Something @molgrips said to me a while ago has informed my approach to vehicles for quite some time: ‘better stick with the devil you know than the one you don’t.’ In other words, if you have a vehicle that works for you, you might as well just do your best to maintain it, even when the repairs might get a bit costly, insofar as getting a vehicle you don’t know that could have just as many problems, on top of the purchase cost, plus the pain in the arse of finding one in the first place, could make it less efficient for you.

All of this is to say that our 62 reg Mercedes Vito came out of its MOT with a long list of necessary repairs, details as follows:

– 307k miles
– prop shaft joint so worn, it is likely to fail
– anti-lock braking system lamp indicates fault
– electronic stability control lamp indicates fault
– exhaust emissions exceed manufacturer’s limit
– suspension arm pin excessively worn (both sides, front)
– vehicle structure corroded to extent that rigidity of the assembly is significantly reduced (both sides, front)
– parking brake efficiency below requirements

The garage that did the MOT could only guess at the cost of repairs, but they said at least £500, but closer to £1000, and probably more.

As a driver, I have always hated the vehicle, but my kids have loved it and said that it is the most comfortable we have had since the T4 Caravelle back in the early noughties.

The problem is that I don’t have any income right now, and Mrs SR’s income from work is very small, so repair is going to be difficult shy of putting it on a credit card. That leaves purchasing a new (to us) vehicle, which we might be able to do with assistance from my in-laws, and writing off the old Mercedes. Bear in mind that neither Mrs SR or I are very happy with the idea of asking her parents to foot the entire bill of a newer vehicle.

Question is: What would STW do?

Corrosion on 62 plate?
Where?

The rests all wear n tear really.

I’d plug it in for the abs and emission codes 1st?

307k? It’s done a good job.
Corrosion is a tricky one.

If it wasn’t for the current money situation I’d say it had had a good life and it was time to move it on.
Not much help…. Sorry.

Given the financial situation.

Do you need a car or is it just convenient.

I’m one for keeping a vehicle going for as long as possible and spending whatever they need on parts irrespective of the cars ‘book value’.

However corrosion is the killer of cars (and vans). I recently did a 6 month rebuild of our Volvo and spent considerable time underneath it sorting and preventing rust – however I drew the line with my 07 plate 120k mile Transit and scrapped it because of rust.

Yours doesn’t sound too good corrosion wise but you need to get under it and see how bad it is.

You need to understand the corrosion, that’s the killer.

Emissions might just need a good rag on premium fuel. Or it could be much worse.

The above two could be a quick fix or a grand doesn’t even come close.

ABS and ESP is both likely caused by an abs sensor fail, either loose wire or sensor fail.

Other stuff just wear

Think you need to understand the corrosion and emissions problems in more detail before you can make a call

Do you have a mechanic you trust?

How can you have little to no income and have averaged 30k a year ignoring CV and lockdown? Where the hell are you driving to?

Regardless. If the garage can make that lot good for £500 I’d be ripping their arm off. If you don’t like it then “the devil you know” or not at £300k+ on the clock I’d be moving it on. It owes you nowt.

That leaves purchasing a new (to us) vehicle, which we might be able to do with assistance from my in-laws, and writing off the old Mercedes. Bear in mind that neither Mrs SR or I are very happy with the idea of asking her parents to foot the entire bill of a newer vehicle.

Could they assist you with the repair bill perhaps?

Oof. Thats a long list. My original comments were made anticipating a car that you knew was good apart from one or two things. But that is a lot of things. The suspension stuff, that’s straightforward, but the emissions and rust, those would concern me. I’d be amazed if that lot were fixable for a grand.

Not sure what else to recommend except a part time job for a few weeks! I’d do you a deal on a Passat except it’s not got enough seats 🙂

How can you have little to no income and have averaged 30k a year ignoring CV and lockdown? Where the hell are you driving to?

I think he bought it a few years ago from an airport taxi company.

If it’s 1k to repair and you get your van back or xk for a new(er) vehicles is depends on how much longer that 1k will keep the van going?.

If 1k sorts. the van such that next not is only minor repairs then that sounds like a bargain but if it is round 2 of welding plus other bits I. A year’s time it is less good.

Then again at the moment with covid inflation 1k only gets you what was a £500 car a few years ago that you got a year out of and crossed your fingers for a second year so not much difference…

Tough decision. Is it your only vehicle in the house hold?

The other issue is lack of supply / Covid inflation.

