They could legally end it, but it would cause serious credibility issues. If however they have a second ref and rig it by having three options, they could claim legitimacy.

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They could legally end it, but it would cause serious credibility issues

Credibility isnt something they have

Firstly, I thought people voted for Brexit thinking they would be better off financially.

It wasn’t a particularly important factor, if you want to get a reasonable understanding of why people voted Brexit, Matthew Goodwin has done a lot of work on it and seem to approach it with an open mind. This article seems to a good start. You will note it explodes many of the myths spouted on here.

Long article there…. Got about half way down it so far but there seems to be a bit missing there.
The reason people are trying to overturn and stop brexit is due to the massive harm it will do to the country, it is possible to do this while trying to fix society.
The conclusion many of us have come to is it will be much harder to fix the problems that created brexit from outside of the EU, hence the immediate focus is on the health and well being of the UK which can then get us back to a position of being able to move forward as a better place to live.
Outside of the EU we are screwed and divisions will increase.

Oh and….

The idea that those who went on to vote for Brexit were dispossessed white workers who live in fading seaside towns made for good copy but it was deeply misleading. Some Leavers certainly felt economically left behind, but many did not. Research has since shown that three groups were key to the Brexit vote:

Left Behind Leavers, who were working-class, struggling financially, almost never had a degree, were in their forties or fifties and most of whom did not identify with the main parties or supported the UK Independence Party.
Blue-Collar Pensioners, who were also working-class but retired, and so less likely to be struggling financially and tended to vote for Conservative.
Affluent Eurosceptics, who were much less likely to identify as working-class, more affluent, more likely to have a degree and tended to vote Conservative. While we hear much about the first two groups we have heard very little about the third.7

Sounds about what was posted on here…. Explain how brexit improves these people’s lives?

And contrary to the claim that Leavers did not know what they were voting for, were misled, or engaged in an irrational backlash, an array of work has now shown how they shared clear and coherent preferences. Foremost, they wanted their nation state to have greater control over the laws that affect their daily lives and immigration to be reduced, which they felt could simply not happen so long as Britain remained in the EU.

So how does leaving the EU do that for them? What they wanted was not possible and isn’t going to happen.

A masterclass in whataboutery, will achieve absolutely nothing, just repeats the same stale old arguments

and trying not the be the third unanswered post in a row but……

Discussing the reasons and underlying issues of the brexit vote and how to unite the country for a better way in a structural way is like asking this bloke how he wants to adjust his pension investments.
We have just over 100 days on the clock here and it’s ticking.
The most important priority at the moment is resolving what happens at the end of March.

Given the likely outcome from the court case and the words coming from MP’s remain is now actually a realistic outcome that can be put forward, it’s been nothing but a pipe dream until now. This is a key point in time, this is the point where we put ourselves into a position to make society better.

Please tell me how brexit delivers this.

bugger is this another one….
First up can we hold the Mail to this one

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-46497186
Bigger bit is BBC Suggesting May is off back cap in hand to ask for a little more please from the EU.
Rule Britania, Britania begs the wave, Britons never never shall be afraid to roll over and have our tummies tickled on behalf of the mad brexies

mefty, I did not read the whole report, however from what I read it confirms the obvious. Below is an extract from the article you linked. The article carried on in this vein.

Leavers certainly felt economically left behind, but many did not. Research has since shown that three groups were key to the Brexit vote:

Left Behind Leavers, who were working-class, struggling financially, almost never had a degree, were in their forties or fifties and most of whom did not identify with the main parties or supported the UK Independence Party.

Blue-Collar Pensioners, who were also working-class but retired, and so less likely to be struggling financially and tended to vote for Conservative.
Affluent Eurosceptics, who were much less likely to identify as working-class, more affluent, more likely to have a degree and tended to vote Conservative. While we hear much about the first two groups we have heard very little about the third.

So Brexit supporters were broken up into 3 group’s
1) poor white working class disaffected voters who turned to UKIP.
2) poor retired working class pensioners who tended to support the Tories
3)Affluent degree educated Tory voting eurosceptics.

