Yes so much so that he stood at the side of the road crying “I’m going to jail” Clearly killing someone was at the forefront of his mind.

I know nothing about this as of just reading the article. Do you know that for fact or are you just Jumping on the cyclists against the world.

I’m not deffending him Im mearly saying there may be more to the case than the press tell us. yes he may have been rubber necking at a lorry and killed some one and he may well have been able to see the rider for 9 seconds. But i bet you have all taken your eye of the road for a brief second and narrowly avoided an accident that could be major or minor.

I will remind you all again he has owned up and even admitting to looking the other way, I would put money on the majority of people not doing this.

When driving, is concentration optional?

The judge still said it could happen to anyone though?

A bit of googling suggests it was the defence barrister who said it – still reprehensible bullshit but more understandable

I’d settle for 6 month jail term (OK, 12 so that they serve 6) suspended indefinitely and invoked next time they get done for speeding etc

crying “I’m going to jail”

I know nothing about this as of just reading the article. Do you know that for fact or are you just Jumping on the cyclists against the world[url=http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/main-topics/general-news/mercy-for-driver-who-killed-veteran-cyclist-1-5789813]Barraclough went into shock as he stood beside the road, “crying out in anguish”, he said and was heard to say “it was a split-second thing. I’m going to jail”.[/url]

initially thought he had hit a bird

Mr Grayson was wearing a helmet, high-visibility clothing and had an LED light on the back of his bike, the court heard…
“He drove his car into the rear of the cycle, causing the bike and rider to go over the roof, smashing the windscreen.”
(whiff of bullshit anyone ?)

I will remind you all again he has owned up

Other motorists (ie witnesses) stopped to help

Stato, you and i have no right to drive, you do it under licence, read the conditions attached to the licence, drive in accordance with the conditions. If you are tired, distracted etc then you don’t drive.

Is that such a hard thing to understand, and 9 seconds when you have been forewarned that there are cyclists about?

Yes i agree, you should be attentive, but what im saying is ‘society’ allows less. Look at the amount of people out there not paying attention, should all of these people go to jail immediately? of course not, so why does being innatentive AND unlucky result in a lynching. Plenty of people have accidents where by sheer luck (or better car design!) people dont get hurt, no one lynches them.

By way of clarification, i dont drive, no licence and im 30. I ride everywhere, see all sorts of bad driving, have done TT’s on DC’s. My gut turns at the thought of good friends who TT being injured like this, in no way am I trying to side with the driver in this case (9 seconds! ridiculous!), however he admitted fault and yes maybe it is a bit lenient but thats the way society views things. Hopefully things will get better but i doubt it, driving is pivotal to modern society and cannot be punished as harshly as we would like.

Look at the amount of people out there not paying attention, should all of these people go to jail immediately? of course not,

[quote] scaredypants – Member
I’d settle for 6 month jail term (OK, 12 so that they serve 6) suspended indefinitely and invoked next time they get done for speeding etc [/quote]

I’d be more inclined to prosecute the organisers of the race. Utterly irresponsible.

I’d be more inclined to prosecute the organisers of the race. Utterly irresponsible.

It`s not irresponsible !!see my post about police approval traffic counts etc

When in doubt, blame the victim.

5th – I suppose the difference is that they spoke to the police in advance and agreed that it was acceptable

(I wouldn’t do it, but that’s because I don’t trust drivers; doesn’t make it wrong to do it)

Below is a guide to what is involved with organising each type of event and a schedule for how and when things need to be done, they are designed to allow events to run smoothly, and are not a daunting as they might first appear.
If you are interested in organising an event and would like some more advice then feel free to contact any of the Committee members or often you will find your club has someone that has done it in the past and has good local knowlledge too.
Information for Club Event Organisers
October/November Decide what events your club wants to run the following year, when they want to run them and on which course
December Apply to the Club Events Secretary for permission to run the events
At least 28 days before the first event. Complete and send a Notice of Time Trial Form (Police Notification) to each Constabulary that your events pass through. Send a copy to the Club Events Secretary at the same time.
Failure to send these forms in time enables the police to refuse permission for the event.
Risk assessment. Obtain an up to date risk assesment for each course you are using from the RA Secretary. This will show you where you need to place signs and any restrictions on the use of the course.
Prior to the Event
Signs. Ensure the signs are correctly positioned.

