Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 97 total)
  • Enve Wheels
  • geetee1972
    Free Member

    Listen to yourself…

    I don’t need to. I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything. I’m just happy riding my bike fast.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    chakaping – Member

    What would you like to see them doing?

    Some sort of cool new material that’s lighter and stronger than aluminium 😉

    Apart from that- shopping list)

    Simple stuff, bring the ancient kit up to spec. Take everything that went into the 821 and make a new 819, frinstance.

    Get over UST, it didn’t catch on for a reason, go TLR and make either lighter or stronger rims that are easier to live with. For that matter, hookless rims. Though, I think they’ll resist all that stuff just because UST is theirs.

    Oh and stop making wheelsets where the rear wheel’s weaker than the front. They had a wee production line of rear Enduros getting rebuilt with front rims at the EWS… Fine if you get a new one free but it’s pretty iffy for paying customers. Would you really build a wheelset that way yourself?

    And yeah, more width. I’ve got a mixed bag of wheels and with decent sized tyres, the difference between my 819s and my flow exs is pretty unmissable. It just feels stuck in the past.

    chiefgrooveguru
    Full Member

    I was pleasantly surprised when my all singing all dancing new full-sus was about 10% quicker than my hardtail! I should have just got some Enve wheels, would have been cheaper… 😉

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    tasteslikeburning
    Free Member

    Just confirming what some other posts say – they do track noticeably better and I can get on stay on high lines for example where it was 50/50 on my Stans rims. I didn’t get this at first but the more I ride them the more I notice they track really well.
    First ride I definitely felt they accelerated better. I wouldn’t pay £750 a rim for Enve’s but Light Bicycle seem pretty on the money. Not risking them in the Alps though 🙂

    geetee1972
    Free Member

    Just confirming what some other posts say

    So to sum up the thread, the people who’ve ridden carbon rims all agree they are better and offer an increase in performance that translates to better riding (even if not everyone would consider shelling out specifically for the Enve product) and then there are those who think it’s all just marketing guff and that we’re all in some way of questionable sanity or just have more money than sense ans they also seem to be the ones who’ve never ridden them.

    I may have more money than sense or I may have been seduced by the marketing. Frankly I don’t really care as I just love riding my bike fast.

    gee
    Free Member

    Enve’s are just silly money. Same weight as Light Bicycle etc but at least 6x the cost.

    From what I’ve seen at races and on here they are no more durable.

    Even if they are a bit more durable, they are a PITA to true.

    Even if they are a bit more durable, they aren’t 6x as durable.

    They may have an excellent warranty but so do Light Bicycle.

    I’m not sold on Enve.

    However, I am sold on carbon rims being worth the risk of damaging one on a rock because they are just so much stiffer when giving it the beans in a sprint and round berms.

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    geetee1972 – Member

    So to sum up the thread, the people who’ve ridden carbon rims all agree they are better and offer an increase in performance that translates to better riding (even if not everyone would consider shelling out specifically for the Enve product) and then there are those who think it’s all just marketing guff and that we’re all in some way of questionable sanity or just have more money than sense ans they also seem to be the ones who’ve never ridden them.

    Not at all, stop trying to polarise it.

    No one’s buying a 10% speed gain.

    uselesshippy
    Free Member

    What gee said…
    I wouldn’t fork out for the enves, but I do have a set of lightbicyles 35mm, 29er rims. Still not exactly cheap mind, but they do make a really noticeable difference.

    ontor
    Free Member

    they’re so stiff they only really work well on a jones spaceframe with all it’s lovely vertical compliance…

    Hob-Nob
    Free Member

    The man from Derby kindly warrantied my rims, somewhat unexpectedly this week, so in light of the (not dubious at all) potential race winning gains I can benefit from, i’m going to build them back up to take to Whistler in a few weeks, for racing the EWS.

    That extra 10% should see me right up the sharp end. Watch out Jared!

    Northwind
    Full Member

    cynic-al – Member

    No one’s buying a 10% speed gain.

