How much life is left in Rampage?

Obviously our sport is full of fads that come and go at the click of a marketing mans fingers. After this year’s event I’m feeling mleh and don’t think it’s something I’d stay up to watch any more. Given the high risk the guys take (Paul Basagoitia may not walk again) how many more events do you think are left?

I know they’re slightly improving on the stunts every year, but it’s still effectively identical to the year before. Not to mention the hillside must be shrinking every year!

27 of the top 30 news articles on pinkbike are about Rampage, i think it’s OTT.

Just watching it now. The first few riders looked pleased to be down safe – sorry to hear there was a serious injury later on. Viewing makes me feel a little bit sick but I guess thats the point. You do feel that doing something new involves taking ++ risk.
It is amazing though.

Where have you heard that Paul B may not walk again? A quick google showed nothing obvious to me.

Every time I see it I am more amazed that anyone can contemplate let alone actually do stuff like that. My main gripe is that SEMENUK SHOULDA WON!

I didn’t like the fact that they basically take a hill and change it completely from its natural state

It didn’t start out as a redbull sponsored meeja fest, with promotional booters and riders thinking about a “career in freeride”…

It’s just become nicely packaged gnarr for fizzy, caffinated, piss swilling PlayStation addled tweenagers to yawn through without appreciation or understanding…

They strangled the cool out of it years ago, but they’ll drag another decade of advertising opportunities out of it yet…

Cam Zinks latest facebook update

Redbull T.V. have a 40 odd minute movie about the recent Hardline event. All the interviewees (SP?) said they see a future in this type of event and it’s a way for DH to progress/evolve. One of the racers said it was harder than Rampage as you pick your line and ride it, whereas Hardline is a competitive race, with similar huge features.

I watched Rampage live and although it was a spectacle, the lines are becoming relatively sanitised which allows for ‘going bigger’.

It has a future, short term, but will be replaced by something else. Hopefully due to natural (or marketing) influences, not a severe accident.

I don’t think it’s dead yet, but it might be time for a long break again, maybe a new venue – but I’ve been saying for a few years now that I’m worried there riders doing it for the profile and RB are pushing it further and futher for the sake of a bigger spectacle to sell pop and someone’s going to end up paying for it. I think the whole #fuckrampage thing is the start of the backlash.

I like it but it does need some changes….to decide what it wants to be for starters.

If it’s a Slopestyle contest on a mountain then be done with inviting WC racers and just have it as an event on the FMB tour and he who can throw the most and the best tricks down their line wins (cough-Semunek-cough)…..or make a race of it, have all riders dig teams build the one dream line that everyone rides, no tricks, just fast big mountain riding….fastest from start to finish wins.

Choose one or the other, the current incarnation is too subjective for me.

Ultimately it doesn’t matter what we in the UK think, we’re not the target audience….freeride is huge in the US and Canada and that’s all that matters to sponsors, TV, websites etc….

I much preferred watching Hardline, that seems as big, steep and dangerous while still being a race….I’m just not interested in talking about a riders ‘flow’ or ‘style’ or any other BS you can’t actually measure.

For me the telling thing is if these lads are prepared to take similar risks when the cameras are off and just out riding with mates. If so, then it’s probably OK. If this is the riskiest thing they do every year egged on by cynical marketing men after increasing the bottom line profit selling fizzy pop then it is not cool.

I can’t watch it – it feels too voyeur like for me – waiting for a crash which is going to be almost certainly life threatening. It’s a spectacle for the computer game generation.

I have to say Having watched the prior 3 events live I didn’t watch this, just tried to grab a few highlights and watch Faircloighs run. As per the OP I thought it was a bit “samey” and this year I have enjoyed watching the DH live much more. Bad news about the injury, I hope it’s less serious than reported

Wow! Whiney lot aren’t you?

Healing vibes to Basagoitia 🙁

I’ve got a few thoughts – the first of which is for Basagoitia. It seems like his injury really is the worst news.

2) I think the PB Rampage coverage is to be expected: they’re a hugely commercial website and that’s what their audience want to see. It’s one week a year and I personally loved it.

