If you, your partner, parents, kids, dog etc were involved in an incident, that resulted in an injury, with somebody taking part in an illegal race would you pursue the matter legally with the rider and the promoter?

Yep

EDIT: Ahh, I see what you’re on about now, I hadn’t read that thread.

Still Yep

what about if it was promoted by your favorite magazine…

Video: This Is Sheffield Mass Start DH…

Are we counting SSUK under this as well, in which case definitely. 😛

Absolutely, on a shared use trail. And also if there was no race but they were riding without consideration of other users (ie recklessy, carelessly etc).

The racing bit is a red herring. Mattjg is right – if riding recklessly and they injure then yes – I don’t care if they were stravaing/racing (which would be nigh on impossible to prove in any case) or just riding along.

Depends on the circumstances. If you’ve actually suffered damages which result in loss of income, or damage to your bike, then maybe.

If you’ve just ended up with a couple of bruises and are a wee bit sore, absolutely not. Mountain biking, and racing in particular, is a dangerous sport. Don’t be surprised when you get hurt!

Forgot to add…

You are walking, not on a bike.

I still think I would only do it if I’d suffered an actual injury, not just bruising/shock/minor cut etc.

First off, just to say that I hate the idea of the compensation culture that is developing. But sometimes people should sue, because they need to.

I knew someone who was in a normal family car that got hit by a rally car exiting a special stage and joining the public roads.

The rally car wasn’t racing at the time just “hurrying” between special stages. The family in the car lost one life and the other three suffered severe injuries. The rally car wasn’t really damaged (but that’s beside the point). In cases like this a law suit is the right thing so that the injured can try to get their lives back on track.

‘illegal’ racing is breaking criminal law.

suing for damages relating to an injury is covered civil law.

they are quite separate processes – however interconnected they may be.

IANAL, but as someone who’s worked in the fringes of personal injury law you’re not going to get a definite answer to this. It depends on so many things including the severity of the injury, having someone to sue, and the pushiness of whatever firm the injured party decides to consult. The criminal aspect of it would be very unlikely to come up, but if someone was successfully prosecuted they wouldn’t have much defence to a civil claim.

I could tell you some hair-raising stories about what people get sued for – running into someone else when hurrying down a high street for example – but such incidents are few and far between.

What disturbs me more is the “treat everyday riding like a race” mentality and recording and advertising this activity. The FC here have just had kittens after the local DHers tried to promote a mate’s race on their land. It’s a bit early to say, but it might have knocked back a previously amicable relationship which has taken a good few years to build up.

In extreme cases, people have no effective choice but to sue.

Assuming the injuries were of the same degree(unlikely but since we’re talking in hypotheticals…)

If this happened on the road (a mixed use right of way) there would be no debate. Don’t see why there would be in this case.

No, I wouldn’t, because I’m not the fun police.

What good would actually come from suing the person? Really? It’s not like with a car accident where their insurance would cover any damages. We’re talking about a cock load of money here, when including legal fees etc, probably putting said person into debt for god knows how many years. Even if I, say, broke a leg, I doubt I’d sue. I’d probably shout at them, but not sue.

Also, I think mates races are great and are really pushing the sport forward in the UK. Where do you draw the line at “racing”, a couple of mates chasing each other down a trail? A guy rushing back to the carpark before the meter runs out?

As with ALL aspects of riding, there’s a balance. Common sense prevails as always. Do you guys reeeaaaally think that people are going to get so hyped up over a mates race that they’ll t-bone you and the Missis over a cliff? If I paid £60 for a proper race entry, I’d want satisfaction, but these races are about fun, not accurate timing or winning.

🙄

As with ALL aspects of riding, there’s a balance. Common sense prevails as always. Do you guys reeeaaaally think that people are going to get so hyped up over a mates race that they’ll t-bone you and the Missis over a cliff? I

Yes, but if it has come to the point when they have run into you then it implies that common sense has already gone out of the window.