Well **** me, what a revelation that was!!!

I was also shocked to read on the same report that leave voting was not mainly driven by financial concerns. Surveys showed that disaffection with the EU drove a desire to take back control of law and decision making processes to the UK as well as a desire to control immigration levels.

I certainly found it eye opening and made me realise I had it all wrong.

I have wandered around many forums and blogs and yes as detailed in the article by Matthew Goodwin most of his observations are correct. Now i am not going to echo most comments above about how will brexit fix this because it is a simple truth that it won’t.

So once again i will expand my broader concern (please note i am from as piss poor working class background in tge North of England – the very shit hole he talks about)

So i am being blunt to all these disenfranchised/left behinds – exactly how much ****ing opportunity do you want?

1. Education to the highest levels is available to all and dont anyone whine about student loans.
2. There is a national shortage of trades – tried getting a tradesman to do a job for you at the moment.
3. Setting a business up in the UK is really very easy- anyone tried this in France?

I have said this before highly paid unskilled and semi skilled jobs are rare and automation will remove the last of them. Fruit and veg picking, hospitality,logistics are already automating.

I have mates who sit in this camp “my kids dont have the opportunities your kids have” thats because you sat on your arse in the pub while i held down a full time job with 4 kids and went to university part time, thats because when you got a few quid you pissed up the wall in Benidorm while i was digging the foundations out for my house. Thats because you told your kids university is a waste of time yey i have one kid who earns 3 x the national average at 28.

But above all this is the simple fact that regardless of the vote the same bunch of ****s are still in charge and have more capacity to screw over poor people.

If we are going to be very very honest there is a significant part of our society that has no value going forward. This is reflected by JRMs cheap shoes and Tim slashing 37p off a burger. So we had better make sure they have enough benefits to sit in the pub and add more wealth to Bet 365

The irony of this whole shambles is that large parts of the brexit camp will bear the brunt of this –

Farmer’s, pensioners and the piss poor all voted for this so when Trumps agricultural taps are opened, the NHS is “Americanised” and all of Amazons jobs are automated then it becomes interesting.

This will be no country for old, poor, unskilled people.

The double irony is that lots of people on this forum are likley to do well out of brexit. I think my business will probably grow in the medium term after brexit – but i would always vote remain regardless.

So the above makes Matthew Goodwins article no more than a set of very obvious observations.

Just a heads up for anyone in London, Tommy and his gang of racists will be out marching today
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46495595
Hope he isn’t too lonely there, and that they all make it around without getting heckled and asked some serious questions.

1. Education to the highest levels is available to all and dont anyone whine about student loans.

It really isn’t.

Education has precisely the square root of **** all to do with brexit or the EU though. Except perhaps ERASMUS being a nice opportunity for done.

The reasons I’ve heard for brexit.
Nasty Nigerian nurse.
All the fish caught in Cornwall have to go to central eu fish hub to then be sent back.
Eu people claiming benefits and living in mansions at our expense.
P.s amongst our shop keeping fraternity “all the shop lifting is done by eastern europeans except when Epsom Derby is on in which case it is done by pikeys.”
All of the shoplifters i have caught have been nice ,well turned out, english ladies.

Another one I heard was the NHS being ruined by excessive immigration…..there was I thinking it was 10yrs of Tory austerity that f*kd it..

All of the shoplifters i have caught have been nice ,well turned out, english ladies.

Maybe you’re just too slow to catch the pros 😉

Maybe you’re just too slow to catch the pros 😉

Believe me, Mrs Zip only has to look at you to know if you’re up to no good.

my mother was an ardent leave is now going to abstain if there’s another ref.

Ransos why is education to University level not available to all?

I left school with one CSE and my old mans only advice was as long as you can sign your name and count your wages thats all you need?

I sharp worked out during Mrs Thatchers reign that those that got by had property and an education. It took me 12 tears of part time education to end up with an engineering degree.

Education is everything and i dont just mean “school learning” more than half of this country is very poorly educated for a first world economy.

Ransos why is education to University level not available to all?

For the reason you don’t want to discuss.

