EU Referendum – are you in or out?

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  • EU Referendum – are you in or out?
  • mariner
    Member

    Just imagine if May gets her deal through we have at least two more years of this discussion.
    Do you think we can make 100,000 posts and will the stw website crash?

    spekkie
    Member

    It’s a shame someone can’t knock up a Referendum “voters Family Tree” so we can see which groups have what in common with which other groups.

    ferrals
    Member

    I’m increasingly in the belief that May will bludgeon her deal through.

    ONce its signed what input will Parliment have on the shape of the future realtionship? My concern is that once the WA is signed, the tories will despose of May and put up a hard right loon to set us on a hard brexit path, without parliment having as much leverage as it does now to soften things.

    mickmcd
    Member

    Guess what Norway has.

    I thought fjords

    Stress guy across said

    Roald Dahl

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    I was thinking that Mays deal May squeak through next week, but in reality its opposed equally by Tory remainers and the ERG in roughly similar numbers. More moderates than ERG, probably. The ERG are backtracking as they fear losing their precious Brexit completely, but the Tory moderates won’t budge as they know its a shit deal. I can’t see even a handful of Labour MPs voting for it

    And the DUP will simply never vote for any deal with the backstop in. And we know that when those mad creationist ‘no surrender’ bastards say they will never vote for something, they mean it!

    I wonder what odds I’d get with the bookies for her tabling it for a 4th time and John Bercow telling her no?

    BruceWee
    Member

    I thought fjords

    It can have more than one thing.

    Funnily enough, one thing it doesn’t have is a Customs Union.

    ctk
    Member

    Yep Norway has FOM which is a good thing.

    I’m assuming when Labour say they will end FOM they mean they will end FOM as we now have it and it will be replaced with something very similar.

    ctk
    Member

    It’s not **** unicorns though is it?

    mikewsmith
    Member

    ONce its signed what input will Parliment have on the shape of the future realtionship?

    About as much as they have so far, the direction is controlled by the government. The PM leads this and as shown it’s damm hard to break that without booting her – they also can’t replace her for a while unless she quits

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    The World at One was pretty depressing on Radio 4 just now. Interviewing people in Northern and Southern Ireland. Theres zero optimism for the future. Brexit will hit them harder than anywhere else economically, but a lot of people are genuinely concerned (quite legitimately) about a return to the troubles.

    And the only people that Theresa May is listening to is the DUP who are a minority of a minority, and quite frankly a bunch of backward gazing bigots

    Meanwhile, back in Westminster Michael Gove further fans the flames by saying that ‘Direct Rule’ will be imposed again after Brexit. And Karen Bradley sees if she can get through the day without saying something breathtakingly offensive

    The uncaring and cavalier ignorance on display with regard to the whole issue of Ireland is really worrying. I can really se it ending very very badly

    BruceWee
    Member

    I’m assuming when Labour say they will end FOM they mean they will end FOM as we now have it and it will be replaced with something very similar.

    It’s not **** unicorns though is it?

    What does something very similar to FOM look like?

    Because the point is that, unless it’s so similar it’s indistinguishable, it is **** unicorns.

    taxi25
    Member

    Stress guy across said

    Roald Dahl

    Wrong he was Welsh, born in Cardiff. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    That’ll be the same as ‘a’ customs union, that isn’t ‘the’ customs union

    Its whatever you want it to be. It won’ survive contact with the real world, obviously… but its a nice unicorny idea that apparently some people are more than happy to swallow

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    I was thinking that Mays deal May squeak through next week

    Well, there are quite a few hardliners in the Tory party, so even with DUP they would need nearly all the ERG and sundry other nutters to vote for it. That may be difficult since many of them prefer no-deal and they still may get that if they vote against the deal.

    The question is, how many Labour will vote for it?

    ctk
    Member

    Yes so similar its identical! An emergency brake or quotas or just FOM and deal with the consequences.

    Whats wrong with FOM?

    Premier Icon slowoldman
    Subscriber

    I’m assuming when Labour say they will end FOM they mean they will end FOM as we now have it and it will be replaced with something very similar

    Well binners beat me to it, but since labour have said they want “a” customs union, if they wanted to retain FoM I would have thought they would say they want “a” FoM. But they haven’t. So perhaps they don’t.

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    The question is, how many Labour will vote for it?

    I think enough that it will pass

    BruceWee
    Member

    Whats wrong with FOM?

    Nothing at all but Labour have promised to end it. That is what makes all their claims unicorns.

    Premier Icon slowoldman
    Subscriber

    a further clarification referendum – that is what it would be – it would be asking the question that after the negotiation this is what leave looks like

    How about a sudo command by someone who knows what they’re doing?

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Whats wrong with FOM?

    The racists sorry, leavers don’t like brown* people

    * actual evidence, from an actual overhead conversation post referendum vote of two old dears in a Co-Op fantasising that at least we can stop the (…said under breath) brown people coming here now.

    ctk
    Member

    But they’ll all see the light come 2nd ref?

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    That is what makes all their claims unicorns.

    No, it doesn’t. They want a negotiated arrangement regarding customs which will require a trade-off with FoM.

    if they wanted to retain FoM I would have thought they would say they want “a” FoM. But they haven’t. So perhaps they don’t.

