I confirm that my Jones BB height is 280mm, mine doesn’t have an EBB, but most do, so I presume it could be even lower if you desired.

Interesting article but all the guy has done is tried to build a bike that suits his own personal skills and riding style. Thing is Chris Porter is a not actually all that good an all round bike rider. He did Ok for an old man racing gravity events on the latest equipment but any properly good competitor could have beaten him on a short travel steep angled hardtail. Put Chris on the same hardtail and his results would have been laughable.

JCL. I’m not sure what you mean by advocating 150mm cranks, but why don’t you just fit a set? unless you’re around 5ft or smaller or only ride uplifted you probably won’t find them very nice. Profile do everything you’d need.

Very good that Jim 😉

Are you having a stroke? You keep putting winking things after everything.

The article was quite interesting. I don’t really like the writing style and the irony of the importer of Fox railing against herd mentality was a good one though.

JCL. I’m not sure what you mean by advocating 150mm cranks, but why don’t you just fit a set? unless you’re around 5ft or smaller or only ride uplifted you probably won’t find them very nice. Profile do everything you’d need.

Yeah but they weigh a ton and they aren’t PF30. Sram/Shimano should drop 175mm and do 150/160/170mm.

tomd – Member 
Very good that Jim
Are you having a stroke? You keep putting winking things after everything.

The article was quite interesting. I don’t really like the writing style and the irony of the importer of Fox railing against herd mentality was a good one though.

POSTED 2 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST

What a nasty comment! My girlfriend has suffered a stroke and its really not nice to ridicule..I hope you don’t ever find yourself having to look after someone after a stroke… Tool

I’m sure it was a joke.
I’ve heard worse on daytime telly to be honest

Interesting article but all the guy has done is tried to build a bike that suits his own personal skills and riding style. Thing is Chris Porter is a not actually all that good an all round bike rider. He did Ok for an old man racing gravity events on the latest equipment but any properly good competitor could have beaten him on a short travel steep angled hardtail. Put Chris on the same hardtail and his results would have been laughable.

Isn’t that what he (and racer) should be doing, making the best bike that suits their skill and style?

It already is what he’s doing. It’s nothing new and it’s nothing any of us couldn’t attempt so long as you can justify the cost.

JCL. Yeah, as far as I know PF30 and profiles are not (yet?) compatible. I wouldn’t rule them out on weight alone though. Profile racing cranks with their Ti axle and an aftermarket spider are very close in weight and arguably comparable to Saint in strength /stiffness and durability. I know those are the qualities I’d be looking for from a crank for a properly low BB long travel bike.

If you want a 150mm crank, would the easy way not just be to find a solid-armed crank and shorten it ?

I don’t think I’d like it though- I can’t really tell any difference between my 175s and 170s when riding but my 165s felt a bit odd, not when pedalling but when flat pedalled- gives you a shorter stance. Whether better or worse I don’t know, but weird anyway.

When I ride a bike with 175’s it feels like I’m surfing.

I wonder to what extent longer cranks just feel right for me, because I’m used to them…

It’s actually not that you don’t notice the difference between your bikes with 170s and others with 175s. It’s simply down to muscle memory that they both feel “right” when you jump on each bike despite the change in crank length. Whether you are aware of the difference is another matter entirely.

It’s amazing how 10mm difference in the length allows you to move around more. It’s like going from a 100 to a 125mm dropper.

TBH, hitting stuff with your pedals is always going to be a risk, with any (serviceable) length of crank. If you get the impact just right (wrong?), with the crank about 15 degrees forward of bottom-dead-centre the results can be spectacular – like those airbag pranks all over the net ATM – and you feel like your being forcibly ejected from the bike.

mtbel – Member

It’s actually not that you don’t notice the difference between your bikes with 170s and others with 175s.

No, it really is- I once got the arms mixed up and put a 170 on one side and 175 on the other of each of my bikes, didn’t notice that either.

Northwind – Member

If you want a 150mm crank, would the easy way not just be to find a solid-armed crank and shorten it ?

it’s proving tricky to find any suitable cranks – all the nice ones are hollow, or scooped out (on the back – see deore)

my 165s felt a bit odd, not when pedalling but when flat pedalled- gives you a shorter stance. Whether better or worse I don’t know, but weird anyway.

conversely, my poor wife* has to put up with 165’s. if i wanted to experience just how weird/crap this must feel, i’d need to find 210mm cranks. No wonder her knees hurt.