Risk Assessment. If you spot any new hazards make a note of them on the On the Day Risk Assessment form and what action, if any, you took. Complete the On the Day Risk Assessment form. (This need only be returned if an additional hazrd was noted). Save the form.
Riders must complete the signing on sheet.
Riders not from your club. Riders must be a member of another club affiliated to the CTT, unless the event has been officially designated as a Come and Try It event. For those riders you must have a record of their name and address and an emergency contact.
During the event Riders must have a 20 x 20cm flourescent number pinned on their back.
Juniors must wear a Hard shell helmet
Other riders are advised to waer a Hard Shell helmet, but it is not mandatory.

If a problem occurs during an event, the Organiser is responsible for taking whatever action they deem appropriate to ensure the riders safety. Delay, cancel or put out additional signs or marshals

If an accident occurs firstly ensure the safety of other riders.
An accident report form must be completed and sent to the District Secretary as soon as possible.
After the event Notify the riders of their times. For any doing personal bests they will need to know the course number and the winners time should they wish to compete in an open event.
Payment of levies. The levy is 100p per rider in each event. Ensure that your records of riders is kept up to date and send the total levy to the treasurer very shortly after your last event.
Information for Open Event Organisers
August Decide what events your club wants to run the following year, when they want to run them and on which course, note any special conditions (limited field, priority to women or Juniors, a fastest limit, etc). Nominate an organiser.
1st September Apply to the Open Events Secretary for permission to run the event(s)
Late September Attend the District date fixing meeting
At least 28 days before the first event. Appoint your helpers, including the timekeepers and your Headquarters, don’t forget the catering too.
Complete and send a Notice of Time Trial Form (Police Notification) to each Constabulary that your events pass through. Send a copy to the Open Events at the same time.
Failure to send these forms in time enables the police to refuse permission for the event.

Risk assessment. Obtain an up to date risk assesment for the course you are using from the RA Secretary. This will show you where you need to place signs and marshals and it will detail any restrictions on the use of the course. Check the course against the risk assessment. Note any chandes or additional hazards that may require additional safety measures.

As entries arrive
Collect your entries in a safe place.
Check they are on the current issue form.
Check they are completed correctly, signed and the rider is a member of an affiliated Club.
Return, or contact any rider that has sent an incomplete form.
Juniors must have sent in a signed Parental Consent form too.
Ideally start to prepare your entry list as the forms come in. As soon as you reach the limit of your field you must start to return the entries for riders that will not get a ride. Places are allocated to the fastest riders unless there has been a special condition declared in advance.

Closing Date
Select your final field and return any entries that have not qualified
Prepare your start sheet.
The Start sheet must contain the following information:

Promoted for and on behalf of Cycling Time Trials under their Rules and Regulations

It is also recommended that you include:

In the interests of your own safety Cycling Time Trials and the event promoters strongly advise you to wear a Hard Shell Helmet that meets the internationally accepted safety standard.

It should also include the riders number, his name, club and start time. Details of the HQ, how long it takes to get to the start and a safe route to and from the start/finish. Names of the time keepers Course details. The timekeepers names. Prize list, including how the prize money will be presented, and organisers contact details. Any safety notes from the RA or other safety measures you wish to draw to the riders attention.

At least 5 days before event
Send out your Start Sheets. Don’t forget the time keepers, marshals and District Secretary and Treasurer. Send the Levy, currently £2 per rider, with the Treasurers copy
Prepare the signing on sheet.

Ensure you know the precise start and finish.

At least two days before the event
Check availabilty of marshal, helpers and HQ.
Check you have a full set of race numbers, with pins.
Prepare results board.
Prepare prize money (unless being sent out with results).
Check you have all the signs required, including the finish board or flag.
On the day
Check the Risk Assessment and complete the On the Day Assessment Form, this can be done as you are setting up the signs. Note any new hazards and draw them to the riders attention at the sign on area.

At the HQ check arrival of all officials and ensure the marshal have jackets and flags and know where they are stationed.

Allocate an area for the riders to sign on and have the numbers ready.
Riders must sign on and should only get their number once they have done so. If you have any outstanding problems with entries, put the riders number to one side and only issue it when the problem has bee resolved.

As close to the start as is practical make a final check of the course.

Check the finish area, arrange how the finish times are to be relayed to the HQ, mobile phones are the easiest option.

Check that all riders that started the event are accounted for, either with a completion time or a DNF.

Phone or e-mail the results to the press.

Refer any complaints, or any accident reports, to the District Secretary.

Within 28 days of the event
Prepare and despatch a results sheet to all the riders, checking the times against the timekeepers list. Include a copy to the officials and the District Secretary.
If prizes were not presented at the event include them with the results sheet.
If you didn’t send the levy with the start sheet, do it now.

