I swapped my drops out for some Geoff bars (Jones bars) and really like them. (although I am considering trying drops again for the summer, just to confirm that I don’t like them)

@dai3015 – looks like you’ve got the loop bars horizontal. Try angling them down towards the rear by about 10deg, Jones recommend between 10 & 15 degrees. IME it takes a bit of trial and error to find what works best for you.

That instructables thing is definitely dangerous, but for mixed riding the basic concept is sound: a narrow-low position and a wide-high one, with access to brakes from both.

At the moment there are all sorts of bars being made, but they are all constrained by having either mtb or road controls, neither of which are suited to a narrow-low, wide-high set-up.

@Whitestone – many thanks, I’ll have a look at altering them a touch. They feel comfortable at the minute but I’ll see if a minor alteration makes them feel any better

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/handlebars/jtek-superlight-drop-bar-bar-ends-black/?geoc=US&fbclid=IwAR0xvz7TS7VJ6bHH1wnIhlqexyBxUKBz3qzD63Y2iiToJZYbtzlllQsCF08

Swinley is hardly a great example of a technical trail, is it. I took my Vagabond around there – I wouldn’t do that around a Welsh or Scottish trail centre.

It’s technical if you go fast, as I’ve always said. The Salsa is probably my fastest bike round there. And I’ve also taken it to Welsh trail centres. Point I’m trying to make is that in smooth places the bike is as fast as any MTB off road even when it’s twisty turny. In my opinion flat bars are much better for twisty turny stuff because your weight is less over the front. At least, compared to my drop bar bikes.

Swinley is hardly a great example of a technical trail, is it. I took my Vagabond around there – I wouldn’t do that around a Welsh or Scottish trail centre.

I think you missed the point I was making, they’re fundamentally unsuited to Swinley, even for a riding god like me neither my CX bike nor my Vagabond are particularly quick on the trails themselves. Given enough fire road and climbing it’s probably possible to set an alright lap time, but it’s a challenge rather than fun.

And in an effort to defend Swinely, the red and blue are no more or less technical than any other trail center, you just have to ride quite a lot of Stickler in between them. Red 15/deerstalker/25, and the latter half of the blue are fairly rough and with plenty of big jumps thrown in, you just have to ride a lot of things like Stickler, Tank Traps and Seagull to get to them (which are fun in their own ways, but maybe don’t justify being Blue / Red as individual sections. As Molgrips alluded to, what it lacks in elevation available IMO they’ve made up for in features that either reward fitness (stickler) or technique (the last 1/3 of Blue 14).

Actually I was out with some of my roadie mates yesterday and we all decided it would be jolly good fun to take our CX/Gravel type bikes (we’re all on trend see) round Swinley Blue/Red just to see how we get along, I normally do it on an MTB of course.

I at least know what I’m letting myself in for and don’t think it’ll be too bad TBH, but my mate Tim is really not a fan of offroad cycling in general and is expecting to be killed to bits.

Anyone else done a lap of swinley Blue/Red on a CX bike?
How will a roadie/non CXer/non-MTBerist find it?

my mate Tim is really not a fan of offroad cycling in general and is expecting to be killed to bits.

Can you make him wear a GoPro and link to the video 👍🏼

I’m not nearly that cruel…

Plus it would make better sense to mount the camera on someone following him.

Most of it is fine. As long as:
1) You have some faith that the front wheel will grip and not wash out as you probably wont save it like you would on an MTB.
2) The front wheel doesn’t wash out

Apart from that:
Blue as far as Stickler is fine, Stickler is fine apart from being even more brutal than normal as you will end up comfort braking. The red is mostly fine, the only bit I really panicked on was the middle bit of R15 (the downhill from the reservoir). The berms and table top were fine, it’s the eroded bit where the only thing that goes through your head is “if my front wheel collapses now I’m going to go OTB very hard”, that’s as long as your front wheel doesn’t hit a root and implode which case the things going through your head will be bits of tree root and shattered rim.

The rest is either just slower, or faster or less comfortable.

Ohh, and don’t overtake E-bikes, it pisses them off 🤣

Molgrips: “The Salsa is probably my fastest bike round there.”

