Morning lads and ladies.

Please excuse my ignorance as I know nowt about running.

What I want to know is, is this achievable…

2.6 mile, uphill average gradient 6.1% (up to 13%+ in places) at an average pace of 7:45/mi?

The runner is very fit and occasionaly runs up to 60 mile ultra marathons etc.

(basically ive been challenged to a race, Bike vs Fell Runner kind of thing and want to know if I stand a chance. The runner would need to run at the above pace).

No reason other than why not. 8)

Depends on terrain but as its runner v bike any terrain that will slow down a runner significantly will be a bigger issue for you.

That pace is easy if he is fit, however some Ultra runners aren’t necessarily fast.

You should win: on the 13% bits you’ll be pretty similar in pace, but at 6% you should be easily outriding him. (Assuming you’re fairly fit etc., and the route is 100% rideable).

That pace is easy if he is fit, however some Ultra runners aren’t necessarily fast.

Not that easy, it’s sub 45min for 10K – while going uphill. Not impossible, but still fairly tough.

i’d say that pace is ‘steady’ for xc running. i’m shit*, and can handle 8mins / mile on a steady (10%) climb.

we did some ‘tests’ a few years ago; on any climb you could call ‘tricky’ – we were faster running.

(*on a good day, i don’t finish last in a fell race – i’m the useless duffer at the back)

Its very easy to underestimate the amount of time that rough ground adds. I recall being in sub 26 min 5 mile shape and running well over 40 mins over around 5 miles on the fell. It is always much slower than you think.

i’d say that pace is ‘steady’ for xc running.

I think it’s a bit higher than steady, although perhaps I’m just not fit enough 😀

Certainly when I was training last year for the marathon I’d be hard pushed to maintain that pace on a proper climb – no problem on the flat, but on a proper hill? Although it must be said it’s a short run, you could just go for it and hope you don’t blow up too soon…

Some recent stats from training runs mostly on ‘Trails’ but with more ‘Fell’ (Heather, no paths) on the longer runs – in race situations you often go 10% faster. Only on long runs does the pace drop to below the stated figure.

Distance (m) / elevation gain (ft) / pace
8.64 / 1092 / 7:18 – on tired legs
5.75 / 684 / 7:22
5.19 / 291 / 6:43
6.12 / 501 / 6:43
18.75 / 2227 / 8:24
20.15 / 2755 / 8:15

Some recent stats from training runs mostly on ‘Trails’ but with more ‘Fell’ (Heather, no paths) on the longer runs – in race situations you often go 10% faster. Only on long runs does the pace drop to below the stated figure.

I retract what I said earlier – I’ve been looking over past run data, and that pace should be doable (as a runner). Still think it’d be fairly close, though.

Sounds like it should be pretty close then.

I rode the said “Segement” the other day and it took 19 min 57 sec. However my legs were pretty shot from a big ride a few days before it. On the other hand there are a couple of gates, 2 of them were held open for me. I think a fresh set of legs should give me an extra minute perhaps.

Although the gradient is an average of 6.1% there are 2 very short downhill sections, probably a few hundred yards at most but I can probably hit 25 mph on them which should give me a breather, the last half a mile is much steeper at 11.3% average gradient and sections up to 25%+.

Wonder if he wants to race me back down!

The gates are going to be a problem for you, though – he can just vault them.

I doubt very much he’ll want to race you back down 🙂

r8jimbob88 – Member

Wonder if he wants to race me back down!

obviously this would change the odds a little, but don’t underestimate just how quickly an experienced fell runner can move downhill.

There’s only one way to find out 🙂

I think there’s too many ‘it depends’ to do any sort of calculations. I’m in about 7 min/mile road shape at the moment but most of my training runs end up around 10 mins – hill terrain rather than proper fell.

The Harriers v Cyclists is an annual runners v riders race in Bingley: http://www.bingleyharriers.co.uk/events/harriers-vs-cyclists/

It goes from the bottom of the valley to the top of Baildon Moor and back. Look through the results – it’s very close overall if you look through a few years.

The runners are generally fastest to the top and the riders are generally fastest back down (but there are sections better suited to both in each direction!)

So it’s hard to tell and dependent on terrain and conditions on the day.

😯
It’s threads like these that reinforce my assertion that I’m not a ‘proper runner’ (despite recently increasing the frequency of my runs to around 3 times a week).

I do quite like the idea of fell running but can never see me going “i’ll leave the bike and take the trainers today”.

I do quite like the idea of fell running but can never see me going “i’ll leave the bike and take the trainers today”.

I’m the opposite I always look at everything in terms of running, its particularly fun on the fells when you see people carrying bikes. I am sure the downhills are great but its nice to be able to run (slowly on the ups) every step 😀

I do quite like the idea of fell running but can never see me going “i’ll leave the bike and take the trainers today”.

I did the 3 Peaks cx last year and was irritated that I’d have covered all the off-road bits faster without a bike.

Also, I wouldn’t have had a mechanical on the road and wouldn’t have needed an hour cleaning my bike afterwards!

If they’re any good it’s fairly comfortable it’s 24min 5k pace which unless it’s really rough is cruising pace for a club runner.

I mostly agree – I love the simplicity of running and can’t be fagged getting the bike out, cleaning things, fixing things, etc. Mind you it’s surely the point of the 3 Peaks having an inappropriate bike in an inappropriate place? The cx version makes more sense than the fell version with that godawful road section 😉

The champion of the 3 peaks CX also happens to be fairly handy in the running version of the event (Rob Jebb)