EU Referendum – are you in or out?

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  • EU Referendum – are you in or out?
  • THM,it’s interesting that for all your claims of insider knowledge,you never provide any evidence in your favour,just resort to slagging other people off. If you have any real evidence to back up your claims,please present it,or shut up.
    P.S. just saying “I know more than you” doesn’t cut it,if you want us to agree with you,show us the evidence,otherwise,it’s just trolling again,so sad.

    deadlydarcy
    Member

    or shut up

    I think you mean “STFU”.

    Premier Icon zippykona
    Subscriber

    Cue high brow retort about how childish it is to resort to remoaning name calling.
    Sorry i forgot the 🙂

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Yes I have it just gets ignored

    Posted links to EU analysis on this many many pages ago and yet we still get the same guff published.

    Ed just makes things up consistently. You can’t debate that as it’s mere fantasy. Eg confusing where people invest with the location of financial services providers above

    You might as well have a debate about water a Mercedes is a better orange than an armadillo.

    I am trying to be polite to a trolling moron DD,I’m not sure why I give him that much respect,he hasn’t earned it yet 😥

    And more,same old same old.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Turn you focus on those who claim that the UK has already experienced huge damage when it patently hasn’t or who post data that shows they are making things up about the impact of Brexit on NHS hiring

    Or that UK financial services are about to collapse

    Then you can have “respect”

    If remoaners keep posting unsupportable gibberish they will get the same reaction that Brexshiteers did

    Ah,back to the killfile,occasionally I hope he will produce evidence rather than bullshit,but what the hey.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Eviidence

    1, we have moved to phase 2 – something that was denied could happen
    2. Uk growth revised up (yes below EU but different cycles), manufacturing doing better than expected and recent trends in direct contrast to idea that U.K. had already seen huge damage
    3. Real trolls have already debunked their own false arguments that Brexit has had huge impact on NHS staffing

    Just because remoaners want to bully others by repeating BS doesn’t make it true. We saw that with the other side pre the vote

    Junkyard
    Member

    Given we all agree he is BS and trolling why are we feeding him?

    Not sure what is worse tbh but ignoring him may lead to him behaving less like this.

    Edukator
    Member

    Fact is London lost the job and the more I read this thread and anything Brexit connected whether it be May, DD, Hammond related the less sympathetic I feel toward GB and the more I want to distance myself from the cheating, distorting, have-cake-and-eat-it, fiscal dumping, back-door-to-Europe, shit on the poor news coming out of the UK. And I’m looking more to Macron to defend me and look after my interests than to give the UK any chance to cheat and gain unfair advantage.

    The will to remain united is slipping away and the conditions for a trade war are maturing. Each new outrageous provocation from London turns the voters of Europe against GB (there’s syspathy for Ireland, even the north despite the DUP). After 18 months of provocation and mauvaise foi from DD and co. it’s increasingly a case of wanting Europe to protect its interests in the face of hostility and unrealistic expectations from GB. You need a Justin Trudeau when in fact you’ve got May, Hammond, Trump and DD. I know Trump shouldn’t be on the list but people tend to put all the villains in the same basket.

    I hope this makes you smile, THM, you’ll no doubt accuse me of lying again, the trouble is I spend my time with Europeans of various nationalities in situations where nobody needs to be politically correct. Whether Spanish, German or French the people I spent Christmas with were anti-Brexit, but equally concerned that Europe make no concessions that GB could abuse or use to its advantage. You have to be worse off after Brexit because Europeans won’t accept you being better off.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Well if you want to cut your own noses off to spite your face so be it

    Ed you have long argued for people to be involved with economic sabotage in the UK in order to overturn the democratic process so your anti UK vitriole comes as no surprise

    But you are correct

    I want to distance myself from the cheating, distorting, have-cake-and-eat-it, fiscal dumping, back-door-to-Europe, shit on the poor news coming out of the UK

    Did make me smile

    Why?,because it’s true?

    tjagain
    Member

    thejesmonddingo – Member

    THM,it’s interesting that for all your claims of insider knowledge,you never provide any evidence in your favour,just resort to slagging other people off. If you have any real evidence to back up your claims,please present it,or shut up.

    Its because he has none. Why? Probably because he does not work in financial services at all. He has claimed to be a teacher numerous times.

    Blatant fantasist and liar and a nasty bully who has been banned from here for bullying.

    Junkyard – lazarus

    Given we all agree he is BS and trolling why are we feeding him?

    Not sure what is worse tbh but ignoring him may lead to him behaving less like this.

    I suspect it would simply get shriller and worse – but he might get bored if no one answers him. Its way of trying to make himself look important and knowledgeable but unfortunately for him we can all see thru his shtick

    It does really make me laugh the way everyone on here has now seen him for what he is.

    tjagain
    Member

    And I’ll bet within a few minutes THM will be making more baseless personal attacks on me – probably calling me a bully and a liar. Bet he has done this numerous times on this thread

    km79
    Member

    Turn you focus on those who claim that the UK has already experienced huge damage when it patently hasn’t

    What kind of damage? Reputational? Economic? Morale? Constitutional?

