TL;CBATR – Sherpa v3 or SolarisMax with a 120mm fork as complement to Banshee prime? Or something else (Scotland friendly, 29er, £700 max, preferably steel, not carbon)?

Having sold loads of old bits over the last couple of months I can afford a 29er hardtail frame and SLX drive train and do a bits box build to complement my Banshee Prime V2. I recently sold my 10 year old singular swift singlespeed as I could no longer ride it comfortably. I’m 6 ft and the reach on the Swift (~410 mm) was so short compared to the Prime (~480 mm). I know what I like about both bikes but I’m struggling to translate that into what my ideal hardtail would look like. Test rides are out of the window at the moment too so I’m reduced to agonising on the internet.

It will be for local woods rides, longer rides, winter night rides, exploring ill advised paths, natural undulating moorland trails, trail centres and towing kiddie trailers/followme tandem. So basic trail riding really that seems a bit tame on the Prime.

I’ve always wanted a Cotic so the new Solaris is on the table, but I’ve also always had a soft spot for Stanton as they are made just around the corner from where I grew up, so the Sherpa v3 is also being looked at.

However, looking at the geo charts they are very different; the 19″ Sherpa (my size according to charts being 6ft tall) being the same reach as a Med Solaris (the size below my recommended one) but having >2″ more seat tube and 1 degree steeper HA. Ths seems a bit odd considering that both bikes are described as being designed around doing the same thing! The Solaris geometry is close to my Prime, which I regard as pretty aggro. Certainly the prime still sometimes feels too long (low speed manuals/drops mainly), although whether this is real or imagined I don’t know. I probably just need to adapt and practice.

I suppose that as you use fork travel the reach on a hardtail gets longer so the solaris will go from very long (486mm) to absurd (in my head). But perversely I look at the Sherpa and think that the reach seems too short (461mm). I tried to find some info or opinion pieces about the rationale behind modern hardtail geometry but really struggled to find anything informative. Can anybody point me in the right direction?

I’ll be using some 120 mm MRP stage forks (51 mm offset) so I’m erring towards the Sherpa as I can run a 50mm stem with the slightly steeper HA to keep the front behaving with longer offset forks. <span style=”font-size: 12.8px;”>I was able to instantly notice the front wheel grip improving swapping from the 51mm offset Stages to a 42 mm offset lyrik on my Prime. Since the change I’ve swapped from a 50mm stem to 35mm. </span><span style=”font-size: 0.8rem;”>At this point the Sherpa with 50mm stem will only be 10mm shorter overall than the Solaris with 35mm stem so I imagine that I’m getting twisted up over nothing. The stages will only run at <130mm now after a well known servicing company scored the stanchions badly (and then denied all knowledge) so that they don’t hold air at 150mm travel and wreck the seals.</span>

There are other issues with both bikes regarding cosmetics, using parts that I already have or compatibility with kiddie trailers

Sherpa – Good: Maxle, 31.9 seatpost, Bad: all of the Stanton colours look like tinted Hammerite to me and the graphics look dated.

Solaris – Good: the new orange is lovely, bondage theme bottle mounts, Bad: Syntace X12 axle, 31.6 seatpost, new head badge leaves me cold.

but for now will somebody please explain their geometry or suggest other options!

I have a mk1 Sherpa. The figures seem really short in terms of contemporary geometry (438mm reach I think and a slackish seat tube angle) but it’s fine to ride! I’m 6ft bang on and run mine with a 60mm stem and 100mm forks – handling is really sharp. Remember there’s no rear suspension so the seat angle will steepen when you sit on the thing with the suspension fork sag. I’d say mine is a little wandery on steep climbs which the newer geometry should improve.

My riding is similar to yours – full susser skill compensates the stuff from the door too much so most of my riding is on the Sherpa. Young family means days away to ride are the exception rather than the rule as in days gone by! Great bikes.

I will give my opinion based on my experience of both bikes (but in their previous incarnations).

I have a mk2 SolarisMAX (dark metal, one of the first LS frames out the door from Cotic, there was a thread about and it is available for background info). I liked it so much (it improved my riding significantly at the time) I bought a SodaMAX and sold DM.

I bought the Sherpa knocking on 4 years ago (142mm was the standard axle then!) as I wanted to run 3” B+ tyres/wheelset. It was to replace the old mk1 Solaris which was bowing its age geo wise. I wanted something a bit longer and a bit slacker. I went from alayback pin to an in-line (and a 65mm stem to a 55mm). As this was an internet exercises I had never therown a leg over a Stanton before mine arrived. My very first impression was, woah, this feels a bit shorter than I was expecting…

There were a few niggles on the way on the Stanton, i’m not going to relay them all but a) forks were only 100mm (they should’ve been 120’s RS sent non-boost forks in a boost box…) b) the chain line meant I never got the lowest 2 gears and c) the 35mm dia stem/bars I never could get so I didn’t end up with shoulder ache after >2 hours riding (I cHanged to a 55mm/31.8 combo which did the trick…

So there was a bit of buyers regret to factor in but I subsequently got a mk1 SolarisMAX built up purely as a bikepacker (there’s a thread on that one too if you fancy). For dicking about the woods, etc., the Stanton was definitely the better bike. For all day comfort, the SolarisMAX won hands down.

Which is all fine and well until the LS version arrived. It was just better, much better, a game changer for me. Got me back riding a bike properly for the first time in years. So much so that I decided I could actually justify getting a full susser again.

So for riding, I’d chose the SolarisMAX. Based on my personal experience of the ‘new gen’ Sherpa and mk2 SolarisMAX. For me the Sherpa is too short and too steep. I don’t think it’s changed that significantly to the mk3.

