• This topic has 33 replies, 21 voices, and was last updated 2 days ago by weeksy.
Viewing 34 posts - 1 through 34 (of 34 total)
  • DH armour jackets. Which and why?
  • Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    My lad has been riding a hard armour 661 compression jacket for 3 years but it’s now getting tight and short.

    We bought him a 661 new style
    SixSixOne – Evo Compression Jacket Long Sleeve

    That’s D3O type armour but Mrs weeksy isn’t as convinced.

    So first, would you go hard armour or D3O type?
    Next, if not the 661, then which instead.

    Budget irrelevant

    Premier Icon ayjaydoubleyou
    Free Member

    That’s D3O type armour but Mrs weeksy isn’t as convinced.

    whats she not like? show her some videos of the D30 hardening on impact (just dont demonstrate it on your own stuff as you possibly degrade it)

    Does the hard plastic stuff have soft padding within it? Otherwise its not really absorbing anything – although it will of course stop pointy things, and allow you to slide.

    Premier Icon anderzz
    Free Member

    I wear a leatt AirFit. Chest plate is harder to touch and rest is a d30 type. It’s comfortable, feels safe and quite breathable. On offer again at crc too. Can recommend.

    Premier Icon lister
    Full Member

    I got a Bliss top with soft protection on chest, back, shoulders and elbows. It’s a great lightweight option, the hope is it would lessen how much skin I lose rather than prevent bones breaking.
    It was on crazy deal last year from £240 down to £70 so I couldn’t say no. It’ll probably outlast me.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    whats she not like?

    I think it is a case of “oooh that doesn’t seem as substantial” it’s not something she’s done any reading up on it yet, hence the scepticism.

    Fwiw, I have the same jacket as his new one, but short sleeved. So clearly I’m an advocate of the softer stuff.

    Premier Icon ffati
    Free Member

    I have a fox raceframe impact, has a hard chest and d30 back. Protection for all the vital bits.

    Im not a huge fan of big jacket things, feel lime i would crash more due to being restricted, and i hate elbow pads.

    Premier Icon a11y
    Full Member

    I’ve no experience of the soft/D3O type armoured jackets, but we all know it works well in kneepads, etc. I have, however, done extensive testing of an older, hard shell armoured long-sleeve jacket! One advantage I could possibly see for hard shell is it’ll likely slide on the ground better than the softer D3O style, but how much benefit that is I don’t know.

    For full on DH full jackets of either type are IME better than separate bits – the elbow/forearm guards in full jackets stay in place better when subjected to bumpy trails etc.

    But I’m going to assume the D3O style is a lot comfier than the hard shell jackets, so gets my vote (without trying one on).

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Free Member

    I’ve got a Fox Titan jacket and a RaceFace Flank D3O. The Titan is hard shell with full upper body protection so it’s hot and heavy and was bought for uplift days; it’s too much for general trail riding by a huge margin. The Flank is a figure hugging t-shirt with D3O shoulder and back protection and some unnamed foam pad over the sternum, it’s light and unrestrictive so much more suited to general riding. I wore the Flank at BMCC recently and felt adequately protected.

    I haven’t personally tested either armour, thankfully.

    Before the Flank I bought the Bliss jacket; weighed a ton, more than the Titan and was equally restrictive so it went back.

    From my own experiences, I would say a jacket with integrated elbow pads is the way to go. The beauty of the Titan was the adjustability which meant I could get all the pads into the right place and keep them there throughout a day’s riding.

    Premier Icon howsyourdad1
    Free Member

    POC oseaus VPD or spine VPD. Friend works for POC, i have tested both and they are superb. Hugely adjustable, well ventilated, excellent protection..

    But…..well you did say no budget limit 😬

    Same. Big off at FJ’s the other week, wood and rocks, back mesh was a bit scratched up but the only wounds were on my elbows. Highly recommend.

    I have a fox raceframe impact, has a hard chest and d30 back. Protection for all the vital bits.

    Premier Icon zerocool
    Free Member

    Pager her to wear the armoured jacket and then hit her in the chest with a cricket bat. Then pop her in the old one and repeat the process. That way she’ll be able to see that they’re as good as each other.

    (Caveat- this may or may not be a tongue in cheek reply.)

    The D30 will be fine, it’s been proven to work very well.

    Premier Icon razorrazoo
    Free Member

    Hard plate armour options are limited these days, I think as said above the main benefit is the ability to slide but a lot of it is under a jersey anyway.  I see more benefit to soft knee and elbows with skid plates.

