A bit of thinking out loud going on here, so excuse me if I ramble and please feel free to offer any suggestions on the possible actions open to us.

So, couple of weeks ago the missus viewed a house we were interested in renting. The viewing was pretty rushed as the current tenants are still living there. The house or at least the parts she got to see seemed ok if a little dirty and messy.

Overall though, it was big enough and I the right place for school etc. She was convinced to place a deposit a day or so later to reserve it and then sign the contract a few days after. She queried the condition of the property and was assured it would be clean on moving day as it was the responsibility of the current tenants to clean it when they left. For me that sounded alarm bells, but the contract was signed.

Today I got chance to make a viewing which was once again uncomfortable and rushed as the current tenants were there and apparently unaware of our visit.

I found the kitchen to have a good layer of grease everywhere, worn out work surfaces and cabinets along with water dripping through the ceiling. This was the first time the other half had seen the kitchen properly too.

The living room had peeling wall paper and burns on the carpets. Moving upstairs, the leaking shower tray has seen at least 10 tubes of silicone on it as oppised to being fixed properly and was in generally poor condition.

So I asked the agents estates manager who attended with us whether it would be fixed, cleaned and decorated before we take possession. Which seems unlikely since the current tenants leave on the last day of June and we are supposed to get the keys on the 1st July. His reply did not fill me with confidence saying that it was up to the landlord if he wanted to make improvements or not. My argument is that the condition is definitely not as the property was described on the internet and the photos used were obviously taken when the house was freshly prepared which it definitely isn’t now. But I’m not sure how we stand having stupidly paid the deposit and signed the contract based on a rushed visit and the usual cajoling bfrom the agent that there were others waiting to take it if we didn’t. The missus being so fed up of missing out on previous houses I think she thought it can be cleaned and just panicked herself into signing.

Do you reckon we have any chance of getting our deposit back if they say it’s not going to be sorted properly and we refuse to take it in its current state??

Sounds to me like the Agent hasn’t told the landlord of the state of the place.

Is the condition of the property mentioned on the agreement? If it is and the condition the property is not as described I’d guess you can ask for it to be remedied or withhold your rent payments until it is.

IANAL, but having signed the contract you’ll be bound to it, but so too isn’t the agent/landlord?

Ask the landlord what they intend to do about the problems. List them. If not acceptable demand your deposit back as not described.

The alarm bells should be ringing if the existing tenants had no knowledge of your second visit.

Re advice, try Citizen’s Advice. If photos were inaccurate, you may be able to argue misleading info.
The flat I currently live in is a dark, tatty basement flat and is on the market and the photos on Rightmove are touched up to a degree that I would call misleading and misrepresentative – it’s common practice so CAB no doubt have some experience with such things!

Other than that, I would walk… the signs are already pretty bad that you’re dealing with a dishonest estate agent and landlord.

I got rushed into taking a place last year and discovered fault after fault after fault: stank of smoke, broken tiles, damp – including rising damp which had been painted over)… and also an online review where they’d threatened previous tenants with court action over deposit repayment. The neighbours said the estate agent had tried to threaten them too…

My gut feel when I took the place was that I couldn’t trust them, so if that’s how you feel I would steer clear… it’s your home after all

I haven’t seen the agreement yet, I’m going to their office in the morning to see the agent and hopefully read the agreement. But even the description if a “Gorgeous 3 bedroom semi” is pushing the truth badly. Apparently the tenants claimed that they didn’t know about the first viewing. Hence some of the rooms being off limits to her on that visit.
Will have to see how it goes tomorrow and take it from there, but I’m already assuming the worst!

You (the wife) have viewed the property and subsequently paid a deposit so I think contractually you are in a bad place. You can make an argument that the first viewing was difficult restricting the wife’s ability to inspect the property thoroughly however the response will be you should have viewed again or not put a deposit down.

