Righto the PIL want to replace some ageing 35yr old Double glazing, they have booked a company to come round this afternoon to give a quote.

Much to their disapproval I will also be present as some salesman can be of a certain ilk…

Now I know bugger all about double glazing but what do I need to look out for ?

Standard windows ?

One opening ?

Any help gladly taken ?

If he offers you a price for that day only, snap his hand off.

If they are in Huddersfield area I can recommend someone who I would trust with my family. Any good?

Use a local company, not one of the big nationals. Even Which magazine recommends that.

There is no way they can give you an accurate quote without measuring all the windows and agreeing a design with you. They would have to go away and send a quote to you once they had calculated it.

If they came to my house and didn’t measure anything I wouldn’t employ them, full stop.

If they booked a company to come, they are more likely to be legit than a cold caller. If it’s a house full of windows, I’d get more than one quote, but…

Much to their disapproval I will also be present as some salesman can be of a certain ilk…

Why not just let them get on with it without sticking your oar in and pissing them off?

My experience of this was, mostly, surprisingly positive.

Everest chap turned up, showed me some windows, measured, explained how the Everest system of pricing and discounting worked, and popped a quote in the post a couple of days later.

Two regional reputable companies did the same, sent a chap round, measured up, put quotes in the post.

No hard sell from any if them.

Local company chap turned up, strolled up my drive putting his roll up out on the floor as he did so, wandered round the back of the house, looked up, came to the front door with eyes like piss holes in the snow, and said “It’s going to be about six grand”. Then followed this up a week later with an email asking “Did we get the job then?”. Er, no.

Why not just let them get on with it without sticking your oar in and pissing them off?

Cos they are 85yrs old and British Gas royally bent them over a barrel when they had their central heating boiler replaced a few years ago…which I made a complaint about and was dealt with.

Its a large company, sadly we are not in Huddersfield thanks for the offer

Have a look on just doors website to get an indicative idea about the price you will need to pay for the windows. Then factor in labour on top of that (£150/day/person?) and you should then have an estimate to guide you price wise.

Depends who the companies are, but make sure they know you will not be ordering today, but getting another couple of quotes. Cuts through the bullshit.

I would explain politely at the start that your In Laws are not going to sign anything today. Ask them to explain exactly what type of product they are going to install, who is going to fit it and what kind of guarantee covers both the product and the fitting. Explain that you are only interested in their best quote and that you will being getting quotes from 2 other suppliers.
Once you have got all the quotes you can make an informed decision.

Only things I’d add are that cheapest isn’t always best – go for the one that feels reputable and able to amicably handle snags should there be any.

Also ask them to talk you through the process. The one that mentions little bits of above-and-beyond service, something like laying down dust sheets and vaccuuming after, checking back in a week etc should be worth moving forward with.

Multiple quotes are your friend here. When we did ours quotes ranged from £15k to £40k although some of that was based on frame material. It is worth researching glass types and thinking about what they wish to spend. Chaning our windows made a big difference to house warmth. Also note when these guys crack on with a job it’s done pretty quickly, it is worth keeping an eye on them. Factor in some redecoration.

small issue, but a big issue for PIL, salesman assured them that the sill heights and openings would remain the same so they could refit their existing blinds. when I heard this I told them that I very much doubt this…

shock horror none of their blinds fitted

” but the man said they’d be the same”

He would he’s a salesman

“why would he say that?”

To get a sale from you..

“but he was such a nice man”

🙄

Points to note: the quoted price is negotiable and some companies offer an extra discount for finance – so, if the in-laws are cash buyers, it may be worth looking at the option of taking the finance to get the extra discount and paying it off immediately (depending on any early settlement penalties).

There can also be a huge difference in price just for simple things like the configuration of the openings. No idea why, by we found this when looking at replacing our french doors – we thought adding a small opening to the side panel wouldn’t be significant and it doubled the price. Salesman was clueless as to exactly why – suffice to say we went without!

Not all double glazing is of equal quality. Do a bit of research up front. Also, the install is as important as the quality of the glazing/frames.

We had one of the large companies round to quote our house…. soffits, guttering, windows the whole lot.

started at a quite eye watering price of 12k !! He didnt find it funny when I laughed at him.

Then he tried the trick of going to speak to his manager on the phone etc etc.

