Looking for. my first e-bike, with the view to it being targeted at getting me back to longish days out in the hills, rather than trail centre/parks where I seem to have spent most of my time last few years. Budget is only 5kish tops, and I’m currently leaning towards the Orbea Rise H15, but wondering whether I should just buy the entry level Levo for the warranty and be done with it? Did wonder about the Levo SL but can’t really see the point of to for the small weight saving.

Are there any standout bikes I should be looking at?

geometry, wheel size and the subtleties of suspension largely pass me by these days, I normally ride an Aeris 145 which does pretty much anything I want of it, but the bike I’m looking for doesn’t need to be anywhere as accomplished.

Like most things see if you can try a few, especially the different motor types if you are going for a full fat e… the power delivery will feel different. Once you find the motor you want, then its battery size for longer days then its manufacturer, components and frame material. Components, go durability not weight but good spec brakes for an overall increased weight.

Watch some YouTube comparisons, but as mentioned, test a few.

Turbo Levo and Fantic e-Fat owner here, all with Brose motors and very happy.

I have a 2021 Levo, so it’s a 29er front and back unlike the newer models that are Mullets….bleurgh. Before I got the Levo, my normal goto bike was my Orange 4, a wonderfully poppy and fast bike.

The Levo is a better bike.

Even without the assist, the 29er wheels and the massively long wheelbase make it into a confidence inspiring bulldozer of a bike, it’ll take on anything and laugh it off. The multi-pivot suspension design feels better than my Orange’s single pivot as well, although I don’t fancy servicing it.

It’s heavy though at 22-25kg (I ride an XL), and is a bugger to lift over gates etc. Also, if you’re a large chap like myself (110kg), a longish day in the hills might not be that long. Biggest day I’ve managed has been around the 60km mark with around 1000m of climbing and that was almost exclusively ridden in Eco mode. Although the beauty of the Levo’s phone based Mission Control app is that you can tweak all the power settings, or even tell it how far you expect to go and let it manage the battery for you.

<Devil’s advocate>

should just buy the entry level Levo for the warranty and be done with it?

Isn’t it ironic that a company spews out sub standard product that frequently needs to be fixed under warranty, and people laud them for the warranty support rather than slating them for the substandard product…

</Devil’s advocate>

the 29er wheels and the massively long wheelbase make it into a confidence inspiring bulldozer of a bike, it’ll take on anything and laugh it off

That genuinely sounds awful.

The orbea rise looks a great bike.

Have a look on race co cycles eBay shop, they had an orbea on there along with some levos.

I went for the cube stereo hybrid 160 and it’s excellent just a bit on the heavy side.

Have a look at the Rob Rides EMTB channel on YouTube. He pretty much has reviewed them all. His forum, EMTB forums, also has manufacturer specific sections so you can get some opinion there.

Obviously what you tend to hear about on the internet is issues, but you have to remember the many without issues.

I’m not up on the Spesh models but I think the Orbea has a bit more power?
It’s a great looking bike too.
I’ve got the fat Orbea and it’s so far been spot on. I always would have preferred the Rise but the deal breaker for me was non removable battery which doesn’t work well for where I live.

If you’re looking for a long term keeper some motors are more maintainable than others, shimano aren’t easily rebuildable(not sure any commercial rebuilders are doing them) brose, Bosch, Yamaha – are fairly rebuildable.

If you can get a good secondhand 20 levo it will have a 4 yr warranty on motor only, so about as long as a new bike with 2yr one, (*suggest checking with Specialized first) – https://www.emtbforums.com/community/threads/warranty-extension-firmware-update-for-all-2019-20-levo-kenevo-with-2-1-motors.14500/ “ Which bikes are covered and how will the 4-year warranty work?
All 2.1 motors fitted to model year 2019/20 Levo & model year 2020 Kenevo bikes immediately carry a 4-year warranty from the date of purchase. No certificate or new warranty document is required, our authorised retailers will base any motor warranty claim on bike serial number.”

Looking for. my first e-bike, with the view to it being targeted at getting me back to longish days out in the hills, rather than trail centre/parks where I seem to have spent most of my time last few years.

I got a couple of 2 day demo’s from my LBS’s for a Rise and then a full-fat enduro-type Cube.