    THM in another everything is always about money shocker.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    No need, the truth is out there.

    Nice tone BTW and interesting change from posting inaccurate statements. ‘‘Twas ever thus.

    Great irony too.

    Blatant fantasist and liar and a nasty bully who has been banned from here for bullying.

    Says the….. 😉

    Still we will be on to the trade talks that would never happen soon, so save the vitriol for then.

    Premier Icon BoardinBob
    Subscriber

    Eviidence

    1, we have moved to phase 2 – something that was denied could happen

    Have we really?

    As the “grown ups” have said many times

    “Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed”

    Papering over the cracks is the only way to describe “phase 1”

    tjagain
    Member

    Turn you focus on those who claim that the UK has already experienced huge damage when it patently hasn’t

    #[/quote]

    so going from the top of the G7 growth table to the bottom is not huge damage? Losing hundreds of EU nurses every month instead of gaining them? Losing thousands of EU doctors so locum shifts cannot be filled? Rising inflation outstripping growth so real wages fall, losing much of financial services to mainland Europe including the most profitable parts? Losing all influence over EU policy, losing medicines approval leading to shortages of drugs, Losing various regulatory bodies with the associated large numbers of visitors who spend good money to stay in hotels when attending stuff at those regulatory bodies. Huge increase in racist crime. Huge increase in costs – is it 3 billion extra spent so far on knew red tape etc etc.

    the financial cost is already huge an this is only the beginning. The social cost is worse. and all because of an internal spilt in the tory party.

    all this has already happened at huge cost to the country and population ( although the fantasist will deny despite the proof it has happened)

    tjagain
    Member

    We have not moved to phase 2. simple lie. there have been no negotiations on the future relationship. there can’t be until march at the very earliest. there is only a outline agreement on the 3 key issues and this has not been ratified yet

    Phase one could have been done in 5 minutes had those in charge not been deluded

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    It’s all huge – even the whoppers.

    Phase 1 was always BS – set conditions that merely delay the proper (public) negotiations. In the end each one was fudged which proves the delay theory (sorry Ireland)

    In the spirt of the thread, progress has been huge so far.

    Love the idea that we have lost “much” of our financial services when the the latest company announcements have revised down estimates from 000s to a huge few 00s roughly 5-6% of staff in London max. Huge with a capital H.

    Still probably is huge when compared to the real impact on NHS staffing. Perhaps all things are relative 😉

    Premier Icon welshfarmer
    Subscriber

    A few hundreds? Deutschebank alone are moving 4000 staff from London to Frankfurt according the FAZ article linked to a few pages back.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Latest estimate down from that to 350

    In line with trends seen for other banks.”Huge”

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Bloody biased BBC leading with positive UK manufacturing output news tonight

    “Huge” item up first 😉

    tjagain
    Member

    welshfarmer – Member

    A few hundreds? Deutschebank alone are moving 4000 staff from London to Frankfurt according the FAZ article linked to a few pages back.

    don’t bother a troll with inconvenient facts.

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    …and don’t check them either*. Much better if they are huge numbers ….

    * although to be fair WF that number was quoted by them in the earliy days. Like all banks more realistic numbers are now available. As before in the hundreds not thousands. Still “huge” though….whole single digit %ages no less.

    Premier Icon welshfarmer
    Subscriber

    I can only go by what I read. The article in the FAZ (perhaps the most respected paper in Germany) was from today..

    http://m.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/unternehmen/brexit-folgen-fuer-frankfurter-wohnungsmarkt-und-schulen-15382819.amp.html

    Premier Icon Poopscoop
    Subscriber

    THM
    So if bank passporting (correct term? ) is simply not allowed by the EU, London’s future is still rosey?

    From what I’ve heard that is looking like a likely outcome.

    tjagain
    Member

    City firms plan to move 10,500 jobs out of the UK on “day one” of Brexit, with Dublin and Frankfurt the financial centres most likely to benefit from the UK’s departure from the EU.

    The job tracker compiled by the accountants EY, which counts job announcements to the end of November, found that the number of roles likely to be affected had fallen from estimates of 12,500 a year ago. But it also concluded that the jobs being affected by Brexit were not just the “back office” ones initially forecast, but “front office” staff who deal directly with clients.

    tjagain
    Member

    The Bank of England has warned that 10,000 jobs could leave the City on “day one” after the UK leaves the EU.

    Sam Woods, a deputy governor of the Bank, also admitted that forecasts of 75,000 job losses over the long-term were “plausible” at an appearance before peers on the Lords EU financial affairs sub-committee on Wednesday.