Best price he could do was 8k

I got a local guy round on recommendation and he done the whole lot plus supplied and fitted a rather nice composite front door for £6 k

That was 8 windows, a front door, 10 replacement panels for the conservatory and another window we weren’t changing and all the soffits and guttering for house and porch.

Whatever you do, don’t use Safestyle. They will harass you for more work for years to come.

Take care to agree the method of finishing off around the edges; fitting new frames into old holes is problematic because they have to be smaller than the original wood frames, hence the fitter has to use lots of mastic and plastic strips to fit them and fill the gaps. We’ve just had our front windows done by a local firm and while they did a good job, the fitters finished off around the outside with lots of plastic strips and white mastic, which exaggerates the size and thickness of the frames and looks a mess. By contrast our back windows were fitted with a brown mastic, which the fitter either masked or knifed off the frames leaving a sharp straight edge and this looks much better because it actually diminishes the visual thickness of the frames. PVCu frames have to be thick because they are bendy. I wish we had stretched to aluminium; too late now.

Take care also to understand the terms of the warranty; we did use SS for the rear windows and we had to get them back because the metal mechanisms were rusting badly and flaking. The engineer came, looked at the mess and phoned his boss. I heard his boss ask in a triumphant voice: “Have they been maintained?” and when the engineer replied that yes, I had maintained them, the boss’s disappointment was palpable. We got all the metal work replaced under warranty and I have smeared everything with Mr Sheen to protect it from the condensation that happens when they are open in cold weather and moist air flows through. Another reason we are disappointed with SS is that the back windows are quite big, top-hinged and the long length of the opener means the side bars distort and don’t fully compress the rubber seals, so when it’s windy drafts get though and there are moaning noises. Again, we had SS back and they fitted thicker better seals but this hasn’t cured the problem.

When I was a “designer” for Hammonds Bedrooms (designer being another name for sales person) the best thing to hear at the start of an appointment was a polite “We’re not going to sign anything today”.

Bingo. They know why I’m here, They’re serious about buying and they’ve just told me what their primary objection is.

A very high conversion rate from those appointments.

You are right to sit in on any meetings they have. If necessary explain to them that you don’t think they are stupid, but that tons of people have been conned over the years. Double glazing salesmen didn’t get the reputation they have for nothing.

Had a guy round once who gave me a price and then gave me 50% discount if I signed there and then. Thanks but no thanks.

Lots of very good companies out there and they deserve the custom. Pick one of them.

Ask any neighbour if they have had it done. Let them know you are having several quotes. Keep conversation on track for what you want so not at it all day.

Whatever you do, don’t use Safestyle.

Agreed. Constant calls from call centre and pretty shoddy quality stuff. Add in fitters who really don’t care and we are on to a winner!

They should decide what they want in advance (as long as they’re happy with the mass-market product, crack on – they’re probably not the best but they won’t kill anyone) and then get Mr Everest to do his thing, including outlining guarantees etc and ringing up for a “special” price

… and they then should tell him that they’ll order, today only, but only if he’ll drop it by another 25% or so – otherwise don’t bother coming back

If nothing else it’ll while away a day

Get quotes from a few local firms, the products and prices may not be that different but the level of service may well be.

Whatever you do, don’t use Safestyle. They will harass you for more work for years to come.

I’ll second that. My elderly father in law had the unfortunate experience of getting embroiled with them. They absolutely screwed him for various amounts of money including reroofing a flat roof that was done the previous year. Unfortunately we were not aware this was going on as he lived 200 miles away. They also tried to charge him something like £6k for a roller garage door. We reported them to trading standards and the rip off work they did was added to the case file they have on them.

They really are a bunch of thieving unscrupulous bastards that pray on the elderly.

Make sure whoever you choose is FENSA registered. Don’t go for externally glazed systems.
Know what you want before they come along, sketch out designs of the windows.
I had quotes ranging from £1300 to £6500 for the same windows….

Unfitgeezer – Where are you based?? Might help if someone knows someone in the area that they’d happily recommend

+1 for Safestyle being a bunch of cheeky barstewards.

Had them round to quote, and he wouldn’t quote because Mrs Dubs was not there.

Took quite a while for them to stop phoning me up asking if I wanted to proceed. ****.

We have had most of our doors & windows replaced by Anglian. Reasonable quote for all the work done. Let the salesman do all his “just ring up to check” bullshit (I’m sure he just rings the speaking clock) and it comes down to a fair price.