    I don’t like wearing elbow pads but experience shows that a hard name fast fall onto the elbow is flippin painful so I do wear (d30 style) for uplift days. POC Air Tee for back, shoulder and chest gives decent comfort vs protection.

    Premier Icon squirrelking
    Free Member

    I’d imagine anything these days is better ventilated than a Dainese Gladiator jacket. Mine has seen some hard knocks and is still going strong almost 20 years later, I don’t know how long the D30 stuff lasts but if it’s going to be used regularly then I’d be all over that.

    Unless you hate him of course, then get the Dainese. And some 661 4×4’s.

    Premier Icon militantmandy
    Free Member

    I have a fox raceframe impact, has a hard chest and d30 back

    Me too. It’s great.

    Premier Icon sharkattack
    Free Member

    I used to have a Dainese jacket when they were the only good ones. It was great until it was cut off in hospital to remove my mangled left arm. They stop you from losing skin but if you hit something hard enough, you’re still going to break or dislocate stuff.

    I replaced it was a POC Spine VPD. This was around 10 years ago and it looks exactly like the one that’s still on the website. It is supremely comfortable. The best thing about D30 is that it warms up while you’re wearing it and moulds to your body. It feels like a bulky, rigid mess when you put it on and then it settles in and feels great. The fabric is soft and stretchy, the big velcro belt is smooth and snug. It’s definitely saved my elbows and spine a few times and still looks brand new.

    As I said in the other body armour thread, I’ve stopped wearing it on summer holidays in the Alps. When it’s 30+ degrees every day it’s unbearable. It’s much better on British uplift days where it’s cold, greasy and I have all my crashes.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    He seems happy with this one.
    SixSixOne – Evo Compression Jacket Long Sleeve

    img

    Premier Icon VanHalen
    Free Member

    i’ve a bliss d30 one with elbows – its lightweight protection. i’m unconvinced that if i land on a rock it`ll offer real protection – its bendy afterall. the poc, roost guard style, one my mate rides is much thicker and stiffer.

    Premier Icon howsyourdad1
    Free Member

    @weeksy i had that one, it’s not great. the back protector is too short, the chest protection is non existent and  the little ‘ribs’ get messed up when you wash it as it is no removable. it’s also very hot and virtually impossible to take off.  I wouldn’t recommend it.

    Premier Icon grahamt1980
    Full Member

    I bought the forcefield upper body shirt, yeah it is flexible but it is good, the cool thing is that the pads will mould with body heat too fit better. Both the upper body stuff and the shorts have been tested and i like them

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    i had that one, it’s not great. the back protector is too short, the chest protection is non existent and the little ‘ribs’ get messed up when you wash it as it is no removable. it’s also very hot and virtually impossible to take off. I wouldn’t recommend it.

    Interesting, i’ve got the short sleeved version of it. I like it… I fine ALL of them really hot. I’ve tried a fair few.

    We could try some others i guess. Will order a pile up from CRC.

    Premier Icon howsyourdad1
    Free Member

    or just get the ones we recommend  🙂 hence the post no?

    Premier Icon stevextc
    Free Member

    I had a 661 D30 job, bought Ollie a Leatt one and the difference is HUGE.
    661 is just a bit of material round standard D30 and some non D30 soft foam in places. The Leatt is another several levels higher like comparing a Halfords Apollo (not even Carerra) to a S-Works. The whole thing looks and feels engineered …

    This was apparent even as it was being unboxed (well unbagged)… and I ordered a Leatt for me same day.

    But I’m going to assume the D3O style is a lot comfier than the hard shell jackets, so gets my vote (without trying one on).

    Surprisingly not for the modern ones, my Fusion (mixed) is as comfy as the 661 AND equally as surprisingly as breathable and all neck brace compatible.

    Budget irrelevant

    Buy the hard/mixed then and one long and one short sleeved
    Ollie has the 3DF short sleeve one as £250 a year is enough us .. and you get way more size flexibility in the soft only… but I have the hard/soft mixed…

    The POC stuff is also very good… as I am sure are others but the 661 is pretty much a toy in comparison.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    All good info guys, thank you.

    I wasn’t trying to sound cocky on the budget thing, but if it’s £150 for a crap one or £250 for the best one, then we’d pay the extra, it’s a safety thing so it doesn’t really matter in that context.

    Premier Icon stevextc
    Free Member

    I wasn’t trying to sound cocky on the budget thing, but if it’s £150 for a crap one or £250 for the best one, then we’d pay the extra, it’s a safety thing so it doesn’t really matter in that context.