3) I think the worst part of all of this is the comment on the judging. As I wrote on PB, this is an event about freeride mountain biking. As a result, it should be focussed on the riding. If you’re writing that the worst thing about the event is how one rider was ranked below where – in your view – he should have been, then I think you need to get your priorities straight. If this means that RB need to pull the event or reformat it somehow in order to take things back towards the riding, then so be it.

4) I’d agree that it’s gone very commercial recently, but at the same time I wouldn’t say RB have strangled the cool out of it: the riders still seem to be having fun during building etc (even if they pretty much are forced to attend because of the nature of the beast). I also think that saying the lines have become sanitised is true on a relative scale, but still a fairly strong claim to be making. Even the smoothest of runs (which lots of people are claiming to be the FEST flow line) still had huge hits – just take the Caluori preview as an example of how mental the terrain is there.

5) I think the reason Rampage is popular is because it’s so unique. Saying that it needs to decide what it wants to be is to misunderstand the original point of the event. It is freeride mountain biking and it’s being judged; of course it’s going to be subjective. The judging criteria are clear and even if people don’t agree with how they were applied, the event is still pretty well-defined in terms of what it is.

6) For what it’s worth, I think we should see a jam format in future years. Give it a week. Invite all the top riders – SS, FR, DH, whatever. Maybe change location. Get the filming/documenting resources we all know RB has the power to get. Ride all week. Prizes for best trick/run/huck/whatever as voted for by the riders. Cam McCaul on commentary duties for the 3hr film RB puts together at the end.

RB can continue to put out daily content to continue the cash cow/social media side of it that presumably earns them the money, and the riders can do what they love in a way less pressurised environment.

Sorry for the rant.

A view from the other side of the screen.

It needs a bit of time off to think about what it wants to be.
Trying to reconcile the needs of the bearded backcountry freeriders and the flipping foam pit jocks is just leading to to a bad atmosphere.The judging always get criticized but this year it seemed to upset/surprise the majority of the riders.
As a media/public spectacle the best thing that happened was Rogatkin base jumping off a cliff…..says a lot about the event.Whilst Bas’s possible career ending injury and Bizet’s broken leg get no coverage because I suspect it’s ‘bad press’.
I’d rather watch The Fest series.

I thought the judging was a bit erratic

I also watched the preamble show on Redbull.TV

Kyle Strait said something about how it’s moved the sport on and he was then followed up by a decades worth of highlights that were indistinguishable from one another, there’s progress… 😉

I realise that *all* trails are man-made in one way or another but the way the runs are hacked out for Rampage (in a way nature will never recover) makes me wince a bit. 😳

toughen up princess

Pretty sure you can only apply the toughen up princess card if you are part of the action 🙄 😉

I liked helpful1’s old log in betterer….she did’nt try so hard to be a douchebag,it just came naturally.

It’s not a side of moutain biking I really follow at all, but that bit by Cam Zink’s wife(?) up there doesn’t paint a pretty picture. I read somewhere else that riders were getting scared, and while I’m sure these guys are no strangers to sphinchter-clenching moments is it maybe getting a bit out of hand- effectively pressured into riding stuff they don’t really want to?
Can’t see that ending well.

A lot of different things to be considered. Cam Zink’s comments seem a bit self serving imo since he made his name winning Rampage (with a run which didn’t deserve to win) and has spent subsequent years bitching about being robbed when “his line” has just petered out each time.

It also needs to be remembered that there have been deaths in XC and Enduro this year, and recently there was a spectator killed at a BDS. So riding bikes is bloody dangerous what ever way you cut it.

Having said that I think Rampage doesn’t seem to being doing all that it can for rider safety. Line choice and interpreation is part of it but I think each rider should get a build crew supplied to them and features should be finished, catch berms, netting etc. Nico Vink could easily have been killed on his feature which wasn’t even finished. Rogatkin was lucky, shouldn’t have been allowed to finish his run after crashing like that.

These riders will always push themselves, whether it’s for contests or video segments, look at the fest series organised by the riders themselves, but I think riders at Ramapage need help to dig, a slightly looser format/timescale and less pressure.

