Hemlock

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  • Hemlock
  • Coasting
    Member

    No one seems to be riding these and on paper they look a killer.Why the lack of interest

    mildred
    Member

    I know, I asked for pics a week or so ago and didn’t get one posted. Seem spot on to me.

    I_Ache
    Member

    Im interested in them too people always seem to recommend them but nobody seems to ride them.

    I think I would quite like to find out how a 160 fork would ride with the 120 rockers.

    Premier Icon cp
    Subscriber

    there’s probably not that many around – Cotic were out of stock for ages! I’ve always liked the concept of the Hemlock, and the 2009 model looks spot on. If I had the cash, it would be my frame of choice 🙂

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    I’ve heard that they’re looking into issues with swing-arm breakages, particularly on the medium frame.

    Premier Icon cp
    Subscriber

    on the new ones? i know there were some problems with the old ones…

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    Yes, on the new ones too. They break.

    scruff
    Member

    Heres one in the Swiss Alps.

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    I thought that was flexyness issues, not actually breakages?

    Feel free to correct me, though…

    EDIT – I was slightly slow posing this!

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    No, flexiness was the old issue. The new ones break if a crucial washer is ommitted or the pinch bolt behind the main pivot is loose. They then fail catastrophically at that point.

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    I don’t really think it’s my part to explain a Cotic safety issue, perhaps best to ask Cy.

    I_Ache
    Member

    There must be some out there tho.

    Premier Icon matt_outandabout
    Subscriber

    I wanted one as my insurance replacement, but insurers would not play ball on a cash settlement 🙁

    18bikes had priced me up a pukka bike with Thors/Hope Hoops/Louise’s/SLX…

    jfb01
    Member

    If you guys like the Hemlock , take a look at the Ventanas , I have never seem one break & they are designed the way the Cotic should have been.
    The rockers are kept as short as possible & I do not think a gorilla could cause them to flex.Also all the pivots have double bearing & you can have multiple tavel rockes.

    mildred
    Member

    Except Ventanas generally cost at least £400 more.

    richc
    Member

    and are known for breaking as well.

    neilforrow
    Member

    trail monkey has one… ask him

    PeterPoddy
    Member

    No, flexiness was the old issue. The new ones break if a crucial washer is ommitted or the pinch bolt behind the main pivot is loose. They then fail catastrophically at that point.

    So it’s more of a maintainance issue, really? Although you’d have thought that it wouldn’t matter too much really…..

    richc
    Member

    Ummm, if you don’t do the main pivot pinch bolt up then I would sorta expect a catastrophic failure, as the swing arm will fall off.

    Its a bit like if you don’t do up your brake caliper bolts, I would expect the caliper to fail as well.

    ChunkyMTB
    Member

    mildred – Member
    Except Ventanas generally cost at least £400 more.

    A lot of money for a Kona. 😆

    Premier Icon matt_outandabout
    Subscriber

    BWD – how many have you SEEN fail, or is this just internet gossip?

    I was one who was critical of how flexible the old rockers were – I played on wee pete36’s one. The new ones seem a beefy as anything and the bike is indeed rigid at the rear (fnnar).

    I was hoping to get one 🙁

    JonEdwards
    Member

    Well my missus has one and loves it.

    160 fork/120 rockers should be a lotta fun. I tried one with 150 fork/100 rockers and it could get you into a whole lot of trouble very very quickly indeed, without feeling like a sofa.

    New (mk2) version looks very solid indeed. Must admit to being tempted meself….

    I_Ache
    Member

    Thanks Jon thats the first feedback about that combo Ive heard. Im hoping to have a new FS frame in that long/short format but there arnt many options. Was it a shop demo that you tried? If so where?

    juan
    Member

    A lot of money for a Kona. [:lol:]

    Doooo beat me to that 😉

    neilb67
    Member

    I think Swinnertons in Stoke will have a demo soon…

    Premier Icon matt_outandabout
    Subscriber

    I_Ache – 18bikes have a demo iirc.

    http://www.18bikes.co.uk/

    rj
    Member

    I’m basing this on zero evidence, but since there are a few Hemlocks at the Bikeradar demo days, Cotic may be willing to ship one of those to your LBS for you to try.

    stealthcat
    Member

    I_Ache

    Where are you based, and what size do you want to try?

