besides helmet) in the past I started using knee pads when this winter started, figured they’d keep my knees warm and protect them from crahses, result: no crashes but knees repeatedly getting very sweaty then super chilled by the wind. Each to their own, you wanna wear armour; go for it, I may inwardly chuckle* when I see stormtroopers on local “easy” runs but won’t take the piss out of them, for me the discomfort of body armour is a big downside vs the very few times I do actually crash but I can’t see me ever wearing a full facer unless I moved next door to fort william. If you crash a lot body armour is probably a very good idea, for a lot of riders it could be more trouble than it’s worth.

You should be looking out for where your wheel might slip, and where it’ll go if it does.

I though the adice was look where you want to go not where you may end up, isn’t your peripheral vision supposed to take this in and keep it handy incase of emergency? you focus on a part of the trail and that’s where you front wheel ends up. (I’m no expert but IIRC that’s what the literature says and my limited experience concurs)

No real point in switching to the hardtail to practise

There is a train of thought that says HT ride so differently from FS that it’s not good for practice, but when I suggested moving to less suspension or rigid it wasn’t so much for “practice” it was more a permanent thing, less sus is generally conducive to slower speeds and maybe less painful crashes, dunno whether roverpig was thinking of it for practice or permanent.

*as in my first reaction would be to laugh but then I’d consider other people have less understanding bosses and a greater propensity for hurting themselves so once I’d thought about it would prefer not to pass judgement.

Way to encourage him to look 5 feet in front of his wheel.

I’m not! You look at it when it’s down the trail, so you know it’s there when you ride over it.

It’s all just a feeling, which you develop with practice and repetition.

That’s what I meant. I don’t consciously think about it, but if I think about what I’m thinking about I realise I am thinking about it all the time. And when I predict something, and it happens, I feel all smug and confident 🙂

Generally, when I said ‘look out for’ I didn’t mean ‘look AT’. You have to take it all in in one go when moving quickly which is what they are saying about peripheral vision.

Practice, and lots is the only way as they say up there. How long have you been MTBing OP?

You should be able to do things like hitting rocks/roots at a good angle without paying attention to it.

Summs it up really. Improvisation, which only comes with experience and practice.

People always says speed is your friend. Thats balls, its more about having the right momentum to pass through stuff. You don’t have to be going fast to have enough momentum.

Everyone comes off now and then. Being flexible and strong (weight training) plus wearing protective gear is all you can do to minimise injuries.

Get well soon, hope you nail that section one day.

Edit; Are you carrying the right gear (namely a down jacket and a bothy) so that if you go down miles from the car and cant move you wont freeze to death?

the risks you are prepared to take is a personal matter.
sometimes you are lucky and others not, its the same for everyone.

as someone else mentioned, doing other types of activity that keep you strong,flexible and keeps your reactions sharp is a good move. this way when it does hit the fan you are best able to react and your body more able to take the impacts.

finding the eject button and knowing when to use it can help too!

and beware the last run of the day/hit it one last time trap.

a crash is always a possibility, it’s just the way it is.

ride smart. have fun. 🙂

as someone else mentioned, doing other types of activity that keep you strong,flexible and keeps your reactions sharp is a good move

I found playing Wip3out on the PS was a great help 🙂

There is a train of thought that says HT ride so differently from FS that it’s not good for practice, but when I suggested moving to less suspension or rigid it wasn’t so much for “practice” it was more a permanent thing, less sus is generally conducive to slower speeds and maybe less painful crashes, dunno whether roverpig was thinking of it for practice or permanent.

It’s something (i.e. a permanent or semi-permanent move) that I’m certainly considering. Something that inspires less confidence at speed could actually be safer. Something to ponder at least and I’ve got plenty of time for pondering 🙂

Well I’m recovering from a bruised arse and a badly wrenched back (the painful bit!) from completely overcooking a manual at Parkwood Springs (the shame of it!), and dumping myself onto my fundament at 20mph.

The rule of thumb, is that it’s always the stupid ones that do the most damage. Stuff like that above, “taking it easy” – that cost me a broken wrist on my first run of an Alpine holiday. If I’d been riding flat out, I’d have jumped the root that had me off. As it was I was bimbling, which meant I wasn’t fully focussed on what I’m doing.

And that I think is the key. Focus. Commit everything, mentally and physically to the process of riding the bike. You’re less likely to make mistakes when you’re absolutely on it, and you’ll spot them earlier, when you’re concentrating on your riding, than being distracted by the pretty view, or the big scary rock off to the side of the trail. Night riding is a good example – there’s nothing to see apart from the bit your lights illuminate, so you can clear stuff that you then can’t do in the day time. Too much extraneous information distracting you from what you should be concentrating on.

My other half (who rides a lot slower/more carefully than me) often gets to the bottom of something and says “did you see XYZ?” or “where does that other trail go?”, and I’m completely at a loss. All I’ve been aware of is the volume of space needed to get me & the bike down the hill – anything else is extraneous.

And to you trek. No nerve damage I hope.

Very interesting thread.

I was knocked off my SS commuter last May whilst riding in a cycle lane on a pavement. A car turned across me and I ended up going over his bonnet and damaged my neck, knee and hand enough to be off the bike until November.

3 weeks before Christmas I slipped on a step at work and landed on the edge of the lower step and ended up wrecking my ‘good’ knee.