As for cleaning yes the tennets are responsible and if it’s not handed over clean and in good order the agent will get the work done and charge the tennets / their deposit. So that in of itself isn’t a negative just something to be aware of and to manage.

As for a solution you can appeal to the agent for a refund on the basis that the viewing was restricted OR if you want the property make a list of what you want sorted and get that done before you move in

Write to the landlord and agent detailing your concerns and that you expect a rent reduction until the property is fully and professionally cleaned and the issues you have highlighted from your brief visits have been attended to, explaining that there may be further issues that come to light once you’ve moved in.

You will be presented with an inventory and condition report for you to sign and you are obliged to make your own comments on this report if it is not accurate. It’s important you do this thoroughly, as it will form the basis as to how much of your rent deposit ( could be the equivalent of 1.5x your monthly rent) you get back when you eventually leave the property.

If you receive a positive written response from the agent, then you have no real cause for concern, apart from the obvious that the landlord appears, from what you’ve explained thus far, not to look after their investment properly, which could mean it takes ages to get any issues in the future fixed. Does the property have the appropriate safety records? Eg gas safety cert, electrical safety checks etc?

I’d be very wary myself.
we have a 3 bed flat that we rent out via an agent. the current agent is great but the previous one we used was rubbish. Twice (the last time being the last straw) they described the property as in good condition in their inspection reports when there were obvious problems. First time was tenants fault as their cat had peed on all the bedroom carpets & the place stank, second time they failed to notice that a leak in the header tank had damaged the ceiling in a bedroom and water had been running down the wall, reported to them by the tenant but not passed on to me.
So, it could be a lazy landlord or an ineffectual agent. Either way it sounds like it may mean trouble.
You’ve already spoken to the agent, and found they have let strangers in to the property without the proper notice to the current tenant.
Try contacting the landlord direct and see where the land lies. They may be blissfully ignorant especially if they are remote from the property.

All the above posts are valid but my tupence worth would be just to run for the hills.

I’ve rented a lot of places and from experience if the letting agent / LL would offer a place as you described they are scum. Run or it will just be months of dissapointment (you may lose deposit but you can fight that without the misery of living in the house).

Sounds like the start of a long saga of ongoing problems that may not be worth the costs of the deposit. Is there much to rent around where you are looking ?

I would keep looking and try and get back the deposit, although that seems unlikely. How much did you pay ?

(And you signed a contract and didn’t get a copy ??)

P.S post a copy of the listing – we will all phone up the agent and act very interested so he thinks he has some other fish on the line…

You have obvious signs that it’s a crap landlord and a crap agent.

Don’t live in misery. Walk.

Losing your deposit may be a bargain.

IME, as a tenant and a landlord, part of the tenancy agreement is that the vacating tenants leave the place in the condition it is given to them in (allowing for reasonable wear and tear). If my tenants leave my flat as a pig sty, they are on the hook for professional cleaners going in to sort it (thats why you have deposits). So if the pics show a nice clean house, I’d reckon that was a sign it will have been nice when they let it, so will have to make it that way again.

best of luck

Get a copy of the contract to see whether it says the property will be handed over to you in good order and cleaned prior to the start of your tenancy.

Contact the agents in writing saying what you believe is required prior to you moving in.

Trouble is, if the contract is vague about the obligations of the landlord, then it could theoretically be fully enforceable – ie not just the deposit, but the subsequent rent as well, so just heading off somewhere else and hoping for the best may be a bad move.

So perhaps be firm with the agent but not nuclear at this point. It may even be cheaper in the longer run to spend on some professional cleaning before you move your stuff in.

I would probably walk tbh.
Copy the pictures on the advert you saw originally and if possible take pics of the current condition for comparison.
Things are stacked against you, in that you’ve paid a deposit, which is by its nature usually non-refundable.

One way out would be to wait until the current tenants have moved out and then burn it down before you move in.