    I can totally buy a 10% speed gain. Just not for performance reasons. Feel’s as important as outright performance I reckon, a bike that feels right on the trails and in the garage can go a hell of a lot faster than a “better” one that doesn’t.

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    a bike that feels right on the trails and in the garage can go a hell of a lot faster than a “better” one that doesn’t.

    I don’t think its that simple – a bike that feels fast isn’t always faster.

    rone
    Full Member

    I’ve just got some enve m50s and they feel and ride completely differently to cheaper carbon rims.

    They also ride so much better then the equivalent light aluminium rims.

    I’m not here to convince anyone, I fancied some and could afford them. I like the fact they’re not cheap knock offs. Too much in our world is built to a price point.

    Long term I will let you know.

    But this is only the same argument as someone buying tesco BSO and some one on here telling them to spend 1500 on a real bike. All relative.

    I don’t understand the the race to the bottom in consumerism; let’s have some stuff produced to a high quality too?

    njee20
    Free Member

    That’s the problem though innit. What do they do over and above a Light Bicycle rim at 1/6 the cost? Other than give you a warm glow because everyone knows you spent so much? The alternatives are not poor quality.

    They’re not lighter
    They’re not stronger
    I’ve never seen data to suggest they’re stiffer?
    They’re less user friendly

    rone
    Full Member

    Well anecdotely I spent 1150 on some U.S.E carbon wheels and they didn’t feel that great to me; leaden and not particularly stiff. That made me understand that just being carbon is not the be all and end all.

    Also isn’t the aim of riding to come away with a warm fuzzy glow. No matter how that is achieved.

    rone
    Full Member

    And for the quality (as I was trying to buy a cheaper alternative to Enve in USE ) – they split when I took a tyre off.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    cynic-al – Member

    I don’t think its that simple – a bike that feels fast isn’t always faster.

    Of course- hence “can” not “will”. But there’s no reason to doubt “I put carbon wheels on my bike and went 10% faster”, that’s a completely reasonable idea once you add a human brain to the equation. I fitted a louder exhaust pipe to my motorbike and went faster 😆 Power was slightly down because the jetting was wrong but I opened the throttle more.

    adsh
    Free Member

    If you don’t have them and aren’t going to get any why would you give a sh*t? If you have them and are happy why would you care if a bunch of cheapskates knock them?

    I cant afford them and dont care if they give 10% or fold like tissue.

    iolo
    Free Member

    If they make the owner happy what’s the problem?

    samjgeorge86
    Free Member

    “I like to ride my bike fast” has to be the best comment on here.
    Total cock swinging, “I have ENVE wheels, I’m soooo much faster than you common folk”. 😆

    Put wheels on your bike, ride your bike. If you’re fast, you’re fast, if you ain’t, you ain’t. Bad workmen blame their tools…
    They are wheels for christ sake. Unless you are racing in professional circuits what does it really matter?

    Personally, I would never buy ENVE wheels, I can get the same for cheaper. But I am more than happy with my “cheapskate” EN521’s, that do the job perfectly well.

    So much “my dicks bigger than your dick” on here… Get over it, they are wheels…

    amedias
    Free Member

    I’ve just got some enve m50s and they feel and ride completely differently to cheaper carbon rims.

    in what way and which rims? just curious…

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    But there’s no reason to doubt “I put carbon wheels on my bike and went 10% faster”, that’s a completely reasonable idea once you add a human brain to the equation

    Is there a 10% gap between those on carbon wheel and those not?

    tomhoward
    Full Member

    Total cock swinging, “I have ENVE wheels, I’m soooo much faster than you common folk”.

    I have 2 pairs. Thus I am twice as fast as the paupers.

    Wow, 3 threads in as many days where strangers are asking me to defend my purchases. More chips than Harry Ramsdens…

    Northwind
    Full Member

    cynic-al – Member

    Is there a 10% gap between those on carbon wheel and those not?