    I_Ache
    Member

    Im in Birmingham a medium or a large should give me a good indication.

    JonEdwards
    Member

    Was it a shop demo that you tried?

    No – one of the preproduction ones.

    I have ridden my other half’s a bit though (she generally runs 140 F/100 R) which is a mighty fine singletrack hacker, but a bit small for me, and I’ve also used one of the AQR hire bikes (140F/150R) for some DH runs in the Pyrenees. That felt a little bit nervous and the forks (Pikes) couldn’t really keep up with the back end.

    I think one with the 6″ rockers and some Lyrics or Float 36s would be about the perfect Megavalanche bike.

    I’ve never ridden one, but given the way I ride if I ever feel the need to replace my Five a Hemlock would certainly be on my list. The 08 design looked too much like it was made in somebody’s garage, but the new one looks pretty close to spot on I reckon.

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    BWD – how many have you SEEN fail, or is this just internet gossip?

    Just the one, a magazine test bike. It failed because apparently a washer had been omitted during assembly, something which apparently is common to other medium-sized Hemlocks from the same batch, which presumably are out there being ridden still. It didn’t fail because the bolt wasn’t done up.

    As I said earlier, I don’t think it’s really up to me to comment on a safety issue, but I can tell you that it’s not something I’ve made up or ‘heard’ on the internet.

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    Got plenty in stock, but I think people are waiting for press. We got tests out much earlier last year. We’ve got a whole fleet built for the Future demos, and 18 Bikes, Cyclescene in York, Freedom Bikes in Brighton all have demos and we can ship a demo to a dealer if it doesn’t clash with us needing it. I don’t know if Swinno’s have built there’s yet, or whether they sold it. They had a frame off us a few weeks back.

    Setup-wise, I ran 160/100 on last years bike and 160/120 on the 09, and it’s lots and lots of fun in big stuff without being too wallowy or boring on smoother trails. Have to say I recently switched mine back to a much lighter 140/120 build using my Thors for demo duty, but left a sticky DH front tyre on and I’m totally loving it. 140mm forks are soooo much better than they were last year. I can chuck it around more because it’s lighter, just loads and loads of fun.

    Regarding the swingarm, we have had one fail which was a result of incorrect assembly of a pinch clamp and it lacking a washer. In this case the bolt loses preload and then the frame fatigues prematurely. One went which flagged up the issue. It’s in the process of being sorted. I went and chucked mine off a 4ft drop 25 times the other week to make double sure I was totally, once-and-for-all happy with it. It’s fine 😉

    Premier Icon BadlyWiredDog
    Subscriber

    Are all the Hemlocks which are out there correctly assembled then?

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    All 2008 frames and the 2009 small and large ones are. The 2009 medium ones are in the process of being made that way.

    Premier Icon kelvin
    Subscriber

    There’s not many being ridden out there because not many are made. I think people forget how small Cotic is. I’d like to see more photos of people’s builds though. I’ll take some pics of mine once the forks are back from being refreshed.

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    I’m going to take pics of mine when it has the extra-rad white rims in a few days 😀

    tlr
    Member

    I hope they’re good, I’ve just bought one, but not built up yet. Currently intending on 150mm rear with 140 Talas up front, so comments about it being twitchy like that are interesting.

    Ultimately I think some 160mm forks that wind down for climbing would be ideal. Or I could buy a 120mm rocker.

    Looking forard to actually riding it.

    I_Ache
    Member

    cy hace you had any chance to ride any other bikes that will work with long forks (Wotans) and have short rear travel?

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    tlr – Thanks for joining in!! It’s not really that twitchy with 140mm forks, that comment has to be taken in context of the big mountain environment Jon was riding the bike, and that he knows it’d be nicer in that situation with 160mm forks. the Hemlock is actually at the slack end of the spectrum for trail bikes. For the UK it’ll be fine. I’m certainly enjoying a 140mm front end, and I’ve been out on DH trails recently and getting on well.

    I_ache – I’ve not ridden any other bike with that kind of setup. I’ve ridden a BFe with Wotans which about the closest thing for me personally.

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