For looks? Well the Sherpa is nicer for sure. If I wanted one just to look at, it’d be the stanton for sure. The Cotic headtube badge, if you are worried about it then you ain’t riding hard enough. Electrical tape covers a multitude of evils (and protects against luggage rub).

My SodaMAX is shod with 130mm Helms, I’m happy with that.

ETA: I’m a couple mm short of 6’ riding large frames in both marques.

Further ETA: I noticed the 10mm difference on the FlareMAX to SolarisMAX during the demo at Laggan (the RocketMAX i also demoed is/was(?) the same). I opted for a 45mm stem on my own FlareMAX as a consequence to compensate…

Dammit, meant to say that according to the Cotic IG feed, the new SolarisMAX’s are all but sold out on pre-order. I’d suggest you make your mind up quick (before it’s made up for you) 🤪

I ride a Solaris Max, previous version and a Banshee Prime V2. Solaris is a small and the Banshee is a medium, I am 5’7 and a bit (I’m sure I used to be 5’8). I can’t remember the reach numbers off my head but the Prime now feels too short, I put a 50mm stem on it and it still does’t feel as good as it did before. I run the Solaris with a 140mm and 150mm on the Prime both MRPs.
Have done Dartmoor and the Gap, Quantocks on both bikes and I now struggle deciding on which bike to take where as before the FS was a no brainer.
Next purchase a new FS frame to repalce the Prime. I cannot comment on the Stanton other than when I was looking the numbers didn’t add up for my size personally. I spoke to Cotic when buying my Solaris and they nailed on size for me, I’m sure Stanton could advise you just as well

Solaris sounds like a better fit for you.

I have a MK2 Sherpa and have been contemplating a new Solaris Max for a few weeks, albeit more as a ‘cheaper’ way to test progressive geometry than as part of a plan to get rid of the Sherpa. If I liked it, I envisage swiftly selling it on and buying a Flaremax or Orange Stage EVo to complement the Stanton. To buy the progressive FS could be an expensive mistake if progressive geo doesn’t work for me?

Re the Stanton, I figure it will be a better complement to (my future progressive) full susser than a Solaris Max? I use my Sherpa with plus wheels and at 5’11” the 19” fits OK with a 50mm stem. It’s beautifully made and quite a refined ride, although the paint dulls quickly, which given the premium for it is disappointing. On smoother trails, I can swap 29” XC wheels in, which makes it super fast on twisty singletrack both up and down

I have a Sherpa Mk2 and love it – using it for everything you describe (except the Follow-me bit as the kids are bigger now).

Last week was the Touch Hills, yesterday was the local woods and tomorrow is Ben Cleuch.

I am 6ft (plus an inch if standing up straight) and in Stirling. Feel free to visit for a test ride if that helps.

Afternoon.

6 ft V2 Prime rider here. From the reach, I guess you’re riding the XL, whereas I chose the L (450mm Reach), mostly because of my duck legs. I don’t think the Prime is overly long in the cockpit, but it does have rather long chainstays. IMO it’s what makes it a traction monster when climbing and so stable at speed in the rough for its relatively short rear travel.

My hardtail for the last year has been a medium Pole Taival (reach 480mm) and prior to that I had a Last bikes Fastforward (450mm reach in large). The last was my ‘cheap’ introduction to new skool LLS, and its the basis on which I bought the Prime.

The Sherpa was never bleeding edge LLS anyway, but its looking rather traditional geo wise these days. Even the Slackline and Switchback have been well overtaken in LLS stakes by some brands.

I can’t comment on the new Solaris max, but what I will say WRT my experiences of LLS hardtails is that, propertly executed, they’re better than traditional geometry by some margin. I think if you got the Sherpa, you’d be disappointed how it felt compared to the Prime, so get the Solaris!

Thanks all, I think if the Stanton hadn’t been updated in reach for the new frames to be an inch longer it would have been easy. I think I’ll email Stanton and ask them the rationale behind their geometry. The reviews of the Solaris talk about it being like a freight train, which isn’t what I want and sounds too similar to my FS. I want a mile munching, singletrack bike to complement the FS.

Any other manufacturers to consider in the same price bracket?

The reviews of the Solaris talk about it being like a freight train

It looks, and sounds, more akin to the Switch9er in terms of intent.. which is a bit of a bruiser.

Whichever you choose, check on the lead times to avoid disappointment at the moment..

I think thats more likely to be the Bfe Max than the Solaris.

I’d agree with Scienceofficer, the Solaris seems like a more adaptable bike, rather than bruiser. It seems to vary on build kit / forks. Make it want you like.

Whereas the new Bfe Max is the bruiser of the range.

Might have a Solaris max frame soon? 1 year old. My back just can’t take it any more. Red Dwarf in large.

Thanks for the comments. Is there an authoratitive article anywhere on LLS geometry and ht vs fs?

“Is there an authoratitive article anywhere on LLS geometry and ht vs fs?”

I’ve never found one but I’ve done a lot of thinking and fiddling myself, on the mission to get both my bikes to be easy to swap between.

I’ve found that having the sagged geometry near identical works very well. You don’t need to worry about the hardtail getting longer in reach as you go deeper into the travel as the same happens to the full-sus when the fork compresses but the rear suspension extends (like when braking down steep stuff). The main difference between my two is the chainstay length but I help that by having the bars higher on the bike with longer chainstays, so the leverage to manual is closer.

It might seem like having a hardtail with LLS geometry will be too extreme and dull on less interesting trails but it’s still a hardtail and that keeps it lively – instant pumping and pedalling response, and the ground constantly pushes/kicks back.