I think that having invited them in you lose some of your cooling off rights that might apply to a cold caller.
On writing that I am suddenly struck that it’s the same for vampires!

I can’t help you with any advice as my mate fitted mine for me. I still gave him his normal labour rate, but he got me all the stuff at trade and didn’t add anything on.

Cost me a few Lamb Vindallos though 😉

All I can agree with the above is watch for extras etc like coloured door slabs, brown window frames etc as they can really bump the prices up.

At trade, I got 6 windows and 2 composite doors for about £3,500. I went for extras like brown frames, sash horns and green back door slab with white inside. My mate who fitted them got the same for his house, but in plain white, for about £800 less.

I knew I would pay more for mine, but it’s what I wanted and the house is late 1800’s so would have looked out of
Place with normal white Windows.

I am replacing my windows and gone for pvc. Massive improvement in warmth in the house after the old wood. Sellers quote an energy efficiency rating but tbh i just went with the max glass and gap that would fit the frame.

Also, its a bit of a rolling project as i am doing it in phases but when you only replace half the windows the old ones look awful.

On a practical side, are windows to be re-fitted in exactly the same place, any re-plastering, re-rendering, this is more work but will help reduce draughts around frames. Window standards maybe high, but fit with a draught gap and they’ll feel bad and have poor sound insulation values.

I knew I would pay more for mine, but it’s what I wanted and the house is late 1800’s

You’ve got trickle vents on them I hope? Hermetically sealing a property of that age is a great way to get massive damp problems.

I’ve not but I leave them on vent most of the time

Whatever you do, don’t use Safestyle.

+100x

Have a look on just doors website to get an indicative idea about the price you will need to pay for the windows. Then factor in labour on top of that (£150/day/person?) and you should then have an estimate to guide you price wise.

+1

Ask a local builder who does extensions to give you a quote, they’ll know a good local cheap manufacturer of double galzed windows and and doors. £150 is a reasonable day rate. They can normally do it cheaper and with a better service than a national firm.

Windows don’t come with trickle vents any more Cougar, you have to lock them slightly open.

That’s known as a ‘night latch’, otherwise known as ‘unsafe’

All the advice so far has been about ropy sales tactics. When it comes to the windows check

Double glazed units – Size of cavity? Argon fill? Solar control? Low E coating?

Check for trickle vents – if the current windows have them, you need tham. If old property, you need them

What guarantee is offered? Should be 10 years for glass if they are decent but is that cme and replace, or sne d anew unit?

Fitting
Will the trim the inside of replaster (I suspect former!).
What guarantee is offered on the ‘building works’
Will they dispose of old windows – how? That’s you’re responsibility!

Check trade references, well worth a credit check on the business

If they sell you a bespoke item, at your house you have NO cooling off period!

choose a local firm.
You want them to pay for windows and the work, not big ad campaigns, salespeople and new shiny vans.

I’ll second the FENSA accreditation. I know this to my cost! Make sure they are registered (ring Fensa) and that you get the paperwork when the job is done – don’t pay until you have this.

Also, not all local firms are angels. I used one recommneded from here, they fitted a complete disaster of a bi-fold. They then went bust and opened up again a few months later using the same name. Didn’t want to know when I complained.

Thhis outfit had Fensa all over their vans – Fensa had never heard of them…

Lay down the rules early.

My old dad still does this and his are

1/ no quote at time of visit but send it in writing within a fixed time frame,

2/ ignore rule 1, you will not get the business and will be asked to leave

If they sell you a bespoke item, at your house you have NO cooling off period!

True under SoGA, I don’t think that still applies under CRA. (could be wrong on either / both counts though.)

Make a sketch of the windows you want and locations, eg top hung,side hung, half glazed opening, double opening,left or right hand opening, top opening, trickle vents, key locking, fire escape windows on upper floor, obscure glass type/pattern,upvc colour of frames, security, glass type, toughhened,anealed or laminated,insurance backed warranties, removal of all old materials, hoovering up of all mess,access for vans and staff to work, eg narrow streets, parking permits,number of staff on job,plastering/render repairs,use of upvc fillets and mouldings to cover gaps, window cills internal if included in price/upvc window cills or wooden ones, curtain/blinds removal, they are old, time scale for work how many days, bad weather alternative days to do work, etc,

Plenty of biscuits and tea made, for the rep ,