    Woods runs the regulatory arm of the Bank and based his estimate of 10,000 jobs on responses he received from 400 banks and financial firms required to provide him with their contingency plans for a hard Brexit.

    He has been reviewing the plans since July and said some were being put in place – with banks reserving school places and hiring office space – but that this process would get under way “in earnest” in the first quarter of 2018.

    The estimate of 75,000 job losses was made by consultancy Oliver Wyman, and based on the assumption that the UK would be left to rely on World Trade Organisation rules with no transition period after March 2019, when the UK leaves the EU.

    Under this scenario, £10bn of tax revenue might also be lost, it said. The 75,000 estimate includes the knock-on effect of fewer City jobs to other parts of the economy.

    tjagain
    Member

    Goldman Sachs has begun to implement contingency plans by taking the top eight floors of a 37-storey block under construction in Frankfurt, even though it is building a new European headquarters in London.

    The US investment bank employs 6,000 staff in London and its chief executive Lloyd Blankfein tweeted this week that the decision on how many staff to keep in London was “so much outside our control”.

    The City expects 5,000 to 13,000 job losses among the 1.1 million people employed in the sector across Britain. This chimes with 10,000 losses the Bank of England said is plausible on Brexit Day in March 2019.

    Consultants like Oliver Wyman have forecast losses of 75,000 or far higher, though over several years.

    Premier Icon Poopscoop
    Subscriber

    Pretty gloomy predictions for sure eh? 🙁

    tjagain
    Member

    Yup – but according to THM all this is bogus

    It is true that some are now estimating less than they were but one thing is certain – its a good few thousand by the day we leave with many more to come – and each of those city jobs creates other jobs in service industries so they will also be lost

    Again – this is exactly as I said it would go down a year ago. the right wing fantasists on here insisted it would not happen and now deny the evidence of it happening

    those quotes are all from the quality press within the last month

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    EY was the original scare story which had been proven to be overly optimistic. 4K was the original DB estimate made at similar time. Many other banks had figured in the few thousands and are now talking few hundreds.

    Current guesstimates are potentially around 5% of uk workforce may have to leAve depending on nature of deal.

    Poops – loss of passporting affects certain activities. For sure all banks have drawn up plans for a move from passporting fo various forms of equivalence. All the UK banks are prepared but exact numbers of job moves will depend on nature of deal.

    There will be lots of noise – not just from Stw remoaners – on this issue as it’s central to the type of deal and our future relationship with EU and one reason why we are correct to reject Norway deal and EU stupid to propose it

    A compromise deal will happen. As always.

    Premier Icon Poopscoop
    Subscriber

    THM
    Poops – loss of passporting affects certain activities. For sure all banks have drawn up plans for a move from passporting fo various forms of equivalence. All the UK banks are prepared but exact numbers will depend on nature of deal.

    Surely the EU won’t stand for any sort of equivalence though?

    How would that work?

    tjagain
    Member

    Correct poopscoop. any deal on financial services has been pretty much ruled out. LOndon cannot get better terms than new york or geneva have

    tjagain
    Member

    LONDON — The EU’s chief Brexit negotiator has ruled out a free trade deal with Britain which includes financial services unless Britain remains in the single market, dealing a significant blow to the government’s aim of securing a bespoke Brexit trade deal.

    Speaking to newspapers including the Guardian, Michel Barnier said: “There is no place [for financial services]. There is not a single trade agreement that is open to financial services. It doesn’t exist.”

    Barnier said the result would be a consequence of “the red lines that the British have chosen themselves. In leaving the single market, they lose the financial services passport.”

    http://uk.businessinsider.com/barnier-rules-out-a-brexit-trade-deal-for-the-city-of-london-2017-12?r=US&IR=T

    tjagain
    Member

    Oh – and contrary to THMs fantasy in a quoted post we have not moved on to the second stage of negotiations yet

    Nothing can happen on the second stage of negotiations – the difficult and complex bit until march. given that the easy bit took 18 months ( for May and co to cave in on every demand) then the idea we can negotiate a comprehensive bespoke trade deal in a year is simply ridiculous

    Barnier was speaking three days after EU leaders agreed the UK had made enough progress on the Brexit divorce – citizens’ rights, the Brexit financial settlement and the Irish border – to allow talks on the future.

    He said the next key moment would be an EU summit in mid-March, when EU leaders are due to sign off guidelines that will lay out red lines and hopes for the future. “I hope very much that we will have a clear position from the British government by this time.”

    mefty
    Member

    new york or geneva

    Both the US and Switzerland have equivalence in many fields

    More rubbish in the Independent being corrected

    Premier Icon Poopscoop
    Subscriber

    mefty – Member
    new york or geneva
    Both the US and Switzerland have equivalence in many fields

    Genuine question,
    Do they have a good terms as London does at the moment within the EU?

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