My problem is rooted in I dont like cheap components, which are usually found on most E bikes u to about £3k, so bang for buck I’m always looking to get something with decent shocks, decent brakes,drivetrain etc(SLX,XT) which is usually about the £4 1/2K range.
Problem is i need a bike to get about on, as I cant drive, so all shopping trips or trips into the city center for a walk about or pottering further afield are dont on a bike.
Health isnt as good and has dropped considerably due to lockdown, I am I know a shadow of my former self, despite only being 53, so Ebikes for me at least would be a great help.
But pottering off to get the weeks shopping requires panniers and a rack, which arent really suited to a high end sus, better suited to an HT, plus the wear factor on sus bits.
Something cheap to get shopping on is just plainly shit components that will not last someone who rides all the time as their main form of transportation, but ride and adapt a sus or high end ebike, I’d always be worrying about it locked up in the city center.
It was suggested by dear old Mum that I should maybe get 2 ebikes. something suited for shopping and something more suited to longer jaunts, maybe offroad or at least trails and tracks.
.
Maybe a step too far but i dont know. I see the sense in it, but being a frugal Scot, such an outlay is well quite a lot.
.
Took a wander into Pure bikes in Glasgow city the other day, knowing how that was likely to go having spoken to them on the phone. Their take was a sus bike is offroad only and unsuitable for a rack,panniers etc etc, and were trying to point me towards a £3k HT. Plus im dealing with a guy who is barely out his teens and ive likely been cycling and building and servicing my own kit for longer than he’s been alive, which is not easy to convey without sounding like a moany old fart 😆 I know way more that he does, not only about bikes but about my needs, and grates a bit for them to try to tell me something i already know and feel is not an issue.

So get two 😕 something cheap, of which ill swop out drivetrain/brakes, maybe forks from the stash/other bikes to more akin to my needs and something high end or at least with higher quality of components i know will last the pace, or just a single quality sus and convention be damned I’ll jury rig a rack on it somehow.

Absolutely, there’s folk on here with loads of bikes, others with more cars than family members, go for it.

Rather than shoehorn the ebike into a utility bike, why not get a cheapish bike that’ll suit, and get a Tongsheng or similar conversion? You’ll end up with a much betetr bike, most cheaper hybrid ebikes seem a bit shit tbh.

How far is it to the shops? I appreciate the shopping will be heavy on the way back but surely you’re not riding miles. I can see the point of ebikes in some situations but is a shopping bike a good excuse unless you’re really in need. One of those cargo bikes might be better just so the load is easier to carry.

PS – I got a cheap trailer for shopping last year, it’s brilliant, can take 3 proper big filled bag for life bags, no worries.

Yes. Plenty of people own several cars.
Trail bike and a town bike makes perfect sense.
I think everyone should have a town bike, either cargo bike or a semi skimmed utility bike with panniers etc. They could replace a huge number of “second cars”

Why not see if you can get your town bike with the same battery/motor as your trail bike, so you can interchange the batteries should you ever have a problem.

Nicolai do their G1 EBoxx with a touring setup, it’s basically an electric enduro bike with panniers and mudguards.

couldn’t you stick a beam rack on basically any bike? it wouldn’t be quite as good, for sure, but it would be a whole load cheaper.

I’m not sure I’d want to be leaving £4k of bike locked up outside sainsburys on a regular basis though

If you want a bike to go to the shops with, why get an MTB?

https://downtown-ebike.com/en/the-best-cargo-bike-review/

I have 2 ebikes, both Merida full sus, one setup for enduro, the other with 29″ XC wheels, mudguards, pannier and wired lights for commuting. It’s great.

I did think about it for a hardtail version of my ebike (giant), so i’d have two batteries and two motors (and other spares) in the event of an issue on the enduro ebike or so on, i wouldn’t like having two different systems though.

I didn’t in the end, was really just due to C2W making it pretty attractive at the time, but i’m not really a fan of our C2W scheme so didn’t do it.

Check out the Tern GSD, what an ace bike

I have an electrified Surly Big Dummy and it’s my most regularly used bike at the moment. Gets used for the school run and quick local errands. Still have other bikes for other uses but an electric cargo bike is a serious car replacement option depending on where you live

Only if it is so that your personal protection officer (and brief case) can ride as well rather than following along in the Jag

It all depends. Do you want to keep fit as well? Or is the ebike a kind of submission? I have injuries and pains at mid-fifties which limit my biking from that it used to be but I’m still happy to to grab my old tourer, big panniers the or Dutch Utility Bike (before the latter rusted and now lays in pieces awaiting refurb 🤕) and do all grocery shops (variously 1, 6, and 20+ mile round trips with no motor just the old legs. Bragging rights I also live halfway up a sizeable hill so the loaded return is always a climb.

