High viz clothing makes no difference to overtaking distances

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  • High viz clothing makes no difference to overtaking distances
  • Dickyboy
    Member

    similar tests were carried out by a motorcyclist years ago – only decking the bike out to appear like a motorcycle cop made any difference to number of “infringements” by other road users 🙁

    Amazing how many drivers involved in fatalities suffer momentary blinding by the sun. Even at times when the sun isn’t particularly low, other witnesses were fine, and they’d been driving on a long straight road.

    thing is with SMIDSY incidents, just about nobody is going to admit to pulling out, cutting up, squeezing through & causing a crash – in their own minds they have to justify their actions & sorry mate I didn’t see you or some other weak excuse allows them to deflect the true horror of what they may have just done 🙁

    winston_dog
    Member

    OR, 95% of drivers that pass you too “too close” would also pass cars too close!

    Would be interesting to conduct a similar experiment with a slow moving car and see what the passing distances are.

    Sorry but that’s nonsense.

    It is just not possible to give another car the same clearance as a bike, there isn’t the room. Besides, if a car clips wing mirrors with another it probably won’t end up with any serious injuries.

    The message from that Highway Code picture needs to be reinforced. The horse riders have managed to get their message across.

    Premier Icon MSP
    Subscriber

    The horse riders have managed to get their message across

    Car drivers fear an out of control horse more than a wobbly cyclist, its nothing to do with getting a message across, its just a personal risk calculation.

    Premier Icon ransos
    Subscriber

    It’s not about how close the drivers who see you pass, it’s about either being seen or being splattered all over the road.

    Close passes put people off cycling. Bums on saddles are the best thing possible for our safety.

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    Close passes put people off cycling. Bums on saddles are the best thing possible for our safety.

    How many do you plan to sacrifice?

    Premier Icon MSP
    Subscriber

    And clothing will not change how close cars pass, it never will, it never has, it is just random association. There are times when clothing can make the difference between being seen and not seen, but that’s a different proposal.

    Cars pass too close because of the drivers, not because of the cyclists.

    Premier Icon ransos
    Subscriber

    How many do you plan to sacrifice?

    I’ve no idea what you’re talking about.

    ti_pin_man
    Member

    Interesting study.

    I’ve never really understood the hi viz argument, when I drive I can see cyclists. Even at night I can see cyclists in ninja black gear, no lights and no hi viz – in streets with some street lighting that is. The visibility isnt an issue. Its the speed in which I see them. With lights I see them in lots of time. with only hi viz its usually later and to be truthful if they have no lights and no hi viz I, like most of us, see them late but if its in a street with street lighting I still see them.

    I pass all of them with the same gap.

    The study shows people take more care when they percieve they might be caught too close. Its no differnt to speeding, people generally think its ok to do 35-40 in a 30 but if they might get caught by a speed camera they only do 30 then cruise back up. Its the same here. the fear of being caught.

    EDIT: So who’s placing the order for the reflective: polite / camera recording stickers ? 😉

    Bums on saddles are the best thing possible for our safety

    Maybe 99% of the population is cycling already, we just don’t know they because they aren’t dressed in high-viz so we never see them.

    I for one see loads of invisible cyclists dressed in black without lights.

    Premier Icon amedias
    Subscriber

    I know it’s not the done thing to do partial, out of context quoting but this made me chuckle

    I for one see loads of invisible cyclists

    As lots have already said above, what this study alludes to is not about visibility, its about people actively **deciding** not to give enough space, as evidenced by the fact that when they think they’ll get in trouble they do give more space.

    Ergo, they know it’s naughty, but they don’t care unless they think they will get into trouble.

    That’s sad, and reinforces some of the prevailing views about cyclists not being treated/recognised as people but as ‘cyclists’ when on the road, I wonder how much of it psychologically has to do with not seeing a face because of the approach from behind, there’s a fair amount of comment and research about eye contact reducing the chance of collisions at junctions but when being overtaken on a straight you don’t get to make that connection.

    Just as an example, I bet most of the worst overtakers would give a lot more room if they recognised the cyclist as a family member or friend.

    mrmo
    Member

    I for one see loads of invisible cyclists dressed in black without lights.

    you can’t see the invisible, so are they invisible or not??????

    AlasdairMc
    Member

    My perception, which echoes those above, is that I get more space when on a more upright bike in ‘human’ clothes than when on a ‘proper’ bike dressed as a cyclist, but this study seems to show that my perception is wrong.

    I agree. The best example I can think of is riding a road bike in Central London, and then riding the same on a Boris Bike. You get loads of room on the Boris Bike as drivers fear that most users aren’t cyclists, just people who have hired a bike for 30 minutes.

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    So in short, it’s complicated

    Exactly what I meant. In much fewer words.

    Premier Icon Flaperon
    Subscriber

    I find that drunkenly weaving down the road results in plenty of space. You don’t actually have to be drunk to achieve the same benefit, and a deliberate wobble or two seems to really help.

    p8ddy
    Member

    Until a cycling and motorcycling component is included in the driving test drivers just won’t get it.

    We’re viewed as pests. And regardless of what we do, it’ll always be thus – until drivers empathise with us. Boris’s ‘bikers taking a risk’, ‘earphoning bikers are a scourge’ doesn’t help, nor does the many newspaper articles referencing ‘those cyclists’. Drivers seek to compete with us.

    Motorbikes are the same – seen as rough and as a sub culture.

    A driver recently knocked my missus off her scooter. The first words out of his face when he approached her were “I hope you’re not going to say that was my fault!” He then explained how her bike was “too slow”. And this was when she was still lying on tarmac trying to gather her senses having slid down the road. Thankfully a driver behind had stopped, witnessed and gave the guy a dressing down.

    Drivers just don’t understand the risk, they don’t know how threatening it feels – so can’t assess the situation accurately IMO. A French style driving test with a minimum number of hours training, plus a cycling and motorcycling element (obv with exclusions for the disabled) would help a bundle and might actually reduce accidents and dangerous situations.

    Premier Icon miketually
    Subscriber

    I find that drunkenly weaving down the road results in plenty of space. You don’t actually have to be drunk to achieve the same benefit, and a deliberate wobble or two seems to really help.

    There’s a pinch point on my commute that I generally reach just as the cars from the previous set of lights catches me. A few ‘wobbles’ does wonders for stopping people trying to squeeze through.

    nwilko
    Member

    Drivers when faced with a parked car on their side of the road will normally despite oncoming traffic just drive onto the wrong side of the road as the gap is big enough, the same I can fit decision is used when overtaking a cyclist, can’t be delayed by anyone.. I find I have to ride really far out to force passing cars into a definite head on collision and make them wait until I judge it’s safe for them to overtake, nothing else works. But on fast a-roads your then at risk from drivers not looking where their going so I avoid fast roads where possible no safe way to use em.

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