Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 96 total)
  • downhill is the f1 of our industry….
  • alex222
    Free Member

    No it isn’t. Fed up of reading this obviously wrong and delusional statement. That is all.

    tomhoward
    Full Member

    Care to expand?

    wrecker
    Free Member

    Yep. It’s far, far more exciting than that and requires too much skill. WRC maybe?

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    Pook
    Full Member

    what is then?

    prezet
    Free Member

    Personally I find DH a bit boring to watch (except Danny Hart’s run last season), so F1 probably isn’t a bad comparison – I find 4x far more exciting, yet it’s been dropped from the UCI world cup series.

    passtherizla
    Free Member

    Pook – Member
    what is then?

    surely weight weenied Carbon XC bikes are the formula one of the MTB world..? DH is more like monster trucks or Rally as previously suggested.

    alex222
    Free Member

    just read it on the comments board dirt website regarding 29 dh bikes. It is the most pointless comparison. I have read it before and thought why compare two dissimilar things and then say that they are alike? Are mountain bikers/dirt readers this mentally, creatively and literary challenged? Or is this level of uselessness infiltrated throughout the world of cycling?

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    If you need to have a motorsports analogy DH is perhaps more akin to Rallying or of course MX or Enduro (assuming reference to two wheeled Motorsports is allowed)…

    Although of course when I had to try and explain DH to a work colleage the other day I said it was essentially the same format as Downhill sking (single competitor at a time down the course, against the clock) but on an enginless MX bike, Sort of…

    To my mind Track cycling is more like F1, a totally pared down to the bare essentials version of racing on a purpose built track, using purpose built bikes that are totally impractical in most other environments.

    DH is a unique sport, similar in certain aspects to many others, but not totally comparable to any of them really…

    All IMO of course…

    Garry_Lager
    Full Member

    What’s meant by the comparison – is it to say F1 is the vanguard of technological advancement that trickles down to the mass market?

    That is the case with MTB suspension and disk brakes being pioneered on the DH scene – probably the big two (only two?) genuine innovations in mountain biking in the last 20 years.

    alex222
    Free Member

    what is then?

    Nothing. Downhill is the downhill of cycling. That is my point.

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    What’s meant by the comparison – is it to say F1 is the vanguard of technological advancement that trickles down to the mass market?

    I’d agree with this. Which came first, HT2 Saint or HT2 DA groupsets? although i’m supprised shimano didn’t bring out an electronic DH specific groupset (well XTR came first and ended up on soem DH bikes).

    I’d also draw comparisons to people watching/following it, I’d guess more people have an idea what’s going on with DH results than the XC, in the same way F1 makes the news but I’ve no idea what’s going on in WRC (or ICR or any of the other rallies).

    thomthumb
    Free Member

    Nothing. Downhill is the downhill of cycling. That is my point.

    sounds like autism to me; no comparison allowed.

    njee20
    Free Member

    I’d agree with this. Which came first, HT2 Saint or HT2 DA groupsets? although i’m supprised shimano didn’t bring out an electronic DH specific groupset (well XTR came first and ended up on soem DH bikes).

    Is that a rhetorical question? HT2 XTR came in 2003, DA and Saint in 2004, as you sort of imply, so DH isn’t the technological leader.

    Shimano did Airlines for DH, but it was crap. As they don’t do an electronic MTB groupset full stop I can’t see them limiting their market so much by making it a ‘DH specific’ one.

    I don’t think you can really say that it’s the home of all technological advancements, certainly in some areas, but in terms of weight and material technology and what not it tends to lag behind other competitive disciplines.

    andyl
    Free Member

    Nascar?

    AndyP
    Free Member

    Not very exciting, people don’t overtake each other, and you don’t need to be very fit? Sounds about right.

    kimbers
    Full Member

    id say the comparison is justified in that a few 10ths of a second can make the difference in both sports,
    so equipment has to be as efficient as possible
    and things like line choice are also critical
    basically messing up your exit/ entry from 1 corner can effect your entire race run

    dh like f1 also has pit crews and a similar traveling circus between venues

    other than that they are quite different, dh is interesting f1 is dull

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    Is that a rhetorical question? HT2 XTR came in 2003, DA and Saint in 2004, as you sort of imply, so DH isn’t the technological leader.