That said, would I swap my non-electric Dutch/utility bike for a similar utility/town/cargo ebike if I could afford it? Yes! Luxury, also would help with injury/rehab. ymmv.

*I’d also keep my old tourer though as it’s just so nice to ride. I do go grocery shopping more frequently (buy less each visit) than required – just to be able to enjoy riding/the bike. It’s a super-tourist frameset it carries a big load perfectly. Suited my tightwad budget too as only cost me £85 (albeit with a 300 mile round trip/mini break!) including both curly bars and tourist bars (which I change as whim dictates) I’d happily pay £300 if I had need for another in such good nic. Hoping that I never do, as it’s a solid keeper.

So in short my recommendation is find a simple low cost easily maintained bike that carries stuff easily. Town bike for towns, utility or tourer for mixed?

Pictured on the way to a weekly shop (6 miles – supermarket, 2 x 50+l panniers):

“Others have more cars than family members – go for it”.

…well, considering half of cars’ carbon emissions are baked-in at build, I’d say it’s highly irresponsible.

With the rare earth mining for batteries and electricity use they’re orders of magnitude less environmentally friendly than a normal cycle. But whatevz.

🙂

There’s no way I’d take a nice eMTB to the shops unless I could lock it in a bank vault whilst I was away from it.

last night on the way back from buying (completely unnecessary*) beer and Pringles (stowed in Camelbak) so 12 miles round trip, over big hill including approx 2 miles of track/bridleway:

*Actually, although it was more about the ride/bike than the beer and snax (say 70:30 split) it was the combo that got me off my arse and riding 🚴‍♂️🤩

More workaday boring grocery trips I’d normally just hop on the Dutch bike and go. Stepthru frame, big stand, long wheelbase, high visibility/posture, locks, dynamo, hub gears, chainguard, wear any clothes, etc.

Also no-one would really nick it even if it wasn’t locked as it looks completely boring/mental to most Brits It also carries stupid heavy amounts if required. It replaced my Kona Ute which I found to be a noodly 29er with a silly top-heavy load-style, and no useful extras even for the daft price I paid. *Edit not to upset Kona Ute owners, that was just my experience and requirements, ymmv. I in the end very surprised at the difference in both cost, ride quality and accessories of the Dutch bike. Unsurprising really as they’ve been at it for a long time now.

2 eBikes is fine, but based on what yopu’ve written, I think you want 1 proper MTB and 1 town/cargo bike. Very different uses and so very different needs.

Look at something like a Kona Ute.

Yer mum is right, get 2.
I have an old beater Halfords ebike from about 5 years ago that cost me about £900 for work and pootling around on which has been ridiculously reliable
I also have a £10k kenevo for shredding bikeparks on.
Both very different purposes.

“Others have more cars than family members – go for it”.

…well, considering half of cars’ carbon emissions are baked-in at build, I’d say it’s highly irresponsible.

With the rare earth mining for batteries and electricity use they’re orders of magnitude less environmentally friendly than a normal cycle. But whatevz.

🙂

There’s a motorbike thread, go pester them as well, bet ye don’t. I only know one motorcyclist who uses it as his only source of transport, every other one is a toy.

The fact that half a cars emissions are baked in at build, and considering they can them burn 200 thousand miles worth of fossil fuels, tells you just how bad the build is then eh?.

I’d second the ‘find a good normal utility/ commuter bike and add a kit’. I have a specialized Sirrus X2 with a bafang kit on it. Brilliant bike, disc brakes, 1x transmition and I’ve added a rear rack and full guards. The bafang bb drive makes it a car replacer, local shopping trips, family visits and commute to work. Even if I’ve got no energy from work or riding, it gets a run out.

Cost £1200 for the lot, with the added bonus that adds it’s a conversion it doesn’t look quite as appealing locked up outside the supermarket😂

Have a look for a Trek Conduit ebike. They are a few years old and were sold off at 50% by Rutland cycles. Shimano steps motors with deore groupset. Full mudguards and built in lights.
I bought one and it’s been good. They crop up on eBay now and then and are still sensible priced even with Covid tax applies as they were bought cheap to begin with.