For what you’re fancying I reckon the Rise is a good option, especially the alloy one with the bigger battery & extender. Should be good for 50 miles & 5,000ft based on what I got out of the older/small battery carbon one.

The Generalist

Isn’t it ironic that a company spews out sub standard product that frequently needs to be fixed under warranty, and people laud them for the warranty support rather than slating them for the substandard product…

Erm YUP …. and that’s not not even starting on out of warranty parts

@vinnyeh

Even more than “real” bikes TRY before you buy for the motor and power… then look at warranty.
I’d agree with the buy a cheaper and upgrade above… as warranty is pretty much everything keeping it from being a brick

TBH after that it’s more what works for you…

1) Full/lite
personally I like the full fat and smashing up hills like they are DH’s is awesome. Some of my fav trails are actually smashing up the climbs at 15mph bouncing off rocks and taking in jumps where possible… This is also the one thing absolutely surprised me.
(Before I tried I was 100% convinced I’d want some sort of 1/2 fat… but I totally had underestimated the fun in sketchy fun going 2 ways…I would absolutelyhave bought the wrong bike for me)

I’d recommend trying one up some daft tech climb at 15mph… it’s like you only ever rode XC and went to a bike park and magically had the skill/experience to send big stuff… HOWEVER you can also climb stuff that’s impossible for a mortal with nearly no effort and just a bit of skill… if you can find grip and not loop out and mates with lite’s can’t…

2) Travel
Not sure what to say here… mine is an old 160/150 and way too much for my local Surrey Hills to be fun for me. I end up riding the HT 90% of the time locally… To some extent you get more fun on the ups… so I ride stuff I’d not bother on the FS Enduro just because its fun and easy to get back up but to try and sum it up .. lots of stuff I don’t ride on the mechanical 160/150 because its not that much fun on the down and not worth the effort on the ups…
I guess that ties in with 1 above???

If you like riding to be a bit edgy and prefer underbiked to over then worth thinking about

3) Is it the “only bike”…
I never let go of my mechanical ones but mates who did have mostly bought replacement mechanicals as well.
Where we live it seems hardcore HT’s are a nice balance to the EMTB and a giggle at bike parks as well?

Me and my wife have finally stopped talking about getting ebikes and actually got them.

She went for the Megawatt and I got a Kenevo SL. Mine is significantly lighter than hers, but she has a lot more power for the steeper climbs.

However, I’m having a bit of buyer’s remorse on mine as I’ve only had it a week and it’s back at the shop with a wobbly motor!

I was going to get the same as her, but couldn’t find one in my size. Apparently the wobbly cranks on mine is a common fault that is caused by the cranks being knocked and dislodging a bushing.

I’ve also test ridden a Levo SL before and I think they have their place. I’m a lot stronger than my wife on the climbs so me having a lighter weight ebike and her on a “full fat” is a nice leveler.

The lower power ones mean you have to work a bit harder but they are easier to get over gates at least 🙂

The Rise seems like a good bet for what you’re looking for. I’d have also suggested the new Trek Fuel Ex-E, but it might be a bit out of budget/stock.

I’ve recently been through the same.

Don’t mind admitting that I was an electric bike sceptic and was first in the queue to say ‘I don’t need one’

However I changed my mind overnight after a quick ride months ago.

When given the ok from the good lady wife, I sat on a few, read a lot of reviews and ended up with a 2022 Giant Trance XE1 – iirc.

Was the only one that had geometry similar to my Ripmo, had good kit, big battery and importantly for my fat ass, had a reasonable weight limit.

A couple of months in and I love it. Goes everywhere, does everything and makes my rides go out to 3 hours+ over the couple at best before.

All in all I am getting lighter and fitter whilst riding more – all as a result of the ebike. If you’re fit to start with, maybe this reasoning doesn’t make sense but, for me the ebike was the best thing I’ve bought in cycling for probably 20 years.

One big aspect to be aware of is just how heavy and massive they are. I don’t notice at all when moving along but, stationary or getting through tight spots and over things – it is damned heavy.

Thanks all. I’m going to arrange to get hold of a demo Rise for a day or 2, but otherwise there don’t seem to be many places around where I am that have demo bikes available. I hadn’t thought about the Trance- might have to investigate that a bit further.