Been to the agents office this morning. They claim that the current tenants have not reported the leak, hence nothing being done.
They started off being quite defensive saying that my o/h had seen it and it had not materially changed since then. I explained that she hadn’t seen the whole property due to the tenants cooking at the time and his wife being in one of the bedrooms.
He then let slip that they hadn’t been able to check the property ( I read couldn’t be arsed) for 3 years. The Saudi students who are there are apparently the 3rd tenants and although it has been rented by 3 different tenants it has just gone from one to the next with no checks as they don’t let them in on “religious grounds”

Anyway, they reckon that the landlord is a good one and that he is visiting today. Going to wait and see what comes of that. He might be in for a shock if he hasn’t been for 3 years too!

These are apparently award winning rental agents!

RUN AWAY NOW

IME, as a tenant and a landlord, part of the tenancy agreement is that the vacating tenants leave the place in the condition it is given to them in (allowing for reasonable wear and tear). If my tenants leave my flat as a pig sty, they are on the hook for professional cleaners going in to sort it (thats why you have deposits).

If you are renting and want to hold back money you better be using a DPS scheme as the process isn’t as simple as you just holding the money and refusing to give it them back. As if you have just stuck in your account you could be due a big fine as protections were put in place due to dodgy landlords.

I occasionally do work for Letting Agents, (I try to avoid it, but it’s money at the end of the day).
One asked me to look at a faulty socket.
OK. I went round, bloke who looked like a tramp said come round the back.
I opened the entry gate (terraced house) to find a pile of rubbish 3 foot or so deep, for half the length of the passage.
I went back round, said I wont be walking through that, he said, well you wont get in the front door, there’s loads of stuff in there.
OK, found my way to the back door, past the piles of pizza boxes and other household rubbish, to enter a house that was more untidy than the local tip.
And yes, he was right, there was no access to the front room, as it was full of yet more household rubbish- pizza boxes, beer cans etc.
I left quickly, rang the Agents to say never call me again, they then said the property had been inspected 6 months earlier and was clean.
They were liars.

Yup, sounds like you will be shafted regardless. Walk away and you’ve lost your deposit, move in and you’ll be living in a shit-tip where likely none of the issues will be resolved. It’s clear neither the landlord or agent care about the property. However, odds are that the next house you rent will be exactly the same.

Welcome to the lose – lose renting world.

If it’s any consolation, I and most of my friends only had to live like that for a decade before we could afford to buy our own houses…

agree with all the above – you are probably stuffed for the deposit, but you can try fighting for that if you have the energy. As for the house itself, run a mile.

Things are stacked against you, in that you’ve paid a deposit, which is by its nature usually non-refundable.

The DPS scheme says that the deposit cannot be used to cover unpaid rent. It is to cover the cost of repairs/replacement/cleaning when the tenant leaves and the property is in a worse state than when they moved in (excluding normal wear and tear).

If this is the deposit that the OP has paid then the letting agent has to return it in full if the OP hasn’t damaged the property (which he hasn’t as he hasn’t moved in).

I’m quite charitable, i’d wait and see what comes once the landlord has been round. If he’s genuinely good, and horrified by what he sees, then there’s a chance he’ll do what’s needed to reinstate his property and you can then move on from a clean start.

If he doesn’t, then as above, drop it.

It may be worth calling ARLA as they help regulate the letting agents and will be able to give you a better idea of where you stand. I don’t they look happily on the professionalism of these agents.

I’m going to see what comes of things this week. If progress is made then great, otherwise we’ll be moving on and looking for our deposit back probably less the agents fee, but getting the 1 month deposit back will be a bonus right now.

He then let slip that they hadn’t been able to check the property ( I read couldn’t be arsed) for 3 years. The Saudi students who are there are apparently the 3rd tenants and although it has been rented by 3 different tenants it has just gone from one to the next with no checks as they don’t let them in on “religious grounds”

Anyway, they reckon that the landlord is a good one and that he is visiting today. Going to wait and see what comes of that. He might be in for a shock if he hasn’t been for 3 years too!
This makes me very, very worried.

