• This topic has 27 replies, 23 voices, and was last updated 1 year ago by servo.
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  • Discs, DI2 worth the upgrade? Darkside content
  • Premier Icon cultsdave
    Free Member

    Thinking of a new road bike and will probably go down the Canyon Endurance route. Originally I was looking at the mechanical ultegra with rim brakes. Then I got browsing…
    So there apears to be 4 options each getting cheaper.
    Ultegra DI2 with Discs
    Ultegra DI2 with rim brakes.
    Ultegra mechanical with Disc brakes.
    Ultegra mechanical with rim brakes

    If it were your money what you go for. My current road bike is all mechanical will DI2 with discs be that much better?
    Also anyone know the difference between the Endurance frames. Seems to be 2 options of Endurance CF and Endurance CF SL.
    Cheers

    Premier Icon steve_b77
    Free Member

    Di2 without a doubt, it’s bloody brilliant.

    Discs, definitely. There will be plenty who say that rim brakes are more than enough for all your riding, but IMHO discs are betterer, I’ve got both BTW and would pic Di2 & Discs any day of the week.

    Premier Icon jn49
    Free Member

    The frames are just different types of carbon from memory.

    Discs over electronic shifting everyday for me.

    I would go Discs and mechanical shifting, but if you can afford and justify Di2 go for it.

    Premier Icon scotroutes
    Full Member

    Discs over Di2 if it’s a choice. Di2 is lovely to use but beyond my cost:benefit curve.

    Premier Icon scaredypants
    Full Member

    I like discs and I like di2 – listed there in order of preference if I disn’t have the budget for both

    Premier Icon slowpuncheur
    Free Member

    As above, the SL is just a slightly lighter frame. It depends what you’ll use the bike for. If it involves multi-day rides, you’ll more likely encounter bad weather and be carrying gear so I’d go discs. I have a Canyon with Ultegra rim brakes and they are great (6800) and decent in the wet but with a bit of luggage and wet weather, I’d prefer discs. Di2 is awesome but a well set up mechanical Ultegra gears work great. So it depends on how handy you are with indexing and also whether you keep your chain in straight line or cross it like I do. The auto-trim function on Di2 works really well if you’re a bit cack handed like me. Not sure if I’ve helped..;)

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    What brakes are you used to, and do you ever struggle for braking power?

    Perhaps because I usually take it easy anyway in wet conditions, or because I always run good, well maintained rim brakes, but I’ve never struggled for power (see Steve_b77’s comments above). Sure I sometimes have to pull the levers a bit harder or a bit earlier, but that’s just riding to the conditions etc.

    That’s no reason NOT to take the extra power anyway, but in my experience disc brakes aren’t without their downsides, I find rotors can develop wobbles easier than my rim brake wheels ever develop buckles, I find discs are more fickle to keep running rub and drag free, I HATE squealing and all of my discs have squealed in the wet (and apparently it’s considered perfectly acceptable for pads to get contaminated by spray from the road), also a disc brake bike will cost more for given spec level, and probably weigh more also.

    Also look at the spec/weight of bike you’ll get if you go rim brake only, I’ll bet you get at least one groupset better for the money. I got a Rose Team GF with Ultegra, Ritchey finishing kit, Fulcrum 3 wheels and Conti GP4000 tyres for £1750. Weighs just under 8kg with bottle cage etc. I doubt you’d get that level of spec or weight with discs for that sort of money.

    Couldn’t comment on Di2, heavier and more expensive isn’t it? Also you have to piss around with software updates and batteries, seems like un-necessary complications to me but possibly better than trying to adjust cables depending on you level of mechanical comfort!

    Premier Icon cultsdave
    Free Member

    Currently I have rim brakes and have never struggled with power. I see both DI2 and discs as an extra luxury but just can’t decide if its worth the cost. I am drawn more to DI2 with rim brakes but I just can’t decide.
    I won’t ever be using the bike for carrying luggage got a gravel bike for that.

    Premier Icon wobbliscott
    Full Member

    Disk brakes are not just about power.

