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  • Ditch my Pike or Try the Debonair Upgrade?
  • shooterman
    Member

    So my 2018 Pike has a tendency to blow through its travel. 2- 3 tokens and a lot of air pressure mitigates it but it’s harsh over chattery stuff then.

    The fork is due a service and I’ve been looking at the MRP, Vorsprung and debonair upgrades but just wondering it I would be better ditching it and just going Fox?

    Has anyone tried the debonair upgrade in particular and how much of an improvement was it? Most tempted by this as it’s the cheapest of all three just in case I ultimately decide to change forks.

    Premier Icon LAT
    Subscriber

    Not on your list, a friend of mine was never happy with his pikes. He fitted the TFT coil conversion and is now very happy. Supple, supportive, etc.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    A service and Debonair air shaft and it’ll feel like a different fork.

    Big improvement to my Lyrik, best value suspension upgrade ever IMO.

    mashr
    Member

    Another vote for coil here. Small bump and mid-stroke will massively improve

    christof
    Member

    Debonair upgrade was a great improvement on my 16 pikes. Talk with TF, they were very helpful.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    I was champing at the bit for a coil fork until I got the Debonair shaft, it’s close enough to how I remember good coil forks that I’m not fussed now.

    shooterman
    Member

    I had looked at a coil fork. The new Bomber Z1 looks interesting but my weight can fluctuate by about a stone through the course of the year. A major issue for getting a coil set up right?

    Premier Icon jrdubya
    Subscriber

    I upgraded to the debonair shaft and the charger 2.1 damper – they are now much better, don’t really dive at all.

    razorrazoo
    Member

    I upgraded my 17 Pikes to debonair plus from 150 to 160 at the same time as this is an option when changing the air shaft. Made a big improvement, much more supple at the start of the stroke.

    Premier Icon clubby
    Subscriber

    I went for the Vorsprung on my 16 Pikes as the debonair was out of stock when mine needed serviced.
    Before I could either set up full travel or mid travel support. Now I’ve been able to remove a token and have both. Never had any issue with standard damper.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Subscriber

    Debonair is like £42 and if you do a general service of the fork (non including the charger unless it really needs it) at the same time I’d think you’d notice a worthwhile difference. It’s quite an easy home job and the only vaguely specialised tools you need are circlip pliers.

    Once you’ve converted to coil there’s no going back to air I don’t think as the spring can scratch the inside so it won’t hold air again.

    The debonair should mean you can run a higher overall pressure (with less tokens) but give you a supple initial stroke. That higher pressure will firm up the mid stroke without making it spike as much as hitting the rapid compression in air you get from tokens.

    There is also the luftkappe option too – which will give you an even bigger negative spring volume than the debonair shaft – although it’s a bit more diy fitting.

    shooterman
    Member

    Cheers. Might give the debonair a whirl then.

    I went the other way and swapped my Pikes (2015 from memory?) for some Fox 36. Night and day difference, I’d be surprised if Pikes can be made to feel as good.

    razorrazoo
    Member

    In response to the above, I’ve ridden 2 pairs of the same (Fox) forks and they’ve felt night and day difference depending on how well they’ve been set up. Even the mags seem to agree that the difference between the equivalent models of fox & RockShox is fag paper thin.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Subscriber

    I went the other way and swapped my Pikes (2015 from memory?) for some Fox 36. Night and day difference, I’d be surprised if Pikes can be made to feel as good.

    Fox36’s are the equivalent of a RSLyric rather than a Pike- and depending on spec (36 Rhythm vs Factory) there can be a huge difference in cost and adjustments.

    Also, a swap to a 36 from a Pike is likely to be very expensive. A swap to a Lyrik likely less expensive.

    Premier Icon russyh
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    I have a pair of debonair pikes on my hardtail.  They are better than the old, non debonair.  But in my opinion are still not ‘great’ they do run the basic charger damper though.   But to be honest I am in two minds as to bother upgrading anything on them.  I much prefer Fox forks.  Whilst the 36 factory on my big bike is not really a comparison to the pike on my hardtail, it’s difficult to not to compare.

    pickle
    Member

    I thought the 2018 pikes came with the Debonair shaft from new?