Definitely try and demo a Full Fat I was completely surprised how much fun they are.

Where are you based? Tweedlove Festival is on in the borders soon with lots of very cheap demos. There are also several places in Innerleithen where you can try both full fat and SL style bikes. The Bike Shop dot he SLs and Ride Innerleithen have FFs from Pivot and Whyte. I think there’s also a hire place at GT.

Home

I’d go for the Levo SL and the extra battery. I was very impressed with the one I hired. I got about 30km of hilly mountain biking and still had a couple of bars of battery left.

It just rides like a bike, the extra weight wasn’t really noticable.

The other thing is with ebikes like the Levo (not SL) is they’re too heavy to go on roof racks and some rear racks.

That demo day looks incredibly good value, shame I’ve got something else on that weekend 😣

I’d say the megawatt looks a good bike. Fair on the equipment side of things. @£5K it looks a fair price too. Far too many seem to now have decent bikes starting at the £6k mark, or even higher, and usually with far lower spec.

Only downside is the Shimano motors are not serviceable, or at least the main servicing companies are not including them in their accepted models, but whether that will change I could not say, but tbh i doubt it.

I would suggest Bosch, they have a very good reputation thus far, and can be repaired or bit replaced without issue.

As above. Join the Emtb forum and spend some time looking at the forum boards. Each maker has their own section, so its easier to get an idea of ow each model performs, and any and all problems are covered.

Rob Rides(its his forum) on you tube is a good place to watch him ‘test’ the bikes, but thats just a single opinion, and the forum itself offers a better real world insight.

people laud them for the warranty support rather than slating them for the substandard product

But… all ebikes have a relatively high number of motor returns… (I say “relatively”, because, obviously, all normal bikes don’t have a motor to fail at all).

If buying an ebike, making sure motor problems when new are fixed quickly without fuss is top of the list of requirements, for everyone.

Personally, I’d get something with a Shimano motor, for that reason… but whatever you go for… make sure a fix for an early motor fail is only a week or so away.

But… all ebikes have a relatively high number of motor returns… (I say “relatively”, because, obviously, all normal bikes don’t have a motor to fail at all).

Agreed but .. well it’s pretty crap in and of itself but when you consider the consequences for failure outside warranty it’s dire as its essentially a brick.

I just looked at Ford warranty

Three years or 60,000 miles from new, whichever comes first

That’s for something starting at £19,405 so not much more than top end e-bikes.
All the ones I can see are 2yrs motor warranty but the big difference is you can get your Fiesta repaired anywhere and can buy parts.

I just looked at Ford warranty

Three years or 60,000 miles from new, whichever comes first

Or you can get a Kia Piccanto for £12250 with a 7 year 100000 mile fully transferable warranty.

I’m not buying any ebike until the warranty and reliability have improved.

Buy local so you have dealer support if (when!) something goes wrong.

All else being equal I would look for a Bosch or Brose motor as they are almost fully repairable, and a non-bike-specific battery pack that is easily available.

I have a 2018 Levo which is tied to the Specialized M1 Battery and it is this that makes me most nervous. I have had it 4 years and while I have done in excess of 4000 miles on it, I am still on the original cassette and chain (I rotate 3, swapping every 100km or so), but I AM ON THE 4TH MOTOR…

As has been said, be aware that Shimano motors are not servicable. There does not appear to be anyone in the country who will touch them. This is because Shimano will not supply spares.
.

I’ve a base model Levo SL and love it. I can move it about/ pick it up with no drama, think it’s about 17kg. It has made me fall in love with climbing!
The Levo SL and full fat Levo have completely different motors, my understanding is the full fat ones have more issues.
I’ve ridden a full fat emtb, and for me the extra weight changed the handling in a negative way. I would definitely try and ride before you buy. For me full fat on full power uphill on technical trails is unmanageable.
I’ve a range extender as well, my biggest ride so far was 40 miles and 3500 ft climbing, I still had 15% left.
The Orbea rise was out of stock when I bought mine, patience is not my strong point!!
Good luck, I hope you find something that works for you.

the consequences for failure outside warranty it’s dire as its essentially a brick

You might have to buy a new and expensive part. The car comparison works well here. New motor about £800, new battery about £400. Small part of the complete bike price. Similar to new fork and wheels if they need replacing.