    Shimano did Airlines for DH, but it was crap. As they don’t do an electronic MTB groupset full stop I can’t see them limiting their market so much by making it a ‘DH specific’ one.

    I originaly made a comment about track bikes being conservative (someone up there suggested they were the F1 of cycling) yet they don’t have HT2, or any other development, just refined versions (areodynamic, stiffer, lighter) of the same steel bikes they were using 100 years ago. after gettign rid ofthat comment I guess the HT2 comment was a bit out of context.

    True it’d be silly to limit it to just DH, but cable routing is usualy more of an issue on DH bikes so it might be a better application for it, even if it’s an XTR groupset with a saint mech.

    NASCAR is the Kirin of motorsport, that analogy even works as far as tactics are concerned with people draftign intot e last corner in order to get a faster run up the straight to the line.

    For a similar race format to F1 you’d have to look at Crit races or XC. But I’d still argue that F1 has the more technology and popular following.

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    I can see how people think DH is like F1, more visible technical changes and developments in DH over the last ~20 years than just about any other field of cycling, but alot of those Developments have been lifted from Motorcycles rather than F1…

    The F1 analogy falls down on many fronts really:

    In F1 Aero is King! – In DH the governing body effectively banned any work in that field because it looked “a bit Gay” apparently…

    In F1 the competitors are paid millions and are covered in logos – In DH the Competitors are paid a relative pittance and still covered in logos

    In F1 the Venues are Glamourous sun drenched and attended by Celebrities – DH venues are mostly in the Arseend of nowhere on a windy, wet hill

    In F1 you get David Coulthard and Martin Brundle giving informed Commentary throughout the race then lofty and Eddie wander about annoying the tits off of pit crews/drivers to get you all the F1 “Gossip” – In DH you get Rob Warner and any of his mates who are at a loose end, Swearing, taking the piss and occasionally discussing the racing…

    IMO DH is far better to watch, and easier to get into at a grass roots level, but I still like watching F1…

    mikey74
    Free Member

    , and you don’t need to be very fit?

    You clearly know nothing about what it takes to compete in DH at the highest level.

    I’d say in terms of frame and suspension design it is the F1 of the mtb world. Also, it is a great proving ground for new materials.

    AndyP
    Free Member

    You clearly know nothing about what it takes to compete in DH at the highest level.
    a motorbike with the engine taken off, and the ability to say ‘dude’ a lot, isn’t it?

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    Also, it is a great proving ground for new materials.

    Which ones?

    DH is pretty much the last place people are still raceing on aluminium alloy bikes, and was definately the last to have CFRP bikes.

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    a motorbike with the engine taken off, and the ability to say ‘dude’ a lot, isn’t it?

    mikey74
    Free Member

    I said a proving ground, not a place for innovation. My point being that if it is strong enough to survive a DH season, then it is more than suitable for a bunch of lightweight jeyboys.

    njee20
    Free Member

    dhcompetitive cycling like f1 also has pit crews and a similar traveling circus between venues

    FTFY

    I’d say in terms of frame and suspension design it is the F1 of the mtb world. Also, it is a great proving ground for new materials.

    Suspension design (in that there’s lots of it) perhaps, but less sure about frame design, and certainly not materials. When did you see any materials being tested in DH that had not made their mark in XC or on production bikes? We’re just seeing carbon being used more widely now.

    More money goes into designing XC/trail bikes because that’s where the manufacturer’s money is made, so I’m not sure on what grounds you can say DH is the leader?

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    Well that was allegedly the real point of the RN01wasn’t it…

    Honda weren’t really all that bothered about human powered gearboxes they were instead looking on DH as a good relatively low cost competative testing ground for new ideas and materials to use in their MX/Enduro bike frames…

    That was the rumour anyway (one of many)…

    flange
    Free Member

    a motorbike with the engine taken off, and the ability to say ‘dude’ a lot, isn’t it?