    Premier Icon tuboflard
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    Debonair upgrade and MRP ramp control on mine. That and a service and they are spot on.

    twrch
    Member

    I thought the 2018 Pike had OEM Debonair version 1?

    shooterman
    Member

    Yes I’m going to have to double check the model. My bike is a 2018 Intense Primer but I think it’s the 2017 model Pike on it. When I get it out of the car and cleaned I will run the serial no through the SRAM online spec checker.

    On my last bike I went from a Pike RC to a Fox 36 performance. The 36 didn’t blow through its travel as much but definitely felt harsher.

    The Luftkappe makes a huge difference. On a 160mm 27.5 it ramped up a bit too much for me but I like fairly linear forks on my full-sus bikes (don’t think I had any tokens in before) and was better at 150mm on my hardtail (which I prefer to feel like a shorter travel fork with 20-30mm of emergency travel).

    I’ve got a 2019 Lyrik with the Debonair spring and I really like that but it might not make a big enough difference for you.

    shooterman
    Member

    Ok got the serial no and turns out it has the debonair spring already installed. Serial No starts with 19 and I think that means it’s a 2019 fork? SRAM site tells me it’s a B1 RCT3.

    Not sure if that’s good or bad news!

    The first two digits of the serial number tell you what week it was made, the two numbers after the T tell you what year. If yours is a B1 model it will already have a Debonair air assembly. How much do you weigh and what travel is the fork?

    I had a new 2018 Lyrik which had the first debonair spring in.

    I had a couple rides on it and wasn’t impressed. Fitted the 2019 which was definitely more supple and had better support.

    Transformed it into a great fork but whether it was the spring or that it came with little grease / lube I have no idea. Seemed to be plenty in when I took it apart.

    Premier Icon tall_martin
    Subscriber

    Went from 140mm to 160mm debonair shaft with a service for a trip to whistler and expected no difference.

    The debonair was better up and down, in chatter and in big hits.

    So much so that now it’s time to go back to 140mm I’m going to get a debonair for that as well.

    I can’t tell what the difference is, but it’s definitely there

    shooterman
    Member

    @tingle fully kitted up I’m 14 1/2 stones. It’s a 140mm travel fork on a 29er.

    Two digits after the T are 73 so not sure that tells me the year of manufacture.

    I wasn’t sure if it was an urban myth but I have read in a few places rockshox come out of the factory with very little grease / lube? Perhaps a service will improve the feel with a top up of lube / grease.

    Thats definitely a 2018 model then yes. I meant to say the first digit after the T not the two disgits. 19T7…. means made in week 19 of 2017.
    There only needs to be a small amount of grease on/around the air piston. People tend to put way too much in when home servicing. If you think about it as soon as the air piston has travelled up the stanchion once all the excess grease just sits at the top of the stanchion. The guy at Sram Tech Centre said they put about 3ml of lower leg lube into the air chamber too to help free up slight stiction of the piston. The difference between the original Debonair assembly and the newest one is that the base plate has a DU bush in it where the shaft goes through. This helps support the air shaft under fork flex and lets it move more freely. Might be worth fitting one as you’re bigger than average weight and the fork is a 29er so will have more fore and aft flex than say a 27 or 26 fork. Don’t be tempted to put more than the reccomended volume of oil in the lowers. It’ll achieve nothing and may restrict the travel. (10ml each side lower leg oil for a Pike)

    shooterman
    Member

    Cheers tingle. Might have a long chat with the shop I was leaving it in about my options.

    Lionheart
    Member

    Think I need to do this, I’ve fought my Pikes since day one, have only put up with it as I’m a bit over biked.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Subscriber

    I think only the 2019 airspring has the red alloy base bit – if you open up the airside and take the top cap off and shine a torch down I’d think you could see if you have that newer version.

    shooterman
    Member

    Thanks. I will ask the shop doing the service to check which air spring I have.

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