Was in a similar situation a few months back. Struggled to find stock eventually buying a Cube 160TM more than enough travel but it rides so much better than it should. Do it all one bike, great spec for the money. I love it and enjoying being back on the trails

New motor about £800, new battery about £400.

There’s quite a big difference in replacement motor costs between brands. If you’re concerned about motor replacement and cost add the cost of a replacement motor to the purchase price when comparing. You can generally get 2x Bosch motors for the price of 1 x Brose motor.

Also if you buy second hand and want a warranty (as someone suggested above), make sure the warranty is transferrable (many of them aren’t…not sure about Specialized).

with motors they live in the most stressed area of the bike with seals constantly working, and in the firing line for crud, water on teh seals and hits of rocks etc. plus they are mechanical and have electrics, plus they are tiny and have tight tolerances – its no wonder some fail!

having had mine for nearly 2 years i’d happily buy another motor for it. i’d be annoyed but it is ridiculous fun riding it and i wouldnt want to be without an ebike now. i ride so much more, and have more fun, because of it.

Or you can get a Kia Piccanto for £12250 with a 7 year 100000 mile fully transferable warranty.

I’m not buying any ebike until the warranty and reliability have improved.

Its this that keeps putting me off. Its shocking that a bike costing north of £5k only has a 2 yr warranty. ie the manufacturer is telling you it is likely to fail quickly. £2.5k a year to ride a bike !

Thats me looking at an Orbea Rise

how may of those engines in that kia do they make and how many years development has gone into that engine? vs the ebike motor?

how may of the motors in that kai get run in the rain and mud? with no bonnet to protect it. i bet if you took that kia in for warrenty after taking it on a rally stage and with it covered in crap you probably wouldnt get a warrenty replacement.

not may bike manufacturers give that long warrenties on regular bikes components? whats the usual warrenty on a rear mech for instance?

how may of those engines in that kia do they make and how many years development has gone into that engine? vs the ebike motor?

how may of the motors in that kai get run in the rain and mud? with no bonnet to protect it. i bet if you took that kia in for warrenty after taking it on a rally stage and with it covered in crap you probably wouldnt get a warrenty replacement.

not may bike manufacturers give that long warrenties on regular bikes components? whats the usual warrenty on a rear mech for instance?

The difference is you can get parts and fix your cars engine once its out of warranty. If the internal clutch or torque sensor break on a Shimano motor, the whole motor does in the bin.

It’s not just ebike motors either, the amount of stuff being made for bikes that can’t be repaired outside warranty seems to increase each year. More expensive stuff is often worse, especially when it involves electronics.

I think the EU had to take action over this sort of thing for white goods (right to repair). Now manufacturers have to make spares available for a certain period of time. They need to do the same here IMO.

rant over!

Its shocking that a bike costing north of £5k only has a 2 yr warranty. ie the manufacturer is telling you it is likely to fail quickly. £2.5k a year to ride a bike !

Its not the bike that has a 2 year warranty, its the motor and battery. The various other bits of the bike have the same warranty as any other mountain bike that uses the same parts, ie frame is anywhere from 2 years to lifetime (depending on manufacturer), forks (assuming fox or RS) are 2 years etc etc.

Its not £2.5k per year to ride a bike (unless you give it away after 2 years!) , its whatever you buy it for minus whatever you sell it for, plus whatever you spend on maintenance , divided by the number of years.

As most have said, replacing a motor or battery out of warranty is pretty similar in cost to replacing a set of high end forks, or wheels etc . They (motor & battery) are additional components that a normal bike doesnt have , for sure, but expensive bikes have expensive parts….. but that doesnt mean that if the motor fails out of warranty that your bike is useless, you just (in the worst case scenario ) end up buying a new motor for it – which has another 2 years warranty.

The difference compared to buying new forks,wheels etc, is that with forks you can just go onto CRC (or your shop of choice) and buy a set of forks and fit them yourself, with the motors you usually need to go to a dealer for that type of motor and get them to sort it for you .