    There’s a 10% gap between Geetee on carbon wheels and not.

    samjgeorge86
    Free Member

    Haha! Wasn’t asking you to defend your purchase. Never once said you should defend what you buy, got the money to buy it, buy it. I’m just saying that personally I don’t see the requirement for a pro piece of kit when I ain’t no pro rider.

    Like I said, they are wheels, buy whatever you like or can afford and ride your bike, don’t sit there rubbing it in people faces and calling them “cheapskates” because they don’t have a wheel set that costs as much as yours… Kinda sad ain’t it.

    amedias
    Free Member

    Wow, 3 threads in as many days where strangers are asking me to defend my purchases

    I dont think its about the actual amount spent, plenty of normal people spend more on cars, watches, holidays, laptops etc, not me I’m skint but I love seeing the really nice kit out on the trails, gives me something to oooh and ahhh over 🙂

    I think its people struggling to understand how/why they are so much more than alternative carbon rims.
    From a spec point of view it seems like a poor choice on the actual technical and provable aspects of it.

    If you buy them cos you like them and can afford them then fair play to you, ive been known to buy things ‘just because i like them’ before and i wouldn’t begrudge anyone for doing so.

    geetee1972
    Free Member

    Sam no one has ever called anyone a cheapskate and no one is swinging their dick least of all me. If that’s what you thought people were saying or implying then it would explain why you seem so angry. So apologies if I played any part in that.

    Honestly I do just like riding my bike fast, which like anything else is a relative term. It’s relative to me. To whether I’m riding at 90% of my ability or at 100%. The carbon wheels gave me the confidence to ride at 100% whereas before I was riding at 90%. There you go that’s your 10%.

    Be happy guys. Life is short and youth is even shorter (Sammy boy).

    samjgeorge86
    Free Member

    adsh – Member
    If you don’t have them and aren’t going to get any why would you give a sh*t? If you have them and are happy why would you care if a bunch of cheapskates knock them?

    That’s the cheapskates reference, I’m not angry 🙂 I don’t mean to sound it.
    I’m just baffled that people can be so defensive and argumentative over a set of wheels.
    I fully agree with you with that geetee, life is far far too short to be bothered about things like this.

    Wheels are wheels like I said, if they go round and round, and get you up or down the hill, where’s the problem?
    If you can spend £xxxx on wheels, do it! Lord knows I would! But the variances in the wheels are probably so slight, how many people can really really tell the difference? Placebo effect from having a lighter wallet probably has more bearing on how your new kit feels than reality.

    dirtyrider
    Free Member

    I have 2 pairs. Thus I am twice as fast as the paupers.

    i have 3 pairs at the moment

    geetee1972
    Free Member

    It is definitely more than just placebo and depending on what your coming from the difference can be pretty drastic. But in the grand scheme of things it is pretty marginal when compared to say going from a hardtail to a full suss.

    Sorry that someone was rude enough to make that cheap remark. That wasn’t cool.

    There are two debates here. One is about carbon rims per se the other about Enves products specifically. I only bought the Enves because at the time there was no alternative. I trashed a set of haven carbons twice by that point and had got my money back. The havens just had too low a spoke count and I wanted rims I could have built up traditionally. I’d buy the Light Bicycle ones now if I ever get back on the mountain bike.

    DanW
    Free Member

    I did timed tests and found it made about 10% difference. The ‘feel good factor’ though was about 50%.

    😆 🙄

    Couldn’t make it up! Oh, wait… 😆

    To be honest I would be devastated if I spent all that money and the feel good factor was just 50% better. How fun the wheels feel is the only thing you have a chance of quantifying and I’d want them to be at least twice as good as something so extortionate priced

    Any hoo, the hole digging is amusing. Please continue 😀

    nowthen
    Free Member

    I have the 26″ Enve AM wheels… They definitely do feel very different, much more direct, but I am still undecided after 3 months if they are better or worse than alloy wheels. I think the flex in most alloy rims is maybe desirable? I do love how the Enves look and I also dropped about half a pound of rotating weight, but I am not entirely sure I would buy them again, for example if I went to 27.5″… Probably just stick with alloy.

