Yes, I do.
I think the fact that it has been consciously designed by humans to press the fun switch is the fundamental difference.

It changes the way you approach the whole thing, completely different vibe.

I love natural stuff, but we’ve got a little mini-trail near us, try and fit it into every ride.
It’s just a few minutes of concentrated, really well designed fun, but it’s bloody ace, especially at the end of a muddy moorland slog.

Whinlatter, Marin and Penmachno are favourites.
Only had one Scottish jaunt, but Glentrool is much more fun than we expected and Kirroughtree is an awful lot harder.
They’re tough up there.

It’s all fun, innit?

I love a trail centre, if in a group and blasting it. Epic fun. Also a good place to push your limits a bit more in a fairly safe environment.

Natural trails however are ace for the nice views and variety and challenge of the terrain. But you do have to be aware of other trail users and/or the remoteness, and temper your riding to suit.

(NB: One of the worst bits about Scottish riding is the volume of kitty litter, water bars and armored paths, even less natural than many a trail centre. )

I do think many folk are making a false assumption that non-trail centre = some featureless moorland. Much of what I ride locally falls into the stuff you mention above.

I guess if you don’t live near trail centres but still amongst hills these cheeky trails tend to get built and a local scene tends to happen. It’s certainly plenty active down here!

I would love to spend more time riding places where you’re on truly natural trails – I tend to go hunting for them on holiday, a recent highlight being a granite tor in Brittany with some steep rocky paths and a couple of years back what must have been an old goat track cutting through a wood which was once terraced farmland in the depths of Mallorca – continuous rock garden!

I do 95% of my riding around the Peak, as it’s where I live. But when I’ve been to trail centers I’ve had lots of fun. So yes, I like them.

(NB: One of the worst bits about Scottish riding is the volume of kitty litter, water bars and armored paths, even less natural than many a trail centre. )

In most instances, if it wasn’t for these things, there would be no path, just a big wide scar on the hill.

Mibbe go see big Cathro for a skills course? 😆

Natural trails all day long … That puddle might be 12ft deep etc.

You haven’t been to Penmachno yet, have you?

😉

it’s certainly not an extreme sport for most folk riding at trail centres

It doesn’t matter how bad people are at it. MTBing of a certain type is an ‘extreme sport’ i.e. it’s in the same area of human endeavour as snowboarding, downhill skiing, kite surfing, all that stuff. Doing it badly doesn’t change that. It’s all about what you are tryign to do. If you are trying to go as fast as possible on something challenging, then it’s an extreme sport; if you are out for a day in the hills it’s like walking – an outdoor pursuit.

It changes the way you approach the whole thing, completely different vibe.

That’s what I’m getting at.

I think a lot of the discussion on trail centre vs bridleways says more about the local terrain of the user rather than inherent characters of either.

Even near where I live in west Leeds, some of the bridleways are steep and fairly rocky, whilst others are tame and flat. Go to the Peak district and some of the most technical descents and climbs I’ve done were on bridleways.

Similarly, trail centres can cover a lot of different types of riding. The red route at Hamsterley is massively different Sherwood pines; it’s far steeper, more technical and feels more natural.

It doesn’t matter how bad people are at it. MTBing of a certain type is an ‘extreme sport’ i.e. it’s in the same area of human endeavour as snowboarding, downhill skiing, kite surfing, all that stuff. Doing it badly doesn’t change that. It’s all about what you are tryign to do. If you are trying to go as fast as possible on something challenging, then it’s an extreme sport;[/quote]First of all, it’s not a sport for the majority. There is no competitive element whatsoever.

if you are out for a day in the hills it’s like walking – an outdoor pursuit.

And yet, as many have already said, you could be “trying to go as fast as possible” coming down a natural/non-trail centre descent. By your definition, this makes it an extreme sport. Or, for another example, what about events like the TDR and the HT550?

It’s nothing to do with the location.

in the same way that I like going to the gym or the climbing wall or peak season skiing in a modern resort – good enough, fun and enjoyable but I know what I’d rather do

antigee – Member 
in the same way that I like going to the gym or the climbing wall or peak season skiing in a modern resort – good enough, fun and enjoyable but I know what I’d rather do

You lost me there. Are you comparing climbing to skiing ? A ski resort to a trail centre ? (aren’t they conceptually the same thing ?).

I’d rather be stuck in the gym than at peak season in a ski resort !