We have 2. 1x fs and 1x ht.
I use either, my wife only uses the ht, which is fitted with rack and sidestand.
Because of the extra weight of an ebike, fully loaded panniers have little effect on handling. Also, the weight of things like a decent lock and permanent lights just doesn’t matter.
I’d be tempted to try a trailer, if the fs bike you’re considering is up to pulling one, but shopping and mtb are very different disciplines.

Can’t be a frugal Scot if you are after high-end kit…you are just someone who knows what they like but hates paying full price!
This is a standard question irrespective of ebike or not…can anyone justify more than 1 bike given you can only ride 1 at a time?
Plenty people do (and most have really daft reasons compared to your one – which seems perfectly sensible) so I’d suggest you go for it – find suitably specced bikes, make the purchases and get stuck in to using them and reaping the benefits.

Different situation to OP, but I have 2 ebikes, use them both loads, an MTB (Spesh Levo SL) and a road bike (Spesh Creo). I also have regular bikes, so this week on holiday in Argyll I have my gravel bike ( Fugio 30) with me for daily jaunts.

My ebikes are additive to my fitness and are also a good workaround for a heart condition where I ought to keep out of threshold zone as much as I can.

Get two, I’ve got a whyte e150 with 170mm forks and setup for…mountain biking. Using it to commute is pointless as it wears the tyres quick and the components aren’t cheap. So I thought about a hybrid or town bike etc but I like the mtb riding position and feel. I bought a turbo Levo HT. 2/3 the power of the whyte and battery the same. I threw away the standard forks and put in some much better rockshox and fitted a basic suspension post. With fast rolling tyres at a higher pressure it has a longer range than the whyte despite the smaller battery, it also rolls forever. I’ve got mudguards ready for winter and may consider a rack at some point. The HT is £2500 new from specialized so not the most expensive ebike. Well worth a look 👍

Given the atrocities Hitler justified, you shouldn’t have any problems justifying two e-bikes 😉

Do whatever you want.
If it’s easier for you I can’t see any reason to even care what anyone else thinks. A lot of people on here think you’re the devil for owning just one. Go for it.

A lot of people on here think you’re the devil for owning just one.

A strawbike argument? 😉

Saw a lady in Brighton with an electric Kona Ute, two (not small) kids on the board, it looked frikin ace.
Also, Deore level Stuff is heavier but no Less hard wearing, perfect for ebikes.

Thought of using a trailer? I use one for utility riding when I need to carry heavier stuff

I have an Orbea Katu. It’s a wee 20″ wheel stepthrough with a frame basket on the front.
It came with a bafang front hub motor and was £900 new

I put a rack on the back with some panniers.

Great for shopping!

I also have a full sus enduro thing with a Shimano Steps motor

I’m not at all clear who you need to “justify” this to. But if you need two different bikes, need or want them both to be assisted and can afford the cost it’s surely your business and nobody else’s.

Instead of the usual N+1 to determine how many bikes you need, I believe the correct formula is N+e

Try and address all and sundry…

How far is it to the shops?

3/4 distances ranging from 50 or so meters to a couple of miles. I’ve tendonitis as well as leg and arterial issues and its actually less painful to bike 50m that walk it.

a cheap trailer for shopping last year,

Dont think id get on with a trailer. My routes are more ‘as the crow flies’ so i cross pavements, nip around here, along that etc, and I think a trailer would impede me more that it helps.

Why not see if you can get your town bike with the same battery/motor as your trail bike

That would be an ideal. I’ll certainly look to achieving it if the funds allow. In fact it would be idea.

Nicolai

😆 Nice indeed, but I fear such a bike is a bit outside my price range and maybe a bit too high end to leave anywhere.

couldn’t you stick a beam rack on basically any bike

Theres a problem with beam racks hitting the tyre when the sus is under compression, I’m a rack pack fan, nice unobtrusive type of pannier and took a look on YT about current set ups where it was pointed out the sus/beam present(or can) some problems. Ideally a rack, set to wards the rear so as not to interfere is the best option.

Cargo Bikes

As in the front pack ones.
I’ve had a test ride on the R&M packster 40, which is the shortest but found a couple of reasons I wouldnt get on with it. One is my big feet, impacting on the frame, the other was routes and such and also felt it was just too different for me to get used to. I fear id have some sort of accident.

@GeForceJunky
Yeah, thats kind of what im after, though maybe not enduro, more probably a trail bike or sorts, or more capable trail bike, better bits, maybe something between the two 😕
I havent looked at Merida(looked at some dozen or so companies) I’ll take a look and see what they have. Ta 🙂

Check out the Tern GSD

I’m 6’3″. Tern and many of that ilk are one size supposedly fits all, but we all know it doesnt and it doesnt work like that. You need comparative frame sizes for a better fit and the likes of tern are operating on the average height of the population, rather than something suitable for all. 4’11”- 6’5″ is a bit of a stretch, especially as im towards to larger end.