    They want to allow immigration, but not un-restricted. The nature of those restrictions, along with the restrictions on trade provided by ‘a’ customs union, are to be the subject of negotiations.

    Premier Icon jam bo
    Subscriber

    The racists sorry, leavers don’t like brown* people

    * actual evidence, from an actual overhead conversation post referendum vote of two old dears in a Co-Op fantasising that at least we can stop the (…said under breath) brown people coming here now.

    imagine their horror when we start letting more ‘brown’ people in to secure all those trade deals…

    BruceWee
    Member

    No, but some of them will be dead now. And there will be 2 million 18 to 21 year olds who will now be able to vote who couldn’t in 2016.

    And then of course, you have the morons living abroad who let their voter registration expire and weren’t really paying attention because, I mean, in what **** universe would the UK vote to leave the EU. That would be monumentally insane.

    If I’m anything to go by people will be paying a lot more attention to the 2nd referendum than the first.

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    mariner

    Member
    Just imagine if May gets her deal through we have at least two more years of this discussion.
    Do you think we can make 100,000 posts and will the stw website crash?

    Get real, we’ve got a decade of trade talks to sort out

    Premier Icon Cougar
    Subscriber

    Jon Snow was on form yesterday. I think he’s a tad vexed.

    Premier Icon Twodogs
    Subscriber

    I think freedom of movement comes with the single market, not customs union. labour want “a” customs union, not single market. (why would you want to be in the single market, covering services…after all, services only account for 80% of our exports)

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    No, it doesn’t. They want a negotiated arrangement regarding customs which will require a trade-off with FoM.

    *sigh* How many times? Repeat after me…. the four freedoms of the EU are indivisible

    Noticed any signs over the last few years that the EU are prepared to compromise that to allow one country to cherry-pick which bits they fancy?

    If so then you’ve been watching some very different negotiations to me.

    Perhaps they will do though if a pensioner with a beard asks them nicely and brings them some courgettes?

    Premier Icon dazh
    Subscriber

    The nature of those restrictions, along with the restrictions on trade provided by ‘a’ customs union, are to be the subject of negotiations.

    You’d think this simple point would be obvious wouldn’t you? Trouble is it doesn’t support the ‘corbyn is a secret ERG supporting hard brexit nutter’ tin foil hat theory so good luck trying to get anyone to agree.

    the four freedoms of the EU are indivisible

    And how many times does it need to be pointed out that the indivisible four freedoms apply only to the single market and not the customs union? The customs union is not equal to the single market.

    Premier Icon slowoldman
    Subscriber

    at least we can stop the (…said under breath) brown people coming here now.

    They haven’t seen the post referendum non-EU immigration figures then?

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    Aaaah yes… the single market that jezza intends to maintain tariff-free access too with out being a member of?

    That not sound even more unicorny than his other red unicorns to you?

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    How many times? Repeat after me…. the four freedoms of the EU are indivisible

    And again – how many times? – that refers to full customs union and full freedom of movement. The deal that Corbyn would have to go for would be some kind of qualified movement e.g. Australian points system or something, in return for a customs agreement regarding say goods and not services.

    There are lots of examples of schemes allowing people to work in other countries that aren’t full freedom of movement. That is what I would expect given what I’ve read. Does that make sense now?

    Premier Icon kelvin
    Subscriber

    Give up on them Binners. They don’t see that there is no difference between their cake and eat nonsense, and that spouted by May, DD, Boris & Fox (the dream team) before they were forced to accept that “all the benefits of the Single Market & Customs Union” are unavailable if you are outside both. Politicans have lied and claimed that isn’t the case… and some many people still believe that… they still deny the obvious…

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    Politicans have lied and claimed that isn’t the case… and some many people still believe that… they still deny the obvious…

    No, you are really really not understanding what I am trying to say. I understand the indivisible four freedoms. Read my earlier post carefully.

    Tenuous
    Member

    A lot of people also don’t understand that the 4 freedoms, including freedom of movement, are essential for the single market to function as a single market and for us to get the benefits of that. FoM is not something that has been arbitrarily imposed, it is one of the foundations that makes the single market work and removing it would create barriers to trade that would hit the effectiveness and thus the benefits of the single market.

    Premier Icon colp
    Subscriber

    How about a sudo command by someone who knows what they’re doing?

    sudo rm -rf /erg /dup
    sudo move /gammon /costadelsol

    coppice
    Member

    Please forgive my ignorance, I don’t claim to be knowledgeable on these things, i’m just trying to get a better understanding on the potential outcomes of Brexit.

    My understanding of people not wanting FOM was due to lots of African refugees that had crossed numerous European countries to camp in Calais trying to get into Britain, rather than every country taking a quota. I tend to keep out of the news/media so i’m not sure how often this still occurs?

    sudo remove /creme /cat

    ctk
    Member

    So there are no countries that enjoy tariff free access to the single market without being members?

    ferrals
    Member

    DUp in meetings with Cox and Hammond,

    A.K.A how much more to we have to pay you so you’ll reinterpret Cox’s advice to amke the backstop palatable

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