It’s nothing to do with the location.

No, but I think the choice of location can reflect the ethos you already have.

Yes.

So what ethos does someone who likes both natural rails AND trail centres have ?
What has ethos got to do with anything ?

This thread is bizarre, even by the standards of the few STW binary thinkers.

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DjOL2we8ko[/video]

Natural trails all day long … That puddle might be 12ft deep etc.

You haven’t been to Penmachno yet, have you? 😉 [/quote]

The puddles there aren’t more than 3-4 inches deep, they just go on for a few miles 😆

The puddles there aren’t more than 3-4 inches deep

*Most* of them.

Penmachno riders would have loved Auchindrain pre-windfarm, by the sounds of it.

Whitestone, I think I know what you mean. I love/d riding trail centres but haven’t been to one in a while now. The flow and fun factor is high but there’s something about being on a waymarked loop that is a turn-off, it’s against a big part of what I ride for so maybe I don’t make the effort to get there as much as I used to. They can be busy also but that’s prob only that I tend to be there at weekends like most others.

Take that TC loop and add some other stuff, ie if I have the time and/or some trail knowledge to make it up as I go, and it’s all good. Makes me think I should plan a 3 dayer around S Wales sometime.. we rode a bit of Nant Y Arian during the WRT this year and it reminded me that my TC skills are rusty : )

http://www.bordertelegraph.com/news/15468669.More_details_are_revealed_for___11_3_million_Glentress_plans/

Great news that.

For those who have difficulty with my use of quotes in regard to ‘trail centres’, my trail centre is the Chilterns between Goring and Risborough. Means I don’t have to spend too long in the car if at all, suits my age and (declining) ability and allows me to avoid gnarpoon mounted fluorescent weekend warriors.
I am now hiding under the table in the kitchen. Bring it on.

Did ye Aye?.

Wheras my ‘natural’ riding is mainly the 7 stands where I think you’ll find all the trails are constructed from stone, which I think you’ll agree is an obviously natural material. It also means I can sneer at anyone who isn’t exactly like me.

I like a trail centre now and again for flat out razzing. I also love riding ‘natural’ trails too but one thing I do tend to find riding bridleways and natural routes is…

[url=https://imgflip.com/memegenerator]via Imgflip Meme Generator[/url]
😀

So what ethos does someone who likes both natural rails AND trail centres have ?

Both. It’s not a binary thing. I like both. That’s why I have a rigid adventuring bike, a 100mm race bike, a 180mm big bike and a road bike. And even a track bike.

Some days I am in the mood for fast descents, other days for an adventure trek, and some I like to be in the workout zone, so to speak.

TL;DR – but get the gist 😛

Trail centres have their place. Some I like having a spin around (Afan, Cwmcarn, CYB, Glentress, Inners are my favourites. QECP is coming along nicely now). Some less so (Swinley cobbles especially now it’s a trail centre, but then it still has much of the old stuff).

As for crowds, as mentioned, Penmachno. Never see a crowd there, or at times anyone at all for hours.

But then non trail centres are getting just as bad for crowds. Surrey Hills around Peaslake especially at weekends. It’s as bad as a trail centre in ways. Overcrowded car parks. Hordes of brightly dressed Enduro gnar folk, along with sponsored vans with teams of riders.

Though it does thin out on the trails and being short trails it’s less likely you’ll find someone stopped or going slow on the trail.

Also the wider Surrey Hills does mean you can go off and avoid the hordes, plus find more interesting and more natural-ish stuff rather than the ever increasing size gap jumps.

kayak23 – Member 
I like a trail centre now and again for flat out razzing. I also love riding ‘natural’ trails too but one thing I do tend to find riding bridleways and natural routes is…

[Gates pic]

What you need is a group ride and each person takes it in turn to hold the gate open for the group and keep the whole group moving 😀

As for crowds, as mentioned, Penmachno. Never see a crowd there, or at times anyone at all for hours.

That’s because it’s crap. The last quarter is worth a ride and i’ll loop that a few times next time i’m up that way, but the rest is not worth it. Never before or since have I been so disappointed after an MTB ride as I was when I rode Penmanchno.

The puddles there [Penmachno] aren’t more than 3-4 inches deep, they just go on for a few miles

They were nearly hub deep when I rode it, and that’s against 29″ wheels. I don’t mind a puddle or two but that was a bit too much.