I sold my MOT expired Transit as mentioned above for spares or repair and got £1200 for it. I semi replaced it with a 2004 Peugeot Partner/Berlingo multispace for £2400 (advertised at £2700) – that would have been £1k a few years ago. I went with a Bingo as I wasn’t willing to pay the even more inflated Covid van tax.

exhaust emissions exceed manufacturer’s limit

Some might say that wouldn’t be difficult… <cough>VW</cough>

Prop shaft could be refurbed. I scrapped my 55 plate Traveliner last year – call Wright Automotive on 0131 440 2472 to see if anyone has taken the prop shaft off it as I had it fully refurbished before rust killed my van.

However, if the rust is anywhere near structural points you are better scrapping it. It’ll be a lot of cutting and patching, and there will always be a nagging doubt that it will come back.

I simply don’t believe 500 or even 1000 is going to cover that list.

Chasing rust is a fools errand.

Molgrips was describing bangernomics with his comment it makes alot of sense when you have a handle on over all condition of the car or what is likely to go when things were replaced etc. It works on the concept that you don’t know the risks of a new car so there is value in the one you have. Until the balance tilts in favour of taking that risk.

Prop shafts at the point of failure, rust at that level sketchy emissions and brakes it’s sounds like you’ve run it into the ground which isn’t a criticism it’s an old high milage vehicle. I’m not sure I would be prepared to fork out for it. Tricky situation you’re in but as above is it vital you have a car? Have you considered a reaaaaaaaaallly long tandem?

I’d get rid !!

All the mechanicals are fixable and that price is pretty damn good. Corrosion is the tricky one as everyone has said.

Bearing in mind with the suspension pin noted above also being on the front the corrosion could easy be subframe or wishbone related.

Without getting under it we likely won’t know.

If it was major chasing rust they wouldn’t be giving ballparks of 500-1000 – 1000 pound doesn’t fix much rust at a commercial level never mind any of the other fails.

But at 300k on the clock Its alot of wedge to drop.

Im a big advocate of keeping older cars going but it sounds like she’s had it. That bill will be waaaay over 1k (which I’d pay in fairness) but it sounds like the thin end of the wedge and from your posts I think you’re not the most mechanically minded, so wouldn’t be looking to do any yourself? Shame but scrap.

If it comes to £1k or even £1.5k then you’re probably best repairing and continuing with that vehicle, in the current market.

That’s assuming the rust isn’t a terminal problem (as others have addressed).

Unless you can get a good deal on an alternative vehicle from a trusted source such as a friend or relative, of course.

Have you looked into how much you’d get from Webuyanycar (or similar sites) in its current state? Could you at least get some money back out if it and put towards something else?

If you get a new ticket on it for a grand then it’s definitely worth doing. Big vans/MPVs are silly money at the moment and often are used until they become unreliable so anything you do get could just as easily throw a big bill.

I’m normally one for chopping and changing, but it’s so hard to find good vehicles a reasonable prices. I ended up buying something I didn’t like and then getting my old car repaired for more than its original cost which was what I ought to have done in the first place.

There are a lot of sub 2k 7 seaters on Autotrader…

As others have said, it’s the mileage that makes it unappealing.

There are cars that have done a lot more than that, but it’s a gamble. If the rust is on something that can be unbolted and replaced, it could be far cheaper to source salvage parts.

The emissions is another, is it something like dirty injectors or something more serious.

If you’re after a Garage recommendation, I can offer central Garage in Llandaff North, he’s very popular with Taxi drivers and well used to patching up galactic mileage Mercedes. They kept my FILs 350k mile E Class on the road for years.

Chasing rust is a fools errand.

+1- sorting out a “little rust spot” on my Spitfire’s sill one summer turned into a multi-year body off rebuild!

As others have said, £500-£1k seems light- I’d almost expect that for each item by the time you factor in

Oh yeah, regarding garages there’s a place called Continental Cars on Ocean Way which is a Mercedes specialist. Not sure how many vans they see but they are great, very friendly and dispense a lot of information.

I can help with suspension and brake components and the like too if you need it. But as above – rust is a big worry.

As others have said, it’s the mileage that makes it unappealing.

On paper maybe, but if it’s been used as an airport taxi most of its life, it’s probably in a better state than something that’s done half that mileage delivering door-to-door.

I’m all for bangernomics, but for me it all comes down to that rust. Bear in mind that if you’re getting a garage to sort it out to a tight budget, they’re going to be doing the bare minimum to put a patch over the problem, not cutting out all the existing rust, treating the area and giving it long term protection, so you’re probably looking at it lasting a year or two before you’re back to square one. On the other hand, a bolt on subframe could be fifty quid from a breakers and good as new – did they point out the problem area when you picked it up and / or is it obvious?