Would you have the same outlook if you were self-employed and had a manual job where a broken limb would stop you working (and therefore earning) for say a couple of months ?

I think this was being “promoted” somewhere in the Lakes which being a National Park is a sensitive area anyway.
Lots of people have been doing good work getting biking facilities into the Lakes over the years, stuff like this and the shop vid that got pulled/slagged last year may set back future plans.
Locally we started a trail maint group with FC. Some numpties hijacked our group name, took some photos of their off-piste building, created a Facebook page announcing they were looking for helpers 🙄
Got pulled rather sharpish 👿

Would you have the same outlook if you were self-employed and had a manual job where a broken limb would stop you working (and therefore earning) for say a couple of months ?

Possibly not. I can’t say, as I’m not in that position. Still, it’s a risk that comes with self employment. It would seem like a sensible idea to have a small contingency stash for such occasions. Mountain biking is dangerous, as is manual labour, chances are that at some point injury might arise.

I’m not entirely sure who you would sue anyway, now that I think about it.

Hey dazzlingboy,

You think it would be really difficult to prove that these people were racing? I just looked at the video and it looks exactly like they were racing. Do you mean it would be hard to prove that the offender was part of the group maybe?

Anyway, its always fun until someone gets hurt. In areas which are public you have to be careful. Its stuff like that that gets biking banned from great places. Its about respect for all users.

Do people not have a personal insurance?

I guess if someone posted up on Facebook ‘gonna go out and smash a fast time on the working man race segment tonight’ you could prove it was the racing that caused the (hypothetical) accident. Otherwise how would you? I suppose Strava history if you’d tried it before?

I’m not entirely sure who you would sue anyway, now that I think about it.

The guy who promoted it as a race. Hence the need for insurance.

Would you have the same outlook if you were self-employed and had a manual job where a broken limb would stop you working (and therefore earning) for say a couple of months ?

Possibly not. I can’t say, as I’m not in that position. Still, it’s a risk that comes with self employment. It would seem like a sensible idea to have a small contingency stash for such occasions. Mountain biking is dangerous, as is manual labour, chances are that at some point injury might arise.

I’m not entirely sure who you would sue anyway, now that I think about it.

Just to be clear the thread is about a racer/rider hitting another trail user e.g. walker, horse rider etc. not involved in the race. The person who’d be suing is the person who’s been injured by the racer. Reckless or not.

If i loose out because of someone elses stupidity then yes i would sue. Why should i be out of pocket because of someone else. If i injure myself s*** happens, if some c*** racing/riding stupidly causes me to break a leg, (for example) i am off the bike for weeks, not working for a while, which means i have to pay for petrol to get to work, i have to take time off work etc. then the little s*** is going to get the bill.

Only fair.

Exactly, if I’m out walking with the family on a footpath/bridleway, on which someone has decided to use in a race, and someone gets hit by a racer then I’d not be happy. If there was serious injury (broken bones etc) then I’d most probably sue the organiser.

I guess if I was walking through the local woods on one of the multi-user trails and someone ploughed into me I’d want compensating if I either suffered some proper injury or incurred financial cost (clothes ripped etc). If the person wasn’t a total dick it might be settled amicably but if not the solicitor might be a good way to sort it.

I collided with a jogger last year and scraped my bike, newly fitted shifters, bar tape, shoes, ripped my gloves and shorts and lost skin. She was mostly fine as I went for the barrier at the edge of the road when it was obvious there was going to be a crash. I still apologised, made sure she was fine and offered to give her my details in case she was more hurt than she first thought. She decided it wasn’t necessary, thanked me for my concern. Drama over.

grum – Member

Are we counting SSUK under this as well, in which case definitely.

SSUK is a reliability trial for a cycling club, followng the official rules of the appropriate affiliated body and laws of the land, fully insured and within the law. Its no more illegal than the road clubs sunday mornng TT.

However I spoke to a customer last week who was almost done for “furrious cycling”… DHing on a pedestrian bridge.

I thought ssuk was an excuse to get drunk. 😀