Thats me looking at an Orbea Rise

A mate of mine is on motor number 4 within 600 miles on his rise – but dont let that put you off……I’m on motor #2 on my bosch bike – and am now out of warranty….

Its not the bike that has a 2 year warranty, its the motor and battery.

I know that, but an ebike is useless without a motor, so the frame/bike warranty is pointless.

how may of those engines in that kia do they make and how many years development has gone into that engine? vs the ebike motor?

how may of the motors in that kai get run in the rain and mud? with no bonnet to protect it. i bet if you took that kia in for warrenty after taking it on a rally stage and with it covered in crap you probably wouldnt get a warrenty replacement.

And for so long as people such as yourself have such low expectations on what you expect for your money then bike manufacturers will be able to keep pedalling crap. Car manufacturers have brought electric cars to market until they have proven the technology is reliable. Not so the bike industry.

A mate of mine is on motor number 4 within 600 miles on his rise – but dont let that put you off……I’m on motor #2 on my bosch bike – and am now out of warranty….

The fact that companies can afford to keep replacing these parts means they cant be costing the amount the consumer is being charged for them

I know that, but an ebike is useless without a motor, so the frame/bike warranty is pointless.

Like I said, you just buy a new motor if it fails out of warranty, same as any part on your bike failing out of warranty.

A mountain bike with a broken high end fork is as useless as an ebike with a broken motor, and a broken high end fork costs about the same to replace as a motor. ok forks are less likely to break than a motor and should last longer , but still….

almost everything that moves (and a few things that dont move) on a mountain bike is a consumable. It’d be great if motors were more reliable , they need to be more reliable , but its early days for them – like the early dropper posts.

boriselbrus

Or you can get a Kia Piccanto for £12250 with a 7 year 100000 mile fully transferable warranty.

I’m not buying any ebike until the warranty and reliability have improved.

Yeah I wasn’t even trying very hard…. the stark difference in reliability and warranty is so big I didn’t feel I needed to.

And for so long as people such as yourself have such low expectations on what you expect for your money then bike manufacturers will be able to keep pedalling crap.

but you are not comparing apples and apples are you – motorbike warrenites are usually much less than the kia warrenty and are much more applicable to the application as the guts of the bike are exposed to the elements and therefore the likelyhood of failure are much higher. Warrenty is a betting game for big business.

It sucks warrenty isnt better – yes. it sucks you cant service some of the motors – yes. is my ebike up there with the best things i`ve ever bought – absolutely yes. do i ride it hard in all weathers – oh yes – i love the mud.

I appreciate i am lucky i can afford a new motor and such a luxury item as i know many cant. that said – mine isnt a posh one.

but you are not comparing apples and apples are you – motorbike warrenites are usually much less than the kia warrenty and are much more applicable to the application as the guts of the bike are exposed to the elements and therefore the likelyhood of failure are much higher. Warrenty is a betting game for big business.

Honda’s warranty on CRF’s is 6 months parts and labour. Gives some perspective to e-bike coverage.

julians

Its not the bike that has a 2 year warranty, its the motor and battery. The various other bits of the bike have the same warranty as any other mountain bike that uses the same parts, ie frame is anywhere from 2 years to lifetime (depending on manufacturer), forks (assuming fox or RS) are 2 years etc etc.

Its not £2.5k per year to ride a bike (unless you give it away after 2 years!) , its whatever you buy it for minus whatever you sell it for, plus whatever you spend on maintenance , divided by the number of years.

As most have said, replacing a motor or battery out of warranty is pretty similar in cost to replacing a set of high end forks, or wheels etc . They (motor & battery) are additional components that a normal bike doesnt have , for sure, but expensive bikes have expensive parts….. but that doesnt mean that if the motor fails out of warranty that your bike is useless, you just (in the worst case scenario ) end up buying a new motor for it – which has another 2 years warranty.

The difference compared to buying new forks, wheels etc, is that with forks you can just go onto CRC (or your shop of choice) and buy a set of forks and fit them yourself, with the motors you usually need to go to a dealer for that type of motor and get them to sort it for you .

Like I said, you just buy a new motor if it fails out of warranty, same as any part on your bike failing out of warranty.