I’m surprised the corrosion hasn’t been picked up before if it’s got to the stage of being an MOT failure.

It usually crops up as an advisory or as a ‘you need to keep an eye on that rust mate’ mention after a service or other maintenance.

@Toby makes a good point. Is it actually the chassis or a sub frame? Perhaps the latter which is why their estimate is so low?

If so, it changes the whole picture.

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the-muffin-man
Full Member

I’m surprised the corrosion hasn’t been picked up before if it’s got to the stage of being an MOT failure.

It usually crops up as an advisory or as a ‘you need to keep an eye on that rust mate’ mention after a service or other maintenance.

My ’07 plate Transit had been privately owned by me for 8 years- always washed underneath in winter, waxoyl’d and generally monitored and kept an eye on the underside. Never any advisory for rust, cue getting it ready for this year’s MOT and the sills literally fell out of it leaving massive gaping holes. Over the last year the whole van seems to have been dunked in the sea and stored in a sauna when I wasn’t looking.

First of all, thanks to all of you for your responses. Both Mrs SR and I found them very helpful. We will take it to a body shop too confirm, but we think it is both chassis and subframe based on last year’s MOT report.

That being the case, we still need a seven-seater, but we have the luxury of time to find a decent one. So…

Assuming the Vito is a goner, what I want is a vehicle of good enough quality that I actually want to maintain it, even if it isn’t the newest vehicle on the roads. And it looks like a 2007-ish Volvo XC90 might fit the bill.

Any knowledge of, or experience of, these? I am pretty pro-Volvo, but would consider any reasonable suggestion at this stage.

Is the XC90 a true 7? I’d be looking at Galaxies or Sharans myself. There are a few oddball 7 seater Japanese cars on Autotrader too.

I had a ’52 plate XC90 from new for about 12 years!
It was great for our young family of 5 plus 2 dogs. Not a lot of space in the boot when the rear 2 seats are up but it was fine.
Did about 32mpg but had a tendency to eat droplinks – these can be easy replaced yourself though.
The handbrake always caused problems at MOT time but I think they changed the system later on so you’d probably be fine.
Engines seem solid.

Oh, and it lost its 4wd ability at some point – no idea why but it didn’t make any difference TBH.

Ford galaxy. Much better for hauling children/bikes/dogs/etc than a Volvo.

I’m a massive Volvo fan – we’ve had our ’04 plate V70 for 12years, now with 200k miles on it.

I wouldn’t have a MK1 XC90.

They are too complex;
D5 is a good engine but some are very expensive tax wise (iirc 2006+),
Autoboxes are very weak (£2k repair once removed) and manuals are very rare. Avoid the T6 at all costs
Eats suspension components
Body shells not immune from corrosion despite being galvanized – our V70 rusted through on the strut turret (I repaired it).
Active models all have split/damaged seat materials
Can strip the transfer box spline coupling

They are cheap for a reason. Look at 7seat V70’s instead or rust free Jap import Honda Stpwagon/Elgrand etc and Dinitrol/Waxoyl before winter.

Get this now:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202010295584256

Get this now:

How well did your last impulse buy go? 😉

Zafera isn’t a bad motor either.

Dont go grey import if you want a quiet life! Trust me.

Are you in a low emission zone as that’s something to watch out for!

But it’s all down to that corrosion!

My ’07 plate Transit had been privately owned by me for 8 years- always washed underneath in winter, waxoyl’d and generally monitored and kept an eye on the underside. Never any advisory for rust, cue getting it ready for this year’s MOT and the sills literally fell out of it leaving massive gaping holes.

Happened to me on my 90 last weekend. Mot in February , tester commented how solid the chassis was for a 35 year old truck. it’s done about 1000miles since. Replacing the exhaust saw a crusty bit under the driver rear outrigger gave it a poke ….. Cut out 18inches of the bottom 3 inches of chassis before I found anything to weld to. Wierdly localised too. The rear passed the lump hammer test.

Active models all have split/damaged seat materials

What does this mean…. the seat coverings are not good? The stitching on the drivers seat on mine gave way – I had to stitch it back together myself!!

Can strip the transfer box spline coupling

Ahhh yes, that happened to mine.

Autoboxes are very weak

Jesus, it’s amazing what I’ve forgotten!!
The flywheel on mine got all chewed up and it cost about £800 to fix. Steering rack went as well. The last straw was then one of the engine core plugs let quite a lot of oil escape on my driveway 2 days before we were going to use it to go on holiday – new core plug £5 but it cost £800 to take the gearbox off to fit the new plug!!

So, no, don’t get a Mk1 XC90!!!