Thisisnotaspoon: “they’re fundamentally unsuited to Swinley, even for a riding god like me neither my CX bike nor my Vagabond are particularly quick on the trails themselves. “

Glad to see as much agreement about Swinley as there is about drops off-road. 😂

(Granted, I might have had more fun at Swinley on my hard tail or FS, but I would have gone to Peaslake if I’d had either with me!)

I’m pretty sure Molgrips’ Salsa has flat bars, unless he’s bought another salsa?

Did Swinley blue and red on Sunday morning on my Planet X XLS with 35mm Cx tyres on it, was fine. I was with Mrs kilo who was on her mountain bike (until she ripped the rear mech off and then I was literally towing her back) and a friend on a single speed mtb, they were a bit faster in places and I was a bit quicker up some of the climbs. Last four or five times we’ve been at swinley I’ve used the CX bike you just pick your line a bit more. I quite enjoy the change.

I’m pretty sure Molgrips’ Salsa has flat bars

It does yes. To re-iterate, my point is that flat bars can give you much better weight distribution and hence handling on technical off-road, but if you get them set up right they needed’t be a chore off-road. 660mm 15 degree sweep and ergon grips.

I’m pretty sure Molgrips’ Salsa has flat bars, unless he’s bought another salsa?

Ah ok. ☺️

Anyone else done a lap of swinley Blue/Red on a CX bike?

No, but I’ve done a Cut Gate / Roych loop on one.

How will a roadie/non CXer/non-MTBerist find it?

Probably a nice walk in the sunshine. My personal take is that riding mountain bikes doesn’t help you ride a cross bike off road. Similarly, riding road bikes, doesn’t help you ride a cross bike off road. And oddly, riding cross bikes off road doesn’t seem to help with riding mountain bikes off road. You just seem to be going a lot faster. But riding cross bikes off road does seem to help with riding road bikes on things that aren’t much like smooth tarmac. But ultimately you just end up going at a speed at which you feel reasonably sure that you will not die more than once, which can – particularly if your personal death quotient threshold is low – mean walking.

The good sde of all this is that you can always mull over whether using different shaped bars would make a difference to your experience. Probably most likely if they’re attached to a different bike 🙂

To re-iterate, my point is that flat bars can give you much better weight distribution and hence handling on technical off-road, but if you get them set up right they needed’t be a chore off-road. 660mm 15 degree sweep and ergon grips.

Basically, we’re all talking about what is the best compromise for our bikes to suit our own riding. What you’ve described there can be applied equally to drop bars, in reverse. (I’m assuming you mean flat bars aren’t a chore ON-road?) There is no magic one-fit solution. I like drop bars for riding long distances and cope with them off-road. If I’m doing really techy stuff I won’t be riding the gravel bike anyway, so it’s not an issue. It doesn’t mean you’re wrong or that I disagree with you, just that I ride differently from you!

A bunch of us did a decently long ‘gravel’ ride from Swansea up into the hills last summer. A combination of cycle paths, canal tracks and hill access tracks. We had everything from road-orientated carbon gravel bikes, through hard tails to retro MTBs. We all survived. We all enjoyed. We were faster or slower than the others in different places. Nobody was on the best or worst bike.

It doesn’t mean you’re wrong or that I disagree with you, just that I ride differently from you!

Of course, and it depends on the OP’s priorities which is what you said better than I managed. However it looked like he was dismissing flat bars out of hand on-road, so I was trying to say it needn’t be an issue. Bottom line is try it out.

We were faster or slower than the others in different places. Nobody was on the best or worst bike.

I tried to plan a ‘gravel’ route for SaxonRider and his CX bike. He was a little quicker on road, similar on the fire roads but I had to wait ages for him at the bottom of every descent as he oofed and ouched his way down at walking pace. Although to be fair he was on 28c.

Well, I ordered one of those stupidly cheap On-One Mike bars and stupidly expensive 11sp flatbar road shifters (still a bit cheaper than getting mtb shifter and mech, and easy to reverse any damage done).

I swapped my 80mm stem out for a 60mm yesterday, and it did feel better over the top of Ilkley moor, but I still feel like I never really want to push it as I’ll not have much chance of recovering if things go wrong. And things could easily go wrong as my tyres are basically slicks (trade-offs, etc…)