Return the On the Day risk Assessment form to RA Secretary.

Finally

Relax. Enjoy the thought that you have put on a good event and a lot of riders have had a good day thanks to you and your team.
Contacts
Full details of all the open events in the UK can be found in the CTT Handbook, together with lots more information. Copies can be purchased from CTT.

Long winded but thats for all of you on about prosecuting the organizer .Who if they have followed correct procedure have no case to answer .As someone who organizes a tt I know all about the stress of doing one ,road races are worse !!

brief lapse of concentration led to a devastating accident that “could have happened to anybody”

I guess we can all go around killing people with our cars, as long as it’s only cos we weren’t paying attention for a moment.

Stunning.

^
Guidance to drivers on dual carriageways… Try & look where you are going

Rusty Spanner – Member

Got any evidence to back this up?

An ever increasing number of dead cyclists, sadly.

mrmo – Member

so you mean ban cyclists from most rural roads then?

No, because we were talking specifically about dual carriageways, which are built to allow higher speeds of travel.

what about walkers and horses????

You want to walk or ride a horse along a dual carriageway? 😯

however he admitted fault and yes maybe it is a bit lenient but thats the way society views things.

so shall we bring back hanging? raise the speed limit, allow driving on the phone, drink driving etc, all things that many people regard as acceptable?

Yes he got caught, but is the law about punishment, deterence or a bit of both? for the former what does this sentence mean? for the later, what is the deference?

so shall we bring back hanging?

Yes, but that`s another argument not related to this one !

You want to walk or ride a horse along a dual carriageway?

you need to get out and about a bit more, there are rural dual carriageways that serve as the only road in the area. There are dual carriageways that are within reason perfectly safe, by that i mean quiet plenty of room etc.

In fact you could say that a big dual carriage way is actually safer than some twisty back road so loved by the driving and biking enthusiasts.

mrmo – Member

you need to get out and about a bit more, there are rural dual carriageways that serve as the only road in the area.

Yes, yes, and I’m sure they’re full of horses.

Maybe wrong but I believe slow moving like agricultural vehicles are obligated to have a flashing light on DCs. That would indicate a perception of more danger, plus the speed limit is higher than on single carriage roads.

The guy killed had a light on .Its not compulsory but is recomended.

tinribz – the light is to alert other other road users of a hazard. in this case “yes I am a motorised vehicle but I’m not going as fast as you might be expecting”

no-one should be expecting a bicycle to be doing 60-70mph.

The bottom line is that 9 seconds of inattention is criminal – it’s not ‘split second’. As has been calculated, that’s nearly a quarter of a kilometre without looking where he was going.

And this bullshit about not being the right place for a race – that should have made it safer for the cyclist as there were more hazards present – as signed and so the driver should have been more aware of what was going on than usual.

I bet he wouldn’t have got away with it if he’s driven into the back of a broken down car after not seeing it for 9 seconds.

I bet he wouldn’t have got away with it if he’s driven into the back of a broken down car after not seeing it for 9 seconds.

+1 If he didn’t see a bike with a light what other hazards would he have failed to see?

I drove past a time trial just the other day on the A189/Spine Road near Ashington (NSL, two lane dual carriageway).

There were signs out, the riders had flashing LEDs and high viz, and were at regular intervals.

From what I saw the quality of driving around them was utterly appalling. Drivers completely failing to see them then slamming on the brakes at the last second; drivers pulling out then moving immediately back in despite there being a second rider just ahead; turning left across the riders to get to junctions; passing stupidly close (possibly deliberately) despite the road being very quiet and having a whole other lane available.

Just pathetic. Police should monitor these events to spot idiot drivers. TTing shouldn’t be an extreme sport FFS.

It’s not a brief lapse in concentration, it’s a wholescale failure of appropriate dilligence. At the very least it’s manslaughter. Never to drive again.

Society has been let down by the judge, by the judicial system and by the bellend in the car. This was an avoidable death but nothing has been done about it. Which quite frankly, makes me sick. While nothing is done, it will keep happening.

An awful lot of perfect, wonderful, skilled and 100% attentive drivers on this thread I see. None of you must live around my parts. I wouldn’t trust the average driver round here with my life, to see me on a push bike on a 70mph road, little flashy light or not.

Tragic, but inevitable, if people make themselves so vulnerable, some of them are going to get killed. Madness. I just don’t get this lemming like attraction that some cyclists have for dual carriageways. There’s one in my town where a cyclist gets killed every year or two, regular. Still people ride on it. I don’t get why you would trust a tired Lithuanian lorry driver with your life. (Other nationalities are available, chosen for alliterative purposes only…)

An awful lot of perfect, wonderful, skilled and 100% attentive drivers on this thread I see.