    I see no reason to have rim brakes over discs unless you’re a pure racer looking to shave grams. Personally i’d go disc mechanical and save for etap axs upgrade if you really want electronic shifting.

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    I see no reason to have rim brakes over discs

    It’s not just weight, it’s cost, discs cost more for a given spec, so for the same money you end up heavier and lower spec.

    Other reasons might sound petty but for some they are enough, I would rather a simple, quiet bike with slightly less braking power, than ultimate braking power but more rubs and squeaks.

    Personal experience of course, I accept some people have miraculous, silent, problem free disc brake set ups, wish I was one of them!

    Premier Icon bluebird
    Free Member

    I’ve just gone from Ultegra 6800 rim to Ultegra 8000 disc. I already had a disc road bike, but Ultegra 8000 disc is brilliant compared to Shimano’s first disc brakes for road (which weren’t bad). If I was going to go electronic I’d prefer wireless as that to me personally is the main advantage of electronic, but SRAM AXS is just crazy money.

    Regarding weight my new bike 250g heavier than my old one (Cervelo R3 v R3 disc), but I now have 45mm deep section wheels and 25mm tyres too which accounts for some of that increase.

    Premier Icon lunge
    Full Member

    Am I currently unhappy with the shifting on my commuter bike which is mechanical 105? No, it’s fine, works well.
    Am I currently unhappy with the braking on my “best” road bike with rim brakes and Di2? No, they work fine.
    When I buy my next road bike will it have both discs and Di2? Yes, without any question at all.

    You can be quite happy without both, but if you can afford to get them then do so.

    Premier Icon mogrim
    Full Member

    Ultegra DI2 with rim brakes.

    I’ve got this model Endurance, and DI2 is lovely to use. Effortless shifting from both the hoods or the drops, and no chain rub at the front. That said, there’s no real advantage over the mechanical 105 I have on the other bike.

    Can’t comment on Ultegra disc brakes, although my mate’s got Dura Ace discs on his bike and he’s very happy with them. I haven’t noticed any squealing or whatever, but then again we don’t go out in the wet on road bikes very often. If at all 🙂

    Premier Icon edhornby
    Full Member

    hydro discs are a priority, especially if you are used to how they feel on an MTB. Rim brakes are not rubbish but it’s a different method so go with consistency. Discs are better in the wet though, no argument on that one (I have road disc and road calliper).

    +1 wobbliscott, either mechanical ultegra (which is still damn good) or Etap AXS without any cables if you can afford it

    Premier Icon tomhoward
    Full Member

    My non series 105 discs are miles better than my dura ace 9000 calipers. Di2 (and etap/AXS) is also brilliant, and miles better than cable.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I’ve never used di2 but have ridden a number of road bikes with rim brakes and now have a 105 disc brakes road bike.

    Yes the brakes can squeal in the wet – but usually I find one big hard stop early in the ride gets heat into the disc / clears the pads and after it’s generally quiet. I’d still take squeaky brakes that work pretty much as well in the wet as the dry.

    I had tektro/ Shimano 105 / sram rival rim brakes and even well adjusted with decent pads I found them borderline scary at times in the wet. Yes you can brake early for the conditions mostly, but if a car pulls out you don’t have that luxury.

    For that reason I’d always take road discs having experienced them. I do find they have more power in the dry than rim brakes as well and are just so reliable.

    So discs above di2 but if you can afford both I reckon I’d do that approach but take the cheaper carbon frame option.

    Premier Icon steve_b77
    Free Member

    hydro discs are a priority, especially if you are used to how they feel on an MTB

    Not a good starting reference point as they are set up completely differently in terms of power and feel.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    On the disc brake front the Shimano post mount callipers I have are almost exactly the same as the xt mtb callipers and are interchangeable. Thinking about it my bike has post front and flat mount back and they feel pretty much identical. They feel broadly similar to the sram guides I have on both mountain bikes.

    Premier Icon TiRed
    Free Member

    Dura Ace with rim brakes. Sorry. I have Di2 and eTap on TT bikes and it’s lovely. But a bike with DA is special. And mechanical DA will be about the same as Ultegra Di2 disc.