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    I actually find the whole composite rims thing fascinating, on road bikes I think they work as they are, a straight replacement for an alloy rim in a traditionally constructed, spoked wheel…

    For MTB use I think there is a way to go, what seems to have happened is that deepmsections and low spoke counts have been transposed from road wheels and they are not hacking it in all situations… I think maybe a deeper examination of the stresses MTB wheels are subject to and considering a change from traditional construction might be needed. Is “stiffer” necessarily better? Dunno, we’ve spent the last couple of decades fitting wider, lower pressure tyres to MTBs, we must want some level of compliance from our wheels…

    One thing I do like about composites is that they are actually relatively simple to repair so rather that banning a cracked carbon wheel as you would with an alluminium equivalent I can seema benefit there…

    The cost thing is what it is, composites are labour party intensive, prices will only reduce with volume or use of techniques which reduce the amount of skilled labour needed, I can foresee cheaper carbon rims in a few years then we’ll see how anti carbon people really are…

    geetee1972
    Free Member

    Dan you’re being a dick. Just don’t ok.

    Rorschach
    Free Member

    you’re being a dick. Just don’t ok.

    rone
    Full Member

    in what way and which rims? just curious

    I explained about the U.S.E rims ?

    Rorschach
    Free Member

    njee20
    Free Member

    I can foresee cheaper carbon rims in a few years then we’ll see how anti carbon people really are…

    They’re already out there, and folk are lapping them up!

    what seems to have happened is that deepmsections and low spoke counts have been transposed from road wheels and they are not hacking it in all situations.

    I disagree, most MTB rims are about 25ish mm deep, which is very shallow, and most wheelsets are 28 or 32 spokes.

    kimbers
    Full Member

    I have to admit that the driect feel ofmy LB carbon rims is awesome, not sure if the snappier acceleration is more about the reduced weight, than stiffnessofrim, shirley stiffness of spokes would make more difference to that feel?

    they certainly feel better in turns too, although 35mm wide could be width too

    but I do find on rock gardens etc that the extra stiffness results in a rougher ride, my frames already quite stiff, so im running a bit less pressure in my tyres and maybe in my shock too

    Hob-Nob
    Free Member

    I have 2 pairs. Thus I am twice as fast as the paupers.

    Wow, 3 threads in as many days where strangers are asking me to defend my purchases. More chips than Harry Ramsdens…

    I don’t think anyone is asking people to defend their purchases? This was started from a link from one of the biggest biking websites who have tested a couple of sets of Enve wheels & had a couple of very public failures.

    The debate was then sparked about whether they actually improve the ride & make you go faster in real terms, or just look pretty & have the feel good factor.

    It’s fair to say I think everyone is in agreement they do feel different. However, different doesn’t always mean faster. We’ve had some fairly spurious improvement claims & then we had the “i’m fast” gem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyTyjQbvylg

    I have the 26″ Enve AM wheels… They definitely do feel very different, much more direct, but I am still undecided after 3 months if they are better or worse than alloy wheels. I think the flex in most alloy rims is maybe desirable? I do love how the Enves look and I also dropped about half a pound of rotating weight, but I am not entirely sure I would buy them again, for example if I went to 27.5″… Probably just stick with alloy.

    You have raised an interesting point, which I have in the past too about wheel flex. Maybe on a 29″ they make more sense, as 29″ wheels can be a bit floppy otherwise.

    I have found the carbon wheels can be too stiff in some occasions, such as holding a line on a long rooty, off camber section. Stiff wheels cause the bike to feel like it’s pinging off the roots, making it harder to hold the line, rather than wheel flex allowing for some movement.

    There is some information out there from Vouilloz who used to run crazy low tension in his wheels to allow for wheel flex as it was faster, and more recently with the Syndicate riders running lower spoke tensions to try & bring some flex into the wheels. Being stiffer doesn’t necessarily mean better in every instance.

Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 97 total)

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