I have an electrified Surly Big Dummy

I take it thats an add on kit. Thier ‘Big easy’ is a nice bike, and looks ideal and is a range of sizes. Bloke over on retrobikes being riding one SS for years, and he’s very praiseworthy of it. The big easy would probably be the only bike id need(with an extra battery for bike trial/packing range) I certainly do like it, but alas it doesnt seem to be available in the UK, at least not when i researched it looking for one. Maybe now via some London shop, but that said id prefer if i could get an ebike from somewhere localish, at least for ease of warranty issues.

t all depends. Do you want to keep fit as well? Or is the ebike a kind of submission?

I dont think for a second an ebike is an easy or even easier option thats going to impact on your fitness. I’ve watched many a YT vid and you can hear the riders breathing is laboured. Some seem to suggest its easy, but given these reactions its clear it isnt.

Dutch utility bikes 😕 not nice to look at 😆 no, fraid its something more akin to the type we normally ride than these continental shapes.
I see drop bars in your pic – Thats me out 😉 😆

There’s no way I’d take a nice eMTB to the shops unless I could lock it in a bank vault whilst I was away from it.

Im in Glasgow, but a nice parrt, and i use strong locks and iuts never out of sight of a cctv camera or major thoroughfare. I dont think in daily use, for the short time im away from it it would present any problems.

Batavus 19611

That truly is hideous 😆 Maybe something my mother or sister would have ridden in the 70’s. Not my style at all….hold on…think im going to throw up…. 😆

Kona Ute.

Again like the big easy, i think thats the type of shopper/maybe bike packer id be happy to own and ride. I’ve tried and couldnt get on with the front cargo set up, but the ute and easy are more akin to the type were all used to so i reckon they would be easier to adapt to. deffo 2 of the many rise above the masses for cargo styling.

There’s a motorbike thread

I know its not directed at me, but ive also looked towards doing bike test and lessons, and think finances wise it would be cheaper going this route. But without aggravating bikers, i think the motorbike option, for me at least would be the dangerous option. I have ridden them and as a pillion too on 1100/1200 at high speed. But maybe not for me.

I’d second the ‘find a good normal utility/ commuter bike and add a kit’.

TBH i want to avoid that route, as much as possible really. Even taking my normal rider and electrifying that i dont feel is an option. The idea of finding two i like, and being able to use the batteries on either I feel is a better option.
Probably Bosch, as they seem to have the best reputation.

Have a look for a Trek Conduit ebike. They are a few years old and were sold off at 50% by Rutland cycles. Shimano steps motors with deore groupset. Full mudguards and built in lights.

It looks an ok bike, best suited for town jaunts and shopping trips. Never really been a Trek fan, but I’ve taken a look at their basic District 1 and ill put that on the list as a possible.
Cheers 🙂

I’d be tempted to try a trailer, if the fs bike you’re considering is up to pulling one, but shopping and mtb are very different disciplines.

Yeah i understand all that, but i dont think a trailer is for me, but maybe thats just lack of experience. Maybe if my set safe routes were all roadway it would be an option, but until that day comes i think i best disclude it as an option. I think though most ebikes would have no probs pulling a trailer, especially the cargo or cargo/shop types with the larger overall weight spec

Can’t be a frugal Scot if you are after high-end kit…you are just someone who knows what they like but hates paying full price!

Yes, but also no.
There is a saying – Buy cheap..Buy twice and it very much goes for things in constant use. Buy a cheap option and its rust city, its parts not up to daily abuse or even daily use for that matter. I could buy a £800 ebike, but every part of it including the motor, the battery will not be fit for my use and all other parts will as they do present problems as time goes on. I dont want to be constantly trying to maintain something like that. I’ve seen enough cheap bikes coming though the different bike charities ive worked with and servicing cheap is just a pain int he 4r5e. For years ebay was awash with low end shopping channel ebikes that have fallen apart.
A frugal Scot thinks about more than price 😉
I ride Hope brakes, Hope wheels and usually XT kit, have done for the last 20 years. I’ve found the outlay is high, but all have a long in use life expectancy and when it does come to servicing, the job and replacements are easy and not difficult to do. These are parts you can rely upon, and you need to be able to to have confidence in the bike and its capabilities.
“Full Price” Who would to full price if you can get the same for cheaper. frugality isnt only the cheapest option to any given purchase, theres more to the equation that that.