    All the mechanical groupsets shift much of a muchness now. (And I have quite a few!) So buy on bling if you are going mechanical.

    SL has lighter carbon – it’s what the pro’s ride. You won’t notice the half a water bottle difference in weight.

    Premier Icon uponthedowns
    Free Member

    I converted my Kuota Kharma from 10 speed Ultegra to 11 speed Ultegra Di2. Even got a carbon specialist to remove the cable stops and add cable entry and exit ports on the downtube and chain stay for internal routing. One of the best bike upgrades I’ve ever done. Once you get used to the effortless front ring changes, self trimming front mech and no maintenance (apart from charging the battery every three months) there is no going back.

    If I was buying a new bike I’d also go discs especially if it enabled me ro run 28mm tyres however I’m happy with the rim brakes I have now- the secret is Swiss Stop Flash pro brake blocks.

    Premier Icon peteimpreza
    Full Member

    Yes to both but I regret not getting a disc frame with QR dropouts. Should have waited for the 12mm bolt through verosion

    Premier Icon njee20
    Full Member

    I have a ‘nice’ bike with Di2 and rim brakes and a less nice one with Di2 and discs. My next nice bike will have discs as well, and like virtually everyone else I’d prioritise the discs over the Di2, but would sooner have both if it’s an option.

    The rim brakes are fine, they’re actually noisier than the discs if anything, particularly with the new pads I’ve just put in, but they just don’t work quite as well. I took the less nice bike to the Alps because I wanted the extra stopping power (and was so glad I did, it was incredible how much harder and later I could brake compared to my friends on rim brakes, and how much less hand fatigue I had as a result).

    Di2 is nice, I like the hidden buttons for the Garmin in the top of the STIs, and I like having the climbing shifter, but it doesn’t fundamentally change the ride. Nor do discs 95% of the time admittedly, but on that 5% when it’s wet or there are some steeper descents they make a huge difference.

    Premier Icon martymac
    Full Member

    I would do both if money no object.
    If I could afford only one, then discs would get priority, due to being more consistent in varying conditions than rim brakes.
    I currently use mechanical 105 with cable discs, hayes calipers, work excellently, but i did used to be a bike mech in a Previous life.

    Premier Icon Adam_Buckland
    Free Member

    Discs over rim brakes are a priority for me that mechanical/DI2. however DI2 is really good so if not budget constrains then go for it.

    As the frames I don’t know

    Premier Icon imnotverygood
    Full Member

    It depends on what your priorities are & when/ where you intend to ride. With the bike I’m getting built I decided I wanted light weight above all, so I’ve gone mechanical/rim. But then I’m not intending to ride the bike in the wet (my other bike can do that). Electronic is good but it is weightier. In my experience road discs seem to squeal a lot more in the wet. Quite frankly with the advent of more road disc bikes my club rides are an embarrassing cacophony of noise when we stop (albeit we are probably stopping quicker than we otherwise would.). There isn’t necessarily a ‘right’ answer to your question, you do however need to think about what your requirements are when making the choice.

    Premier Icon fasthaggis
    Full Member

    I would not change from my mechanical Dura Ace changers,they are most excellent.
    Happy with rim brakes just now (for the summer bike), but if I went carbon rims it would be a move to discs.

    Premier Icon Buzzard
    Free Member

    As others have said. I took the plunge 2 years ago to discs and would never go back. My bike gets used for commuting into London in all weathers and the disc brakes have literally saved my “bacon” on more than a few occasions. Di2 took longer to win me over but the ease of operation in mid winter with massive gloves on has finally convinced me. Note that again like others have said wireless seems to be the most compelling if electronic is really what you want on a best bike.

    Premier Icon servo
    Free Member

    My wife has a new endurace 8.0 CF SL WMN and she loves it with normal ultegra. Very nice looking bike and I’m thinking of getting the Di2 one for myself!

    I think the CF ones without the SL are last years ones and the SLX are the super ones for this year.

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