    Have you seen Gee Atherton with his top off? 😯

    See Tracey Mosely setting the highest placed brit at the last World xc round at Dalby for another example.

    You do have to be VERY fit to race DH…

    sefton
    Free Member

    what! the tours are without doubt the “f1” of cycling

    AndyP
    Free Member

    Have you seen Gee Atherton with his top off?
    I have no idea who he is, but I’m not *particularly* into seeing naked or semi-naked men, thanks.

    mikey74
    Free Member

    Have you seen Gee Atherton with his top off? I have no idea who he is, but I’m not *particularly* into seeing naked or semi-naked men, thanks.

    You are arguing about DH and you don’t know who Gee Atherton is? Please put this thread down and step away slowly as you have no right to be here.

    wrecker
    Free Member

    Well just to prove it I think we need a picture of his sister with her top off. Just in the interest of, err, balance and all that.

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    I said a proving ground, not a place for innovation. My point being that if it is strong enough to survive a DH season, then it is more than suitable for a bunch of lightweight jeyboys.

    So why did it work more allong the lines of;

    “if it is strong enough to survive a XC season, then it is more than suitable for being made 5x heavier for DH

    njee20
    Free Member

    See Tracey Mosely setting the highest placed brit at the last World xc round at Dalby for another example.

    Errr, no she wasn’t, Annie Last was 14th @ 3 minutes, Maddie Horton 53rd, Tracey Moseley 69th, a lap down.

    It’s a different fitness. A top XC racing friend rode with Steve Peat, who was extremely open about his lack of XC type fitness and ability to ride up hill, he ate a lot of cakes too. I’m generally quicker than Tracey Moseley in XC races, and she’s a hell of a lot quicker down hill!

    Why would they be fast for 2 hours, not really a requirement of their sport!?

    alex222
    Free Member

    To clear up any ambiguity about this thread; I am not particularly a f1 fan.

    compositepro
    Free Member

    timetrialling is the f1 of the bicycle world

    flange
    Free Member

    I have no idea who he is, but I’m not *particularly* into seeing naked or semi-naked men, thanks.

    *very*…..

    Yeah, sure you aren’t…….

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    [Tangent]

    I find 4x far more exciting, yet it’s been dropped from the UCI world cup series.

    Just leafing back through the thread spotted the above, and Yep I agree, as a “Made for TV” MTB race format I don’t think you could do much better than 4X there’s an article on the UCI dropping 4X WC rounds in issue 17 of Wideopen I was reading the other day, essentially it gives the impression that 4X was dropped because the Yanks have lost interest in it and hence any really lucrative TV/Sponsors etc have dried up it all seems very Sad…
    There will be a 4X World Champs still but really what’s the point? Seems like a token gesture to a very young sport the UCi have done their best to kill off…
    I have no doubt something will emerge but what and when who knows…
    Actually talking of break away series here does DH1 stand at the minute? all seems to have gone a bit quiet lately…

    [/Tangent]

    mikey74
    Free Member

    because DH requires more testing and development of materials to ensure that the material is strong enough to survive the rigours of the race season, yet lightweight enough to be competetive. This will often lead to new technologies that then filter down to other disciplines.

    OK, maybe DH doesn’t lead the way in utilising new materials, but it certainly helps refine and improve the application of them.

    stevewhyte
    Free Member

    What you on about downhill isnt even cycling.

    Its falling off a cliff with style, but nothing to do with cycling.

    XC is the WRC

    Road is F1

    wrecker
    Free Member

    XC is the WRC

    Hahahahahahahahahaha

    epicyclo
    Full Member

    I like to tease my DH friends that it’s really just fat boys rolling down hills they can’t climb.

    But really it is one of the most testing environments in the bike world for the bike and the courage/toughness required from the riders is something I couldn’t hope to match.

    I’m not sure that the technical development that happens in DH benefits the rest of us though.

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 96 total)

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