So do you understand how the student loans/graduate tax works? Why is this a problem to poor students (the support is still greater for those with less cash?)

I do believe fees are way too high, but regardless it is a lifetime investment.

I’m poor (awaiting universal credit) and yet I’m studying a degree

So do you understand how the student loans/graduate tax works?

Yes.

Oldman has a point – you’re rarely disadvantaged by being better educated.
That said, please note that not all degrees (even in the same subject) are anything like equal.

Why is this a problem to poor students (the support is still greater for those with less cash?)

Because they are likely to need to borrow even more money.

my mother was an ardent leave is now going to abstain if there’s another ref.

What are her cited reasons?

Oldman has a point – you’re rarely disadvantaged by being better educated.

Of course. Do you think that is helped by the current funding model?

What are her cited reasons?

she didn’t want to talk about it.

Part time minimum wage job… just like all 4 of my kids did or are doing – most students have 4 months off over summer and thats £4.5k tax free on minimum wage.

Its just a shite excuse…

Also as IGM points out do a degree that has a value like business, engineering etc.

most students have 4 months off over summer and thats £4.5k tax free on minimum wage.

Provided your parents are letting you stay at their place and feeding you no?

Just out of interest, have you asked any poor students about university funding?

Forgot to mention bursaries – £1000 at Northumbria Business school if you get a first in year 3.

Part time minimum wage job… just like all 4 of my kids did or are doing – most students have 4 months off over summer and thats £4.5k tax free on minimum wage.

Assuming you can find a full time job for the whole of summer, a very big assumption indeed. Rent and food would take most of it if parents are unable to provide it.

Both my daughters have university friends that come from miserable backgrounds- so yes and i dont for one minute think its easy and i never said it was, i just said it was available.

I know better than most what it takes to get out of that type of background, but i didnt sit and whine about the indudtrial wasteland that Maggie left behind. When your poor you have to work 3 x as hard as the middle class and 10 x harder than the landed gentry.

I drink in a pub that is full people who have inherited land, business, property. All i inherited was a funeral bill, but i am sure i can out graft and outhink most of them.

Sitting and using student loans and the current funding model as an excuse to become a “left behind” is complete bollocks.The same argument is thrown at buying a house – they are to ezpensive, the deposit is too big…

Your right Ransos its not ****ing fair but it has always been the same except maybe for a few golden years in the late 60s.

Thatchers gov. dismantled our industrial heartlands and created nothing to replace it except home ownership and shopping. Now we can sit on our arses amd moan but it changes nothing that has happened.

Unions were always pro education as they undestood the value, they even sent members kids to private school.

Education Education Education..

One of Jezza’s cohorts has just been on Pienaars politics outlining the labour party’s Brexit policy, such as it is.

If labour had been allowed to negotiate this deal then the EU would have been happy to disgard all the things they wouldn’t have been happy to disgard for Theresa. An end to freedom of movement, maintaining all the advantages of access to the single market, while not being in the single market

Having cakes and eating them. Cakes for everyone! Hurray!!!!

Sitting and using student loans and the current funding model as an excuse to become a “left behind” is complete bollocks.The same argument is thrown at buying a house – they are to ezpensive, the deposit is too big…

It is a matter of fact that higher education and housing are both far less affordable than when I was starting out.

Agree but tax free allowances are proportionally much more generous, interest rates are a fraction of what they were, help to buy is a double edged sword in some cases. I still had to raise a 10% deposit back in 1985 which was £3300 and i was taking home £90 a week so more than six months wages for a deposit.

I also paid all my fees for my HNC HND and Degree.

^Look, I get that you grew up in a hole in the road, on a diet of powdered glass, and worked 27 hours a day from the age of two. Regardless, you seem to assume that if you’re now comfortable, then everyone else can be too.

1. Education to the highest levels is available to all and dont anyone whine about student loans.

The best education is only available to the very rich.

The Sutton Trust says pupils from eight schools filled 1,310 Oxbridge places over three years, compared with 1,220 from 2,900 other school

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-46470838

Its an attitude….

Positive or negative choice….

Yours appears negative…