I think those guys are the bravest and most skilled riders by far. I would be bricking it just standing on top of that ridge. Balls and skill on a different level

in a way nature will never recover

Dear god, that’s a bit melodramatic. I think nature will be just fine.

On the subject of the event itself: I’ve been torn on this for a while Now. Whilst I much prefer the “big mountain” style of event to the “performing seal” events, such as the RB Joyride, I do wonder if the risk is worth it. A sign that RB are taking things too far was the China “Sky Gate” fiasco: An event so pointless and ill-conceived that it bordered on exploitation.

I do think the Rampage event should remain, but it does need to change: I hate events where “judging” decides the outcome, so this should be reconsidered; maybe replaced with a “jam” scenario (as mentioned above). I don’t think having a timed event will work as that would play too much into the hands of the racers.

Oh, and on the subject of “sanitising” the lines: You try and ride some of that stuff and then come and tell me they are sanitised. In the vast majority of cases, the “building” has been done for safety. I remember some of the earlier events where people were having the most horrific crashes because they were basically landing huge drops in powder. If you are doing drops on that scale, you need everything to be predictable.

anything that has a judges deciding the artistic merit of something should just not be supported.
Too much bias takes place. It’s human nature.

It seems not all of the industry like the event:

deity components about redbull rampage

I watched Rampage live and although it was a spectacle, the lines are becoming relatively sanitised which allows for ‘going bigger’.

Having stood under and around a lot of the features sanitised is not the word that comes to mind.
On the crash, he lost it on the down slope and from where we were standing above looking directly at it he appeared to try and bin it to avoid wiping out the photographers who were in the media area off line but in his path. His crash was probably the smallest drop on the course.

It is a true spectical of free ride, the lines up top are very tough, the middle drops are huge and people take a lot of time to make sure they can do it, the lower section is the let of steam crowd pleaser section.

If I can figure it out I’ll be back in there next year, it was one of the best 3 days I have spent in a long time. 🙂

In the vast majority of cases, the “building” has been done for safety. I remember some of the earlier events where people were having the most horrific crashes because they were basically landing huge drops in powder. If you are doing drops on that scale, you need everything to be predictable.

‘Sanitation’ no?

The build up vids on PB had riders praising how much was left from last year’s builds. There are clear lines with berms built up with sand bags, huge rock cut outs to make a new line and edges of cliffs removed and rounded off to allow a new drop off route.

Would I even consider riding any of it? Not a hope.

My comment earlier applies. The sanitation allows for a smoother, safer ride, but hand in hand, this is means the ‘edge’ is now bigger and tricked which is dangerous, in a different way.

You could not do what the guys did on Saturday at the original Rampage.

Mike, I should have emphasised the word relatively more.

It’s not sanitation when it’s essential to make something rideable. I suppose a bridge is the sanitation of a river crossing?

I’ve always loved rampage for its sheer craziness and balls/skill. More and more I find it’s like watching a video game, and with it a detachment from the real risk. I feel a little uncomfortable with that.

I hate and love the spectacle at the same time, seeing the riders at the bottom not describe how great their run was, but always how glad they are to be there safe – it makes me sad to think that they are so caught up in the sport/money/sponsors/success that they feel they have to risk their lives. But it keeps me watching in a voyeuristic ‘this is wrong but I can’t help it’ way. I still post about it on FB, and watch the links that people put up driving the publicity like the rest of us.

When they drop the big plumb lines it make me feel sick. But I still love to watch it. The big jumps at the bottom are huge, but I suspect a showpiece and a welcome relief from the ridgeline and the middle section. I have no idea how they ride up on that ridge and then launch themselves from the cliff faces. I watch DH racing and, although I couldn’t ride at the speed they ride, I at least understand the thought processes they are going through to a point, but Rampage is something else entirely.

There is nothing I like more than seeing people push their boundaries, and the recognised limits, it’s hypnotic.

I’d like to see/read some honest post event interviews with the guys and their families. I’d love to know how many of them, deep down, wish they didn’t have Rampage in their event calendars.

