We have a heritage railway running through the valley I live in. I’m always out walking with doggo so see it quite often.
I feel quite conflicted by it, it obviously brings pleasure to visitors and tourism money to the valley but the trains don’t half kick some shit out – you can really see and smell acrid exhaust from the old school large 1970’s diesels.
The line would make a good commuter running alongside as it does a congested dual carraige way / 2lane motorway into Manchester to connect to the network beyond and there has been numerous consultations but no progression.

I know there is a large group of volunteers that maintain the rolling stock and line but I wonder how long that workforce ‘has left’ and if there is any new blood coming through?

Another reason I feel conflicted is we’ve just bought some coal for our winter heating and I’m really disappointed to do so with Covid ruining our plans for moving away from solid fuels to biomass & PV yet the steam trains are burning coal for people’s pleasure.

Can anyone shed any light on my confliction? Or does anyone have any dealings with a heritage railway?

I bet there isn’t much comparison with a weekend of steam and diesel train action compared to a short haul flight to the med.

It’s our history being preserved isn’t it, that’s got to count for something.

Plus the 3 channel ferries a day I can see from my window constantly belch a plume of blue smoke whilst in port, especially when it’s about to leave

I know there is a large group of volunteers that maintain the rolling stock and line but I wonder how long that workforce ‘has left’ and if there is any new blood coming through?

Plenty of younger folk working on the local steam railway here.

It’s our history being preserved isn’t it, that’s got to count for something.

but is it worth emitting CO2/particulates for when log burners for heating are frowned upon whereas history/pleasure is acceptable?

Plenty of younger folk working on the local steam railway here.

ah okay – despite living in this valley all my life I don’t know anyone who has involvement with the railway but that’s interesting that there is succession.

I think it’s worth preserving a few to remind people of how oily, dirty, noisy and generally less good things used to be plus a fire breathing machine is quite an impressive beast. The filth the flying Scotsman dumps on onlookers is something to behold.
There are people developing bio fuels that can be used on heritage railways to absolve some of the environmental stuff. The amount of oily residue they trail is a different story.
Also in the news recently a heritage rail group have revived a late 80s electric loco and are going 1st class tickets from London to Manchester for £75, less than the regular standard fare so good luck to them.

We went on a heritage railway trip yesterday from Porthmadog to Beddel..Bedergel…Bedgerryl…somewhere with a Welsh name.
It was really nice, plodding along at 15-20 mph, watching the sheep running away from the farmers, spotting Snowdon in the distance, sunshine, a little bit of smoke from the loco, a very nice young chap keeping us informed & trying to flog souvenirs.

Sorry, what was the question again?

Sounds like they plan to be around for a while with lots of mentions of training and jobs.

https://www.burytimes.co.uk/news/19946941.east-lancs-railways-12m-bid-heritage-loco-centre-approved/

Also a loco restoration place at Heywood so does seem they are keeping some useful skills alive (we are trying to recruit an old school machinist at work and they are impossible to find).

ah okay – despite living in this valley all my life I don’t know anyone who has involvement with the railway but that’s interesting that there is succession.

It’s one way of developing and retaining some enginerring skills that might otherwise be lost.

I wasn’t aware of the info in Mick_R’s post, thats the local line I’m talking about.

Okay – that’s helped sway my opinion, I’m still not 100% with the shit they kick out but it looks like socially it outweighs it?

Heritage diseasles are truly awful. I’d far rather breathe in coal smoke than the crap that used to come out of our 03, or worse my mates 24. At least the particulates in coal might be generally big, chunky and get stuck in your nostrils.

When I volunteered on a heritage line I did so to: 1. avoid playing rugby at school, or any of the other “sports” they offered by cunning application of our voluntary service group, 2. learn how to drive a railway engine, yay! 3. learn how to weld, turn things, gas axe stuff, use big, evil, industrial tools like needle scalers and plate riveters. 4. Do donuts in a JCB while supposedly shovelling ballast around.

In addition I got to learn the life stories of many, many retirees for whom the railway was so much more than a bunch of nutters playing trains. They’d be there day-in day-out fettling, painting, making things – keeping active physically and mentally in ways that other organisations can’t do.

I’d never have gotten those opportunities elsewhere. Volunteer-run railways are amazing places. A little microcosm of our industrial past, wrapped up in a elderly care provider.

If you drew a pie chart of uk CO2 emissions the heritage railway bit would be invisible

(I made that up)

Then I googled it. Heritage railways are 0.023% of uk co2 emissions

https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2021/11/government-confirms-environment-bill-will-not-apply-to-steam-locomotives.html/amp

But you get my point. It’s  portably not even that bad per mile travelled. Other emissions like particulates would be a different story

Ships now that’s a story. Apparently a cruise ship across the Atlantic is worse than flying per passenger. If a boxed bike weighs 20kg then are 6 kg of co2 are emitted bringing it from Taiwan, which doesn’t seem to bad. Container ships are 3% off world emissions

lots of positives
“13 million visitors each year and generate £600m plus to the economy.”
https://www.hra.uk.com/about

plus an important part of our industrial heritage, and gives pleasure to loads of people, hearing, smelling and seeing those diesel locos takes me right back to my youth!

@esselgrunfuttock
‘Porthmadog to Beddel..Bedergel…Bedgerryl…somewhere with a Welsh name.’
Really? Google is bust wherever you are is it?

Beddgelert

Easier to type than what you wrote.

A previous address of mine was:
Ambrose ******
Gilfach-yr-Allt
Llandeusant,
Llangadog,
Llanymddyfri
Sir Gaer.