I as a landlord call my tenants each month, just as a quick ‘thanks, the rents in, anything need doing with the flat?’ call. I also see the property 2-3 times a year, regardless. It is my investment, the last thing I need is a tenant that does not look after it or issues to spiral.

Any landlord or agent that is not checking reasonably regularly is one to avoid.

Leave now.

Panic not richc, while I am an STW ‘evil landlord’, it’s all though DPS, so I dont see a penny of it unless there is an issue. Which so far, there hasn’t been. Touch wood.

OP, its a condition of most leases that you grant inspection visits to the agent/landlord there are no religious exclusions IME, that’s just an excuse from the aent.

If it’s rented to students it probably has not been well looked after by landlord or agents. When I look at where my daughters have rented and compare that to professional rentals it’s chalk and cheese.

I’m quite charitable, i’d wait and see what comes once the landlord has been round. If he’s genuinely good, and horrified by what he sees, then there’s a chance he’ll do what’s needed to reinstate his property and you can then move on from a clean start.

If he doesn’t, then as above, drop it.

Best advice on this thread.

After 8-9 years of renting in London I’d say that you are having what sounds to me like a pretty typical rental experience. Rushed around the property when it is untidy and full of other people’s stuff, and then pressured to make an offer on the spot. They always promise that any problems/damage you spot will be sorted, and that the place will be cleaned, but it is pretty rare that either of these things are done properly, if at all. The modus operandi seems to be to charge the previous tenant for professional cleaning, then pocket the money and let the new tenant clean up. Then try the same trick when they move out.

Remember, before you move in is when they need to impress you. If there are problems already, it’s quite likely to get worse once you’re in. Give them a chance to sort it, but if there are delays or excuses I’d try and walk away.

And if you do move in, scan the inventory like a hawk, and photograph everything! If it’s dirty when you move in you should either charge them for the cleaning, or get it noted on the inventory so you don’t have to leave it in a better state than when you arrived.

So let’s get this straight.
A contract was signed without having seen the whole property?
You are now not impressed as you’ve seen the rest and it’s dirty?
Why did your wife sight contract?
I hope you get it sorted.

Why did your wife sight contract?

Because in some parts of the country, you have little choice other than to make a rushed decision without enough information or be homeless.

Potdog. Where are you located? I know of someone just about to put a rental house on the market in Nottingham if it’s any use?

Because in some parts of the country, you have little choice other than to make a rushed decision without enough information or be homeless.

Good luck with that as a defence should you wish to get the deposit back.

Go see CAB.
It sounds rubbish and looks rubbish and ain’t going to change. Try to get deposit back but wouldn’t be hopeful. Bad decision on a poor viewing. Good luck

I m a landlord & always deal direct with tenants as agents are pretty useless. I d try & get the ll details & start communicating direct to get the place sorted – you may be surprised at the outcome, he may not know anything.

Good luck, we aren’t all bad!!!

After 8-9 years of renting in London I’d say that you are having what sounds to me like a pretty typical rental experience. Rushed around the property when it is untidy and full of other people’s stuff, and then pressured to make an offer on the spot.

I’ve never rented a property as tennent or landlord in that situation. TBH most times I’ve seen a property I know pretty soon whether I’d like to take it or not. If you think London agents are aggressive you should try renting in Hong Kong or Singapore. From what I hear Paris is a lot worse too.

@iolo, she knows she has dropped a big one, she’s not happy with herself, but as pointed out, after missing out on countless properties she let herself be flanneled by a rushed viewing, a yes, yes, don’t worry it will be clean, but you need to sign now if you want it. Supid, but sometimes people do stupid things when getting tired and desperate.

Anyway, online reviews of the agent (spencer properties of Leeds) are not looking at all positive, but we will have to give it a few days now and see what they propose.