I quite like the addition of driving with sat nav as it’s an extra thing to think about and so many people go to crap behind the wheel when following sat nav.

Don’t hand them a map then.

I’ve been driving 40odd years and would have been quite happy to take a retest every 5. I’d take one tomorrow with no preparation dammit. Probably fail on braking distances though.

clarification please, you don’t agree with retesting, or you don’t agree with the 5 year timescale?

Was that mine? Time scale more than anything if it’s from my post.

A retest for every driver every 5 years is just unfeasable for the cost of such a scheme, I find it difficult to imagine anyway that implementing such a scheme would be anyway workable.

Plus I’m not sure our roads are that bad that millions of drivers need bringing in for a retest every 5 years. Professional drivers such as lorries and taxis quite agree there should be more enforced testing.
Retest after accidents is possibly a thing that could work.

I have a low opinion of other people and I suspect retesting would just end up with people behaving for the test and then acting like dicks again afterwards.

Areas I suspect are a problem are medical problems and eyesight which could be picked up by adding a medical and eyetest requirement to the 10 year licence renewal.

I favour education, from school age, about Road Use for all road users and let the problems of older drivers die off and be removed by the medical tests and normal licence renewals.

Roads are going to change over the next 10 to 20 years anyway as someone pointed out.

In order to dispel any doubt in anyone’s mind (and thus to increase chances of improved behaviour and successful prosecution), I’d like mandatory questions in the written bit about:

Under what circumstances is it acceptable to use your phone when driving a car?
How much space should be given to bicycles/horses/pedestrians on roads when passing (would need a formal definiotion in the HC first)?
Where should a satnav device be positioned?
What should a driver do when blinded by the glare of the sun?
Why do cycliststs not ride closer to the kerb? 😉

Fairly sure that identifying where fluids go was part of my test.

In the cup holder?

Professional drivers such as lorries and taxis quite agree there should be more enforced testing.

lorry drivers fair enough*, but why would a taxi driver need retests when travelling reps, who possibly spend more time driving, wouldn’t?

retest is the most important I reckon, most people seem to do enough to pass the test then forget it all. Being forced to occasionally show that you can drive properly shouldn’t be a big issue. The suggested 3 month probation for failing a retest seems a bit of a sop, if you need your licence then, as per those with >9 points, you should be driving better not crying about it after you’ve screwed up. And yes I’d be quite happy for us all to do newer revised tests.
Motorway driving is a close second, it’s barmy that you can scoot out on to a completely different road system on your own minutes after passing.
Realistic parking spaces.
Staged licence for engine size/HP, insurance only regulates this for poor people, if your mum and dad are minted you’re potentially driving a supercar on your 17th birthday.
Making sure vulnerable road user stuff is definitely part of the test rather than possibly being a random question and possibly having to pass some on your test. You’re definietely going to be sharing the road with some during your time driving

*don’t they already? not sure

What are we, something like 4th safest country to drive in? I’d leave it as is, or perhaps add an element of car control, slid pan or circuit, something off the road.

Explain what these are for

Motorway driving is a close second, it’s barmy that you can scoot out on to a completely different road system on your own minutes after passing.

Motorways are the safest places you can drive. You learn and take your test in much more complex and dangerous circumstances than a motorway.

On a motorway theres only one kind of junction, you’re physically separated from oncoming traffic, theres no pedestrians or cyclists of horses, or combine harvesters. Theres not even any learner drivers – they’re better maintained and better designed and they’re miles safer.

Why would you need to better qualified or need special training to drive on a road thats designed to make driving as safe as possible?

Based on observing drivers:

* what indicators are for
* when to use (and not use) fog lights
* how mini roundabouts work
* overtaking cyclists
* SMIDSY avoidance
* not using mobile phones
* amber means stop if safe
* red means stop

Why would you need to better qualified or need special training to drive on a road thats designed to make driving as safe as possible?

yes motorways are safer than standard roads but it’s still a different style of driving at faster speeds. Dunno what it’s like round the rest of the country but I had no 70mph DC experience in my training (some 50mph) And it’s been discussed several times before so I don’t think it’s just me.

I’d retest people after every crash* or every allocation of points rather than fixed intervals. Anyone with over [some arbitrary level] points total on their license can have mandatory “augmented” testing to higher standards.
*Both parties in a crash unless fault could obviously be attributed to one side only

I’d retest people after every crash* or every allocation of points rather than fixed intervals. Anyone with over [some arbitrary level] points total on their license can have mandatory “augmented” testing to higher standards.