It’s a different country, with a different language innit?

My neighbour volunteers for that railway, its pretty important for him, gives him something to get up for in retirement. I think the biggest issue for them is sourcing coal since the last suitable mine in the UK closed early.

I live near the East Lancs Railway. I used to enjoy walking along the track to Rammy when I was a kid prior to its revival in 1986 🤔.
Only used it once or twice in all the years it has been open, too pricey. I don’t mind hearing the whistle in the distance and seeing the smoke. I do get a bit cheesed off when I get stuck in a queue a the level crossing waiting for the train to pass tho 😭😂.

We have been on it quite a few times – the last time was MrsRNP and I had a date day (with Bert the doggo) on a beautifully restored Class105 (I had to Google it). Came back on another diesel in the cab – this one really did stink of diesel shite though!

I used to enjoy walking along the track to Rammy when I was a kid prior to its revival in 1986

same here – lived in Edey most of my life so often ended up messing about on the ‘lines

With all these things it just comes down to numbers of people/incidences and location. Like, woodburners, open fires etc are a problem not because wood burning is bad but because loads of people can do it and it’s right in built up areas, so particulates etc are more of an issue. Whereas most people can’t have a deltic.

Don’t worry, with the price of any fuel that emits carbon and other sh*te, these places won’t be around much longer…

As it happens, me and the good lady did the dinning experience on the steam train last night for her birthday. It was absolutely fantastic! And I got to ride on the footplate when they turned the engine around at Rawtenstall. I challenge any bloke not to get pant-wettingly excited at the prospect of that. And I love the fact that they soundtrack the weekend. What better noise is there in the world?

As others have said, compared to Manchester airport or the cars on the M60, I doubt the emissions are here nor there.

Incidentally you won’t have heard the steam trains over the last few weeks. They thought that driving a vehicle spitting out hot soot through tinder-dry moors was probably not the best idea, so they’ve been running the diesels

And anyway… self-promotion mode engaged… who’d buy my prints if we didn’t have the railway 😀

Incidentally you won’t have heard the steam trains over the last few weeks. They thought that driving a vehicle spitting out hot soot through tinder-dry moors was probably not the best idea, so they’ve been running the diesels

Good point.
There used to be the occasional grass fire along the track after the tunnels but before Nuttall park.

I think the biggest issue for them is sourcing coal since the last suitable mine in the UK closed early.

This – prices have gone up dramatically, it’s getting more difficult to get hold of and at some point, that’ll be the death of it rather than any concerns about the environmental impact of running a steam train around the place.

I live very near a line that gets reasonably regular steam excursions and it’s kind of nice to sit out somewhere scenic and watch it go by.

I mean, you could apply the same argument to airshows – the cost of keeping archaic jets running, burning shed loads of fuel just to display to a bunch of aviation geeks but again, there’s the heritage / history argument, education… 🤷

@esselgrunfuttock
‘Porthmadog to Beddel..Bedergel…Bedgerryl…somewhere with a Welsh name.’
Really? Google is bust wherever you are is it?

Beddgelert

Yeah I know where it was. I was demonstrating my lack of understanding & the simple ability to either remember or even pronounce Welsh place names.
We stayed in Harlech & went to Barmouth, I remember those 2.

Ships now that’s a story. Apparently a cruise ship across the Atlantic is worse than flying per passenger.

Depends what theyr’e powered by. P&O’s cruise ship Iona is powered by liquefied natural gas, which (I am led to believe) is pretty clean.
Although I stand to be corrected.

Cruise ship isn’t really comparable to flying, though- one is a method of transport, the other is a holiday itself.

I know there is a large group of volunteers that maintain the rolling stock and line but I wonder how long that workforce ‘has left’ and if there is any new blood coming through?

My next door neighbour volunteers most weekends. He’s in his early 30’s and doesn’t fit in remotely with the stereotype of steam train geeks, but he absolutely loves it

Just as an update to this one…

A mate is an engineering lecturer at Bury college. He spent this morning looking round the engineering sheds at the loco works there, where they’re presently working on the Flying Scotsman, amongst many other things

He was given the tour by one of his former students who left last year and now has a full time job there working on the engines.

There’s a lot to like about that. 🙂

binners

Just as an update to this one…

A mate is an engineering lecturer at Bury college. He spent this morning looking round the engineering sheds at the loco works there, where they’re presently working on the Flying Scotsman, amongst many other things

He was given the tour by one of his former students who left last year and now has a full time job there working on the engines.

There’s a lot to like about that. 🙂

Still no bloody like button!

I have a friend who has been working on old trains for a hobby most of his life & is also qualified to drive them as well. He runs an engineering company in Widnes & has lots of lads who want to work with him on the trains including his son (19 today) I think he might be interested in that Trans Lancashire Express print 😀

Thanks for the updates – I was genuinely torn due to a lack of knowledge and couldn’t decide where heritage trains sat in today’s CO2/particulates focused world.

This discussion has actually got me thinking – I might go see them about being a volunteer. I’m 50 this year and conscious of expanding my fairly small social network. I’m a hands on NaturalBornTinkerer and a process engineer for a big chemical company. Pressure vessels, piping, CAD, all forms of welding and machining etc are my bread and butter.

Go for it! Bet if you have PSSR under your belt they’d snap you up.

I’ve always wanted to but my nearest is just too far to make the commitment. As others have said it’s like an industrialised mens* shed with a direction.

*I realise that’s not exclusively true.