It just really makes me laugh what people see as essentials.
Just think on this a moment. 30 years since I left my parents house I have never bought any furniture new. I have never bought any crockery and cutlery new.

It makes me laugh that you don’t think we need a banking system and that said banking system needs people to dress smartly.
It makes me laugh that you are happy that people don’t have jobs. We need manufacturing, like sofas and crockery and bicycles and clothes etc, so that we can have an economy and pay taxes that ultimately provide us with public health.
What a mess the country would be in if we all lived like you, TJ.

“It just really makes me laugh what people see as essentials.
Just think on this a moment. 30 years since I left my parents house I have never bought any furniture new. I have never bought any crockery and cutlery new. I have never bought a bike new nor any expensive components new (ignoring the flat we rent out which is my pension) I have bought one new cooker, one new fridge, one new freezer, two new washing machines two new computers. My telly is more than 20 years old.”

and your point is?

Broken again? I want my money back!!! 👿

Have we mentioned the fact that higher rate tax payers benefit more than lower rate payers when it comes to pensions tax relief, child care vouchers or bike to work schemes?

Did I read something about a 2nd property back there? Nah, eyes must be playing tricks on me… 😆

The not buying new is at least in part about 2 things – one is living within my means and the other is reducing carbon footprint.

I could have spent a lot more on consumer goods – I have had the money but i prefer to send it on beer and holidays and eating out. I do not measure my success by the stuff i own but by the fun I have

ransos – Member
Yunki – ever wondered why?
So this is 6 pages and growing – how many pages would it have been if the title was – high rate tax payers to receive child benefits?

Do you think that there would be so much bickering if the messenger was anyone other than TJ?

Which mod keeps the quotes, questions of the year files?

Just realised that mtb has become a sport exclusively for the rich. Took my bike in for first service for (ahem) a few years this morning. The list of immediate issues led to an eye-watering bill. Overtaking triathlon as an elitist sport.

and your point is?

That you is a bit sanctimonious.

Don – I thought you were interested in reducing co2 footprint. consuming less is the only way.

TJ is not complaining and does not want your sympathy so why have you done this – Jessus he gets some stick on here

I’d suggest (and have in the past) that he gets unfairly treated just because of who he is, but more recently I’ve come to the conclusion that it’s more to do with how he says what he says. A shame, as a lot of the time he gets stick for saying things which are right in the wrong way.

casa del TJ?

teamhurtmore – Member
Just realised that mtb has become a sport exclusively for the rich. Took my bike in for first service for (ahem) a few years this morning. The list of immediate issues led to an eye-watering bill. Overtaking triathlon as an elitist sport.

MTB is a sport now?

Tfl – home of the wealthy elite. How society has changed?

They are opening a new club in Pall Mall to accommodate their members.

Don – I thought you were interested in reducing co2 footprint. consuming less is the only way.

WTF has that got to do with the discussion?
Also show me where I have said that.

Pretty much Kimbers 🙂

consuming less is the only way.

unless it’s holidays, beer or eating out, obviously 😉

Don – you slag me off for not consuming yet you don’t seem to grasp that reducing consumption is the only way to reduce CO2 footprint significantly

A shame, as a lot of the time he gets stick for saying things which are right in the wrong way.

+1, if he had dropped the ‘elite’ from the original remark how different this thread would have turned out.

Not complaining though, in fact keep it up, i’ve got half an hour before i finnish for the weekend. 🙂

WTF has that got to do with the discussion?

WTF has keeping the capitalist boom going got to do with the discussion?

right – that more than my quota of stupid argument used up for the day.

Still no budgets from the struggling on £40 000 a year posse. a couple of mentions of expensive big houses ad expensive childcare but thats it.

Interesting to see how people can convince themselves that because they don’t feel rich they are not rich despite being in the richest 10% of the population

“Have we mentioned the fact that higher rate tax payers benefit more than lower rate payers when it comes to pensions tax relief, child care vouchers or bike to work schemes?”

Your right we havent mentioned that one yet. Have we also mentioned that some one earning >£40k is probably paying 40% tax in the first place ?!?! Thats not exactly fair either is it….

“I do not measure my success by the stuff i own but by the fun I have”

Ah ok are we getting to the crux of it now… you beleive that rich people (>£40k +) are deeply unhappy and spend all their money on material objects because they are so rich they have nothing better to spend their money on 😆

TandemJeremy – Member
right – that more than my quota of stupid argument used up for the day.

ALL day? At least until midnight?

druidh – Member

TandemJeremy – Member
right – that more than my quota of stupid argument used up for the day.

ALL day? At least until midnight?

I’ll try. feel free to remind me 🙂

TJ – I gave you some idea on what I spend each month on housing and food?

yes you did – thanks.