Just banning from driving after a serious speeding offence would help, rather than letting people off if they claim hardship.

yes motorways are safer than standard roads but it’s still a different style of driving at faster speeds. Dunno what it’s like round the rest of the country but I had no 70mph DC experience in my training (some 50mph) And it’s been discussed several times before so I don’t think it’s just me.

It depends where you live I guess. Round here there are loads of 60 and 70mph three lane dual carriageways with motorway style sliproads. If you can drive on those (with no hardshoulder) then you can drive on a motorway.

But there aren’t motorways everywhere, if you live in Thurso, should you have to do a 9 hour return trip so that you can drive on a couple of miles of the M90?

Most of the things that people are listing as problems aren’t a lack of ability. Everybody is capable of leaving their phone alone, or using indicators, or not speeding, or safely passing a horse or cyclist. The issue is that people simply choose not to do those things. Skidpan training and the like is all well and good, but how many crashes are caused by skids that would have been avoided if the driver steered into it rather than against it? And how many are caused by doing 70mph while writing a text message, or simply not paying attention, or squeezing past a cyclist because you don’t want to slow down.The idiot 2 inches off your bumper on the motorway isn’t unable to drive with a safe stopping distance, he just wants to bully you out of the way.

I don’t think that better ‘Roadcraft’ (the book’s worth a read btw) is a bad thing. But a lot of the problems on the road are to do with what people choose to do rather than what they’re able to do. But how do you fix that?

“Hello Mr Jones, are you a raging psycho who’ll try to run anyone off the road if they so much as look at you?”

“Ye…..er…nooo, honest”

“okay, here’s your licence”

On a motorway theres only one kind of junction

…and still so many drivers don’t know how to use them.

The issue isn’t necessarily the test. It’s the period after getting a licence where they are effectively licensed to do everything with limited experience. They need to learn to drive motorways and at night etc.
Time they looked at rules such as no passengers for the first year or so, limited night driving.

And fourth safest in the world is alright. But over 3000 a year still die…

Just banning from driving after a serious speeding offence would help, rather than letting people off if they claim hardship*.

agreed, assumng shooting’s not an option

… but there’s an argument that obliging anyone who scores that high to pass, say, their advanced test within a 6 month period would make the roads safer for longer than a 6-12 month ban

*selling his “s-line” mowtah might have allowed a bit bigger fine than 800 quid, too. I wonder what his career earnings have been.

On a motorway theres only one kind of junction

…and still so many drivers don’t know how to use them.

But again, do they not know, or does the regional deputy sales manager in his 318d fly up the outside and sweep across from lane 3->2->1->sliproad because that’s just what he want to do because it’s quicker and more convenient for him?

Admittedly, there are the rare people who come to a stop on the slip road, or trundle down it at 20mph, but the ‘sweepers’ are probably more dangerous.

More reversing practice.

You should of seen the most useless bit of reversing ever, yesterday.

Massive lorry gone up the wrong lane and had to reverse out. Sadly a obviously new driver got right up and was made to reverse with obvious reluctance.

Ti was a little car and it had to reverse about 500m, it was up the banks, in the gutter wondering all over the place. It was like rhythmic gymnastics for cars without the finesse.

At one point it tried to pull in and expected the lorry to reverse past, much to the face palm moment from the lorry driver who had to exit the cab and go explain to the hopeless driver of the car.

Fun to watch, feel sympathy for the lorry driver.

More reversing practice. with a standalone reversing test…. with a trailer you cant see 😉

The ones I dislike are those who barge on assuming anyone in the inside lane will move over for them, regardless of the traffic in outer lanes.

Time they looked at rules such as no passengers for the first year or so, limited night driving.

So my son couldn’t drive to work, nor pick his workmate up – either after 4pm or before 8am (Scotland in winter)?

Interestingly, in Spain, driver’s are automatically deemed at fault if they hit a cyclist, if feel far safer biking in Spain as 99% of drivers give you about 2 meters when passing, or they sit patiently until they can pass safely.

There was an interesting piece on sky news this morning, with British cycling, an their rep made a very good point, in the driving test, safely overtaking a cyclist should be a mandatory manuvre, alongside parallel parking or reversing around a corner.

taking a test for around 45 minutes isnt enough.
i know quite a few who have passed and then gone on to show how bad or dangerous they are behind the wheel that i wouldnt wish my worst enemy to get in the car with them…yet just because they managed to show some control and concentration for 45 minutes it was deemed that they were worthy of a pass.
tests should be scrapped in favour of a range of assessments by the instructor. once the instructor is satisfied that the driver meets the safety and ability requirements then they should be awarded a pass.
retests every 5-10 years should also be introduced