Given the atrocities Hitler justified, you shouldn’t have any problems justifying two e-bikes

Would Hitler have had an Ebike. He was a veggie lover, so maybe he’d be on here as art of the anti e bike brigade 😆
I think the lesson is always be wary of vegetarians and vegans, especially if they have an interest in art 😉

Do whatever you want.
If it’s easier for you I can’t see any reason to even care what anyone else thinks.

Its easier to settle things in your mind if the replies are agreeable. Its a big outlay.
The truth of it is 2 bikes are an extravagance, and to be wholly honest a single bike would probably do me just as well for the riding i do. I wouldnt say this is mid life crisis, ive been through that, but it does suggest that it is a luxury option.

A lot of people on here think you’re the devil for owning just one

I laugh long and loud at such nonsense.

Also, Deore level Stuff is heavier but no Less hard wearing

It used to be LX. Years ago i saw a quote from Shimano describing the differences in LX,XT and XTR. XT is light and strong. XTR is lighter than XT but doesnt have the longevity, and LX is heavier than XT but will last the longest. Kona Ute. Again, a bike option for the shopper, but alas its too expensive as an option for getting two bikes.

Also, Deore level Stuff is heavier but no Less hard wearing

Currently that style isnt an option. Im more loooking to have two that share the same battery and motor. Plus buying something prebuilt with hub motor is pretty much adding on the makers cost for something i could reproduce myself for cheaper. If i eventually find that a wheel morot is a must option, id build it myself. LAst thing i was is a poor quality frame and component set with an add on wheel motor. I feel thewres no poiont paying extra for cheap crud. Course makers need to sell to survive, but im not paying a premium for components i know arent worth buying, at any price.

I’m not at all clear who you need to “justify” this to. But if you need two different bikes, need or want them both to be assisted and can afford the cost it’s surely your business and nobody else’s.

Again, im not justiofying it im getting answers to the thought of owning two. Plus owning two is quite an extravagance.
Sure its my business, but if nobody sought other opinions this forum wouldnt exist, and neighter would any other. Humans need to talk and discuss idea, to use others as a sounding board to reflect back their own hopes,fears or ideas.

Instead of the usual N+1 to determine how many bikes you need, I believe the correct formula is N+e

I think here that sould be N+1+e+1

If i havent answered you directly. Thanks for your imput. All thought on the matter have been taken on board and will be thought about at great length along witht he new direction of finding a cheap shopper that fits my requirements, both level of component wise, battery and motor compatibility wise and costs.
Cheers all, its been real 😉 😀

These guys do an eCargo bike that’s not daft money. I think they’ve sorted out the brexit delivery situation.

https://radpowerbikes.eu/products/radmission-electric-metro-bike

3000 word reply when you could have said

“You’re all wrong”

Funny stuff, you’ve made up your mind already as to what you’re getting. Why you are what anyone else thinks is beyond me

I have two ebikes – a full susser for the trails, and a hardtail for local road and bridleway riding. Can I justify it? Yes, they both have a purpose, and they’re both fun.

Funny stuff, you’ve made up your mind already as to what you’re getting. Why you are what anyone else thinks is beyond me

???

Hardly. Troll elsewhere buddy eh ?.

I was skeptical as to two bikes, but from the answers on here im seriously considering it and have spent the last day looking for something I previously didnt even contemplate.
I’ve an upper limit of £6K and was hoping if a single do it all bike presented itself I could spend the remainder on something like a 14″ or 16″ bandsaw(£1200) and a better suited dust extractor(£700).
As it is Im thinking 2 bikes would probably suit me better.

3000 words blah blah whine witter etc etc

I’m trying to reply to all 30 odd replies, out of courtesy. Sorry if i talk too much for you but as you didnt even bother your 4r5e to rely on here and have only come in for a whine, your comments are neither needed nor wanted. As above Weeksy go troll another thread.

Thanks to the others, especially in the areas of joint bosch systems. I’m taking a look at what can only be described as a pretty horrific looking Raleigh on helfrauds that used bosch, the felix+. I just need to research that to see if their outboard battery is the type that could be used in conjunction with an internal battery system.
Im not sure as yet if all of the outboard Bosch batteries are the same interface systems. A bitt of research to do there on the Raleigh site and boschs.
Food for thought 8)

Adds – Carrera crossfire seems to be the same system stylings a bit nicer.

How about an elephant bike (or other ex post office and rebuild it yourself), with an e-kit added.
Sounds like it could tick the compact cargo bike box for a budget friendly cost.