Don – you slag me off for not consuming yet you don’t seem to grasp that reducing consumption is the only way to reduce CO2 footprint significantly

Where have I slagged you off?
I have disagreed on a point of need and that you seem to think that you can apply your needs across the board as a valid argument. We know historically that disagreements can be seen as personal attacks and a form of bullying.
Reducing consumption is one way of reducing CO2 emission, but by no means the only way, killing half the population is another.
You appear to have missed the bit where I said your lifestyle is admirable but life moves on and forward.
Unnecessary consumption is a waste but there is also a necessary level of consumption for economies to grow and to sustain life. I need to use resources to manufacture things like double glazing, it is only the stupid that can not see the long term benefits of this or choose, quite selfishly imo, to live in buildings that are not environmentally friendly and hipocritically to criticise others.

Your right we havent mentioned that one yet. Have we also mentioned that some one earning >£40k is probably paying 40% tax in the first place ?!?! Thats not exactly fair either is it….

A better definition for TJ’s ‘Elite’ would have been those earning >£40k and not paying 40% tax…

Have we mentioned the fact that higher rate tax payers benefit more than lower rate payers when it comes to pensions tax relief, child care vouchers or bike to work schemes?

OK, fair point, though the pensions tax relief has now been capped. Child care vouchers now don’t apply for me, and if you think the tax I can save on a £1000 bike somehow offsets the tax I paid last year, you’ve been at the crack pipe.

TandemJeremy – Member
right – that more than my quota of stupid argument used up for the day.

Still no budgets from the struggling on £40 000 a year posse. a couple of mentions of expensive big houses ad expensive childcare but thats it.

Interesting to see how people can convince themselves that because they don’t feel rich they are not rich despite being in the richest 10% of the population

I see you’ve not read my post about individual vs household income and cost of living in different places. Don’t take the argument high ground when your point is so simplistic.

It just really makes me laugh what people see as essentials.
Just think on this a moment. 30 years since I left my parents house I have never bought any furniture new. I have never bought any crockery and cutlery new. I have never bought a bike new nor any expensive components new (ignoring the flat we rent out which is my pension) I have bought one new cooker, one new fridge, one new freezer, two new washing machines two new computers. My telly is more than 20 years old.

That just makes you sound like a tramp.

Who buys second hand cutlery 😕

I do not measure my success by the stuff i own but by the fun I have

Arguing on the Internet must be a ball then. You must be in the top 10% in the country at that, surely? Highly successful.

That just makes you sound like a tramp.

Who buys second hand cutlery

People who can’t afford new cutlery, or those who chose to spend their money on things other than cutlery?

(Or, those who appreciate antique cutlery like CFH)

Why does it make TJ sound like a tramp? Does him buying second-haynd cutlery give him a gruff voice brought on by sleeping rough and developing chest infections etc, and ravaged by alcohol use?

I’ve never bought new cutlery; I just nick all mine from restaurants and that, piece by piece.

I eat with antique cutlery. I also bought a house complete with contents. as a good green I do not throw things away while they still work

I was simply trying to show that “essentials” is a construct not an absolute.

Who buys second hand cutlery

Me. I bought some lovely silver rat tail stuff from a rather lovely little antiques market in Salisbury only the other day. I’ve also got a wonderful set of silver coffee spoons from the same place! On Catherine Street, for those who know it.

OK, this has given me something to think about to be honest. I’m not a higher rate taxpayer but I know I could budget better. We have a comfortable lifestyle but there’s no doubt it was a lot more comfortable pre-kids. We do get certain benefits and tax credits and they do add up. Without them we’d certainly be a lot worse off for having kids, to the point where money might have been a reason to not have them in the first place. That would be a great shame.

I admire TJ for coming on here and telling us his monthly budget. However I do think it is largely irrelevant since we are talking about child benefits. I know this sounds a bit tired, but comparing the budget of a childless couple to one with children is a bit fruitless.

OMG – CFH and I share a taste in cutlery 😯

TandemJeremy – Member

druidh – Member

TandemJeremy – Member
right – that more than my quota of stupid argument used up for the day.

ALL day? At least until midnight?

I’ll try

You failed.

Who buys second hand cutlery

I inherited mine does that count? Silver / family crest. Obviously don’t use it as can’t be bothered to clean it.

CFH – difference between “stupid argument” and explaining a point – tho if I had seen your post first it explains the same point so mine would not have been needed

People who can’t afford new cutlery, or those who chose to spend their money on things other than cutlery?

I’ve never bought new cutlery; I just nick all mine from restaurants and that, piece by piece.
Perhaps if people bought their cutlery instead of nicking it, we’d have more paid employment and be less dependant on the state for handouts. The general standard of living would increase resulting in a higher level of education which would make us better informed in our buying decisions leading to a better and more fulfilling life for everyone. 😀