My wife thinks I should stop commuting on the bike and taking so many ‘risks’! I’ve ridden a bike since I was 10 and only ever been off for any time due to big injuries or serious illness. There is risk in commuting and night riding with a bunch of middle aged competitive guys but it’s what I do and it’s what I hope I can always do (just a bit slower as I get even older)!

The risk is part of the fun but when it feels like the risk is too big for the fun then it’s time to slow down or take up knitting.

All just IMHO of course.

despite almost never wearing protection (besides helmet) in the past I started using knee pads when this winter started, figured they’d keep my knees warm and protect them from crahses, result: no crashes but knees repeatedly getting very sweaty then super chilled by the wind. Each to their own, you wanna wear armour; go for it, I may inwardly chuckle* when I see stormtroopers on local “easy” runs but won’t take the piss out of them, for me the discomfort of body armour is a big downside vs the very few times I do actually crash but I can’t see me ever wearing a full facer unless I moved next door to fort william. If you crash a lot body armour is probably a very good idea, for a lot of riders it could be more trouble than it’s worth.

How many people do you see wearing full faces when pootling along b-roads on a scooter/moped/125cc motorbike. How many motorcross guys doss around in a field doing easy stuff without their helmet?

The only thing that has stopped me wearing a full face when trail riding is the heat, if that new Met Parachute is coolish I’ll be wearing it most of the time. The whole “helmets are uncool” is rather strange from someone with a motorsports perspective/background as downhilling/enduro seems just as dangerous.

Stavaigan, thanks, early days. I’m in a brace for 3 months, but hopefully all will be ok in the end; having seen the X-rays and MRI, it could have been a lot worse.
Have you got any lasting effects?

I don’t crash much, it may be luck, I like to think it’s prudence and riding within my abilities (which I know a lot of folk consider lame!)

A couple of others have repeated this post. That pretty much sums me up too. There are many things that make up a good ride for me, and getting home in one piece is top of the list. I ride within my limits and don’t care if I’m considered slow on the descents – I make up for that on the uphill sections 😉

I did go through a period of having several low speed OTB incidents on Stanage Causeway and it really did my confidence in. Getting a bit of coaching from Ed Oxley helped, but getting off and walking that short section was probably the main reason for stopping crashing there.

Maybe you just need to get some confidence back, and some coaching could help there. Good luck with your recovery, and hopefully you’ll be back on your bike before too long.

I appreciate that if you’ve seen last year’s evidence of some very poor decision making and bad riding I may not be someone to listen to…

Anyway MTBing is potentially very dangerous but then again so is driving a car or crossing the road – it just comes down to risk mitigation. I think the most important thing is to be self-aware in the sense of knowing how well you’re riding at a given time – concentration, fitness, confidence, etc. The last thing you want to do is push your limits when you’re tired (see paragraph 1!)

If you’re focused and you know what you can do (and what you’re confident to do) and don’t cross the fun-fear line then I think you’re as safe as you can hope to be. The problem is the random factor, from wet/icy roots in the winter to loose rocks that have been knocked into the main line in the summer.

I think there’s an awful lot to be said for riding a bike that looks after you to a degree – in other words, stickier bigger tyres, good suspension and slacker angles and a riding position that lets you get your bodyweight low when descending. The problem is that getting your bodyweight low requires good flexibility and core strength and that’s something most of us are lacking.

And when we get scared we tend to stand tall and straighten our arms to get away from the scary things in front of us, when we should actually be dropping our hips down and slightly back, trunk practically horizontal and attacking things with that almost chin to stem position you see pro DHers in when they’re on the steeps.

Smack your front wheel into a rock when you’re standing tall and stiff and your weight comes off your feet and into your hands and into the front wheel and rock, bike stops dead and your momentum takes you over the bars. Do the same when you’re in a low and loose position and your weight stays in your feet and your front wheel is light enough to climb over the rock. Swap the random rock for a random greasy root: Tall and stiff and when your front wheel steps out your straight arms pull on the bars, unweighting the front tyre so you lose even more grip and down you go. Low and loose and when your front wheel steps out your arms can softly extend and let it go to find the next bit of grip and all is well.

My problems are both having the fitness to keep low when I need to and remembering to do it when I’m not in the zone. But I always seem to ride better when I get down!

Same age as you OP and similar situation. 2 big crashes, both ambulance trips 8 weeks apart for me. Knocked out both times. First on Mtb and second on track. First one was OTB into a rock, messy face, broken nose, degloved chin, lots of surgery. Second was 3 weeks ago today, 2 guys in front of me on track touched wheels and took us all down – burnt face, whiplash.

I’ve been out on cx bike with kids but really not feeling like getting back on boards for a bit.

I had been back out on mtb before the second one and was gradually getting confidence back…..

I always feel like this after a big crash which luckily I haven’t had for ages. The fact that I keep coming back to it and pushing my limits further shows that yes, it is worth it! For me anyway, ymmv.

I always start off slow saying xc only but I soon end up riding dh again.

The last thing you want to do is push your limits when you’re tired

I did that one last year.
On the third consecutive day of Welsh trail centres I clipped my bar on a rock wall to my right on the original Coed Y Brenin trail. The bike went skew-whiff and I did a Superman, luckily somehow landing on some bracken between ugly mother boulders.
The usual bruised & grazed knees, dents to the bike and had to straighten the bars to carry on.
Fair souvenirs of a great long weekend but it could have been so much worse.

It was a basic error caused by fatigue but good luck over-riding bad luck spared me. Again.