A mountain bike with a broken high end fork is as useless as an ebike with a broken motor, and a broken high end fork costs about the same to replace as a motor. ok forks are less likely to break than a motor and should last longer , but still….

almost everything that moves (and a few things that don’t move) on a mountain bike is a consumable. It’d be great if motors were more reliable , they need to be more reliable , but its early days for them – like the early dropper posts.

I’ve got a Bosch Gen 2 CX… feel free to provide me the link where I can buy a new one with warranty because I can’t find one.

A mountain bike with a broken high end fork is as useless as an ebike with a broken motor, and a broken high end fork costs about the same to replace as a motor. ok forks are less likely to break than a motor and should last longer , but still….

First off I can by spares for my “high end forks”… I can download a FULL service manual down to shim stack config and should the absolute worst happen I can replace with a similar fork even if my fork is a discontinued model. As far as I know I can’t even get a wiring diagram for the PCB’s…

If my Bosch PCB gets wet I definitively can ‘t replace it because Bosch don’t even sell them to dealers (from what I’ve been told)… nor can I buy a replacement motor (unless you can provide a link) or fit a “similar motor” like buy a Gen-4. The eMTB is basically a brick if this happens…

Also I don’t have to send my wrecked fork back to Bosch/RS/Fox to prevent any spares reaching the used market.. so for example if I wrecked my Lyrik ultimates (what I class as a high end fork) I can buy a Yari for £250 or so and just swap bits over.

The difference compared to buying new forks, wheels etc, is that with forks you can just go onto CRC (or your shop of choice) and buy a set of forks and fit them yourself

A HUGE difference is I can go onto CRC (etc.) and have them delivered next day…. if my motor breaks under warranty I might wait months with no usable bike unless the dealer I bought from is willing to take one off another bike.

I’ve got a Bosch Gen 2 CX… feel free to provide me the link where I can buy a new one with warranty because I can’t find one.

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/dealers/united-kingdom-278

As I said , if your motor breaks it can be replaced by any bosch e bike dealer, Get in touch with any bosch ebike dealer above , they will sort it for you – for a fee (obvs)

If my Bosch PCB gets wet I definitively can ‘t replace it because Bosch don’t even sell them to dealers (from what I’ve been told)… nor can I buy a replacement motor (unless you can provide a link) or fit a “similar motor” like buy a Gen-4. The eMTB is basically a brick if this happens…

You give the bike to a bosch dealer and they will fit a new motor from bosch,and charge you for it, just because you cant buy the motor direct and fit it all yourself doesnt mean your bike is a brick.

If you’re desperate to go outside the dealer network, some people are purporting to sell brand new bosch motors direct, I have no idea as to whether these are in any way dodgy, I wouldnt go this route at this point in time, I’d just go to a dealer and get it sorted (why wouldnt you?), but these do look like a way forward.

Bosch cx gen4

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265184665948?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20200818142055%26meid%3De977f693ad104f3dbea9cf5f355cf4a3%26pid%3D101113%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D144642056743%26itm%3D265184665948%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2563228%26algv%3DDefaultOrganicWeb%26brand%3DBosch&_trksid=p2563228.c101113.m2108

bosch gen 2

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265184665948?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20200818142055%26meid%3De977f693ad104f3dbea9cf5f355cf4a3%26pid%3D101113%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D144642056743%26itm%3D265184665948%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2563228%26algv%3DDefaultOrganicWeb%26brand%3DBosch&_trksid=p2563228.c101113.m2108

A HUGE difference is I can go onto CRC (etc.) and have them delivered next day…. if my motor breaks under warranty I might wait months with no usable bike unless the dealer I bought from is willing to take one off another bike.

yes, I said that was the difference between buying new forks and a new motor.but the bike is most definitely not a brick if the motor fails, and it definitely does not cost £5k for 2 years use.

Seeing as we have pivoted onto spares / repairs… this company will be getting my Brose motors as and when. Plus they have a network of associate companies so there is one here in Germany.

As mentioned by others definitely buy local for an ebike and make sure they have a good reputation.

My lbs stopped selling specialized ebikes due to the motor failure rate.

That’s from a friend who bought a levo from them a couple of years ago and has had a motor replacement