Far from it and I wouldn’t claim otherwise.

Yet I still managed to drive past a TT the other day without endangering anyone’s life. From what I saw, that put me as above-average on that stretch of road. 🙁

I just don’t get this lemming like attraction that some cyclists have for dual carriageways.

They should be safer than urban roads to cycle on: normally very long sight lines and typically 2 or more lanes, often wide enough that a cyclist could be passed without changing lane. (Not that they should, but lets not ask for the world!)

I don’t get why you would trust a tired Lithuanian lorry driver with your life.

Sadly tired inattentive drivers are available on all roads, not just DCs.

GrahamS – Member

…..From what I saw the quality of driving around them was utterly appalling. Drivers completely failing to see them then slamming on the brakes at the last second; drivers pulling out then moving immediately back in despite there being a second rider just ahead; turning left across the riders to get to junctions; passing stupidly close (possibly deliberately) despite the road being very quiet and having a whole other lane available.

witnessed similar on the A19 itself a few years back, I suspect that a significant proportion of drivers (and others see above) don’t believe that cyclists should be allowed on dual carriageways and then don’t act like they are vulnerable human beings when they have to deal with them.
Personally I avoid riding on dual carriageways including those with lower limits as both a driver and a cyclist witnessing the sometimes aggressive sometimes amazingly inattentive driving also I avoid riding most roads with my kids and avoid walking on country lanes with them all very sad as was this death of what sounded like a great guy. At least the dangerous driving charge stuck and he did get disqualified

I’ve just googled the A19. I wouldn’t cycle on there.

Just because we CAN doesn’t mean we should.

Maybe its time the organisers had a rethink on how measured/routes and possibility of closed routes more elsewhere. Madness how you can share a road with cyclists who are racing/against the clock. Remember recently the lad who had a head on as he cut the corner (presumably to carry more speed?)

RIP but instead of carrying on with a recipe for disaster the organisers are joint-culpable.

Where would you hold a closed route timetrial for 120 riders?.I dont think things need to change

I drove past a time trial just the other day on the A189/Spine Road near Ashington (NSL, two lane dual carriageway).

Awful road not one I’d ride on.

There are plenty of areas with quiet roads for holding sportives not that this excuses the driver, I see both points is it really wise to hold such events on busy roads like the A19.

How long does it take for 120 riders to go through on say 8am Sunday morning?

You cant race/ride with a agenda and share a road with distracted drivers. Ive seen cyclists go to drop another rider soo many times. Thankfully Ive second-guessed the body language as not many even shoulder-check let alone throw their right arm out*

Btw. Is that seen as uncool for road cyclists? 😆

It was a timetrial not a sportive .One against the clock .Fields are laid out to avoid bunched riding if possible .The reason you can timetrial is that you are racing the clock alone and not in a bunch race.

Sportives are a pain in the ass and should be held under BC rules with lead cars and outriders and marshals ,I dont suppose the organizers would cream off huge profits if they did that though !!

Where would you hold a closed route timetrial for 120 riders?.I dont think things need to change

So you must feel that there is an acceptable rate of attrition for road riders then? I I know that this is primarily an MTB forum, but man, that is COLD!

9 seconds! That’s ridiculous

I see it when I am driving all too often, someone weaving about in the road, paying no attention to speed limit changes, not indicating etc

When you get close enough to see the driver they are usually looking out the side windows more than the windscreen. Just bumbling along, not a care in the world

This isn’t innocent behaviour that is ‘just one of those things’. These people are a menace. You’re in charge of a huge piece of metal travelling fast. Act like it. Pay attention to the job you are doing, and don’t act like a passenger

That sentence is a joke

I imagine stereo, reading something etc was more likely but only the driver and the Grim Reaper will know this

Cyclists get killed all to often .If we stop riding where we are allowed to every time one gets killed we will be driven off the roads .No rate of attrition is acceptable but I dont see why time triallists should be driven off the roads .As I have said before you are actually riding alone.We do have the right to ride alone on the highway without being mown down by a rubbernecking lorry spotter .He could just as easily hit a broken down vehicle or a large piece of debris due to his lack of attention

And they normally do too (even kerbs etc)

Even at intervals you will reach those that had punctures etc. I imagine this lad was really affected by what happened and has dedicated his life to road safety campaigning now.

Wow thats me the cynical **** coming out