(*she’s not even ‘that’ short, it’s just that for some reason the largest component manufacturers pretend that people under 5’8″ don’t exist)

Northwind, please refer to my last sentence. This could be down to you not riding all that much, only riding for short periods of time on each bike, length of time between riding each or just simple lack of perception. But I’d be surprised if you were to ride one of the bikes exclusively for a few hours each day for a few weeks then switch straight over to the other and not notice a slight difference in feel while pedalling .

mtbel – Member

Northwind, please refer to my last sentence. This could be down to you not riding all that much, only riding for short periods of time on each bike, length of time between riding each or just simple lack of perception.

I really don’t know what you’re getting at- you say “It’s not that you don’t notice” then come up with “lack of perception”- which is exactly what not noticing means- it’s imperceptible to me, it makes no noticable difference.

I’ve got 170s on the winter road bike, 172.5s on the summer road bike and 175s on the MTB. I can’t tell any difference between any of them, irrespective of how many hours I spend riding each one.

JCL, you do realise when switching to a shorter crank in order to maintain optimum pedalling efficiency you actually need to raise your saddle height by the same amount?
5mm shorter cranks (when stood pedal level) will only allow 1mm extra clearance at the pelvis and a tiny amount of extra extension /squat through the minute change in ankle, knee and hip angles.

I have a 155mm set of Canfield cranks.

I am 175cm tall, with fairly average build. It’s fair to say that you notice the loss of 20mm of crank length if you’re pedalling. I think I could detect reduced leverage and a much lighter feel – you spin nicely but it does feel a lot lighter and I wasn’t convinced I could get the same power.

Ought to experiment some more. I tried 175mm back-to-back and ended up leaving them on rather longer than I intended!

Thing is Chris Porter is a not actually all that good an all round bike rider.

Sorry got to call you on that, Chris is pretty good on a bike and has podiumed at national events.

Confusing, I know. just part of what I typed probably isn’t helping you either.
Muscle memory through repetition is what I meant by “notice”
what your body notices, your mind does not necessarily perceive. 😉

I’ll explain to you in person if you come to the Golfie on Saturday.

I’ll be racing up at kinlochleven. Noticing just means being aware of something, all you’re doing is giving various reasons not to notice something, while saying “it’s not that you didn’t notice”. But it is.

Sorry got to call you on that, Chris is pretty good on a bike and has podiumed at national events.

He said he’s not a good “all round rider”, he could be a very good DH racer…

I can assure you he is, not got any reason to ‘big him up’ either. 😉

If he’s reading this he’ll be pissing himself laughing

He knows fine he’s not that great “all round” Loco. The guy rides 170mm travel at trail centres. Stick him on a traditional XC hardtail or a BMX and I’m sure he’ll be laughing (but for entirely different reasons) 😉

I’ve used 165mm cranks – and I definitely notice the difference, much more of a ‘spinny’ feel to them.

futon – did you keep the same gearing, or did you adjust for the reduction in crank length?

I’ve used 165mm cranks – and I definitely notice the difference, much more of a ‘spinny’ feel to them.

^^This. I find I can turn them up to speed much faster than a longer crank.

Does any of this relate to someone (like me) who gets their 8 year old hardtail out of the shed and rides around the Surrey Hills once a week, being sure to avoid all the scary looking drops and jumps?

If you had a 20 foot long bike with a 45 degree head angle you could ride all that stuff. You might not be able to get round any of the corners though.

JCL, you do realise when switching to a shorter crank in order to maintain optimum pedalling efficiency you actually need to raise your saddle height by the same amount?

Yep. It’d probably mean I could just get away with a 150mm dropper without it bottoming on the seat tube.

Regardless it’s better for cornering, reducing leg fatigue while descending, ground clearance.

So the shorter cranks, better feet level or up and down? For the up and down some fat pedals and soles would show it for the cranks flat moving cleats back should do it too.

HoratioHufnagel – Member
Does any of this relate to someone (like me) who gets their 8 year old hardtail out of the shed and rides around the Surrey Hills once a week, being sure to avoid all the scary looking drops and jumps?

No. The fun police have decreed that that is to be classified as tow path riding and therefore outside the acceptable limits of what is considered proper cycling.

Chris Porter is knowledgeable, no doubt but still comes across as a narrow-minded male chicken (but people who’ve met him seem to say he’s a decent bloke…)

BigDummy – Member
futon – did you keep the same gearing, or did you adjust for the reduction in crank length?

POSTED 4 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST

I can’t remember !! Lol

I might try them again, obviously raises your CofG a bit, which I suppose works a bit against having the super low BB, but I liked that it also put a bit more weight over the bars, but that then put more pressure on my hands ( rigid bike) – so many swings, so many roundabouts!

I noticed the difference between 175mm and 170mm – I feel like I’m pedalling smoother circles with the shorter cranks. I swapped to a 32t from a 34t at the same time and that’s working out well.