There is only so safe you can make an extreme sport like this. It isn’t Formula 1….they can’t make the bikes safer and they can’t make the track safer when the points are scored for the technicality and difficulty of the riding. If you let the riders ‘sanitise’ the hill with sandbags and berms, they just do bigger jumps and harder tricks.

People will always go bigger, better, faster, higher. Someone will probably die and we’ve seen Paul badly (hopefully not irreversibly)paralysed this year, but it will continue to progress. Just look at mountaineering….so many folks have died on the Eiger, Everest etc, yet people are still out there climbing them and pushing the ‘free-climbing’ limits more and more.

I suspect a new venue will be on the cards soon.

https://instagram.com/camzink/

camzink Everyone send Paul Basagoitia positive vibes! This champion has started a long road to recovery after shattering his T12 vertebrae yesterday and undergoing 9 hours of surgery. He had a winning run going and may have set the record for biggest step down just before going down. Lots of tears have been shed. Keep Paul in your prayers to regain feeling in his legs. There were some horrible people spreading false news that he was OK, but he needs your support more than ever to walk again. Paul, you are the most tenacious human and competitor ever. Love you bud! You’ll be back! #fuckrampage

Sounds like a serious situation for Paul. Wonder if this will be a turning point or if things will keep getting bigger.

It seems like maybe there’s a conversation Cam Zink and his wife should have had a while back, or maybe have already had but not to everyone’s satisfaction?

You can interpret the comments on scoring 2 ways, being charitable it doesn’t have to be “Cam’s run was underscored”, it could also be “inconsistent scoring undermines the entire event” sort of thing.

I think anyone shocked by a big injury in an event dedicated to falling off cliffs and jumping across canyons is possibly just plain daft or kidding themselves. Rampage has a pretty good record considering its nature and history.

Don’t really understand. It’s riding bikes; that’s all it is. If some of the riders are scared about jumping off cliffs, then why don’t they just go home? They aren’t forced to do it.

If some of the riders are scared about jumping off cliffs, then why don’t they just go home? They aren’t forced to do it.

I doubt it’s that simple if you’re a professional. I mean, I’m sure sponsors aren’t there telling them they’d better get on with it or else, but it’s not the same as you going out with your mates and thinking “Nah, don’t fancy that today”.

Rampage will keep going until the advertising revenue stops coming in.

Someone dying will just add to the advertising revenue……..

I doubt it’s that simple if you’re a professional. I mean, I’m sure sponsors aren’t there telling them they’d better get on with it or else, but it’s not the same as you going out with your mates and thinking “Nah, don’t fancy that today”.

I know what you mean. But at the same time, they could tell their sponsors to go **** themselves. MTBing has got so corporate; what’s happened to the punk rock attitude?!

what’s happened to the punk rock attitude

It only existed in your imagination?
Went pretty much from bullhorns and Ron Hills.
To fluoro lycra.
To middle aged IT workers.

. It’s riding bikes; that’s all it is. If some of the riders are scared about jumping off cliffs, then why don’t they just go home? They aren’t forced to do it.

Its hardly just riding bikes is it?!…i just rode my bike across some MoD land this afternoon, it was nothing like Rampage, we’re talking many magnitudes of scale larger.

Likewise the ‘just go home’ comment….as far as i know the only true Rampage privateer so to speak is Wil White, the rest of the riders are employed/sponsored….if they just go home because they dont like it sponsors cut them loose…that means no money coming in, no high production cost Youtube vids for next years contract negotiations etc….some of these guys have wives and kids, its their job and they are effectively contracted into doing Rampage.

There’s aspects of my job i dont like, i cant just pick and choose….if i tried that my employer would fire me….of course no-one holds a gun to my head and forces me out the door each morning but its all i know (much like i suspect riding bikes is all a lot of these guys know) and so although i could leave in theory, the reality is that i need paid employment to keep a roof over my head….funnily enough much like the Rampage guys….starting again at my age would hit the family hard, again much like some of the older guys like Zink, Berrecloth etc….if you’re 18 its slightly different, when you’re 30+ you’re effectively in it for life unless you made enough when you were young to retire early.