    The 661 one’s are frequently hugely discounted.. I have one and I know plenty of people bought them all because it was cheap.. I think I must have had it 2-3 yrs before I replaced Ollie’s Hard armour which was battered with the Leatt and I couldn’t believe the difference.

    Quite honestly one is and feels engineered .. the non newtonian D30 equivalent is different thicknesses and shaped vs some standard mass produced general pads just in a net jacket..(basically its like they just order the pads and made a net jacket that holds them). it’s honestly Halfords Apollo vs S-Works
    I’m old and grumpy and rather set in my ways so it’s a rare thing I open something up and feel literally blown away by the quality and have a realisation the stuff I thought was OK is really crap… HOWEVER I still didn’t really get the whole thing…
    The 661 I had to wear a long sleeved top underneath or stick tape on my elbows etc. where it rubs..(or take the elbows out and use separate pads) whereas the “engineered” armour I don’t but as surprisingly the mixed hard/non-newtonian doesn’ seem any hotter to wear than the soft 661.. (I wasn’t expecting that)

    How well it does it’s job ?? Depends what you land on and how you land??? It certainly feels like the hard stuff will be better against pointy sticks and sharp rocks… and even the soft only Leatt is much thicker on the back (just using this as an example as it’s what we now have)

    but if it’s £150 for a crap one or £250 for the best on

    But that’s the thing… the best one is the one you’re wearing in the crash…. and I now tend towards protecting spine and internal organs over shoulders and elbows… which are inconvenient to break but not life changing… I know 3 people who were told they escaped spleen removal.. a totally life changing event. 2 had a few broken bones at the same time but that wasn’t what the hospitals were worried about.. (now I think of it 2 were the same hospital)…

    So the financial point is in an ideal world you’d have some core armour to wear in hot weather and some lift/winter armour and they’d be neck brace compatible. The 1/2 hard/soft does seem to offer more protection but it’s also more size sensitive… hence why I compromised on Ollie’s armour..

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    I’m very lucky that the lad wears full armour pretty much every time he sets out on the bike, even if he’s doing nothing too tech, he’s full armour and full face helmet. So even something nicer would be a bonus.

    We’ve not gone down the neck brace side of things yet, i’m often a little surprised how few people in DH racing wear neck braces. Even at grass roots level, i don’t recall seeing a single person in one last weekend at Pearce.

    I do get that there’s nothing that will save everyone on every impact…. but it’s a chance we all take when riding of course.

    Premier Icon dcwhite1984
    Free Member

    I have a Leatt Airflex stealth which has the 3do type armour and find it really comfortable and breathable that when im riding i dont always know im wearing it.

    I tried quite a few different ones from loads of different brands and found the Leatt ones most comfortable across their whole range.

    I would say it depends on what they are riding, but whatever body armour i need for the occasion id go with the appropriate Leatt myself, they do stuff from the stealth which is fairly minimal right up to full on storm trooper and they have the option of adding neck braces if you want to go down that route.

    Premier Icon stingmered
    Full Member

    Have you tried riding steep DH in a neck brace? For obvious reasons the neck brace restricts your neck rotation, inc up and down. It’s ok on normal downhill stuff but really steep and fast it’s impossible to lift your head to look forward far enough. Like a lot of people, I found that I was making more errors because I couldn’t see far enough ahead on the terrain. The obvious answer is to slow down… but that’s not what racing (or even riding DH) is about.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    Have you tried riding steep DH in a neck brace?

    Neither of us have ever tried a neck-brace. But it may very well explain why no-one uses them 🙂

    Premier Icon jam-bo
    Full Member

    But it may very well explain why no-one uses them

    DH scene armor choices seem to be very much fashion driven and based on who’s wearing what in the top 20.

    remember when there was a phase of no gloves being really fashionable?

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    After trying on 5 different sets of armour, he’s settled on this one.

    [url=https://flic.kr/p/2nuwPmf]download[/url] by Steve Weeks, on Flickr

    https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/fox-racing-basefram-pro-d30-jacket-aw21/rp-prod207497

    Premier Icon tuboflard
    Full Member

    Neither of us have ever tried a neck-brace. But it may very well explain why no-one uses them 🙂

    They definitely work. I’ve got one and landed on my head after making a mess of a set of doubles on Super Morzine a few years ago. Remember thinking “oh shit” coming in to land but got up after coming to a stop with a bit of a revelatory sense of it working.

    I don’t use it any more as I don’t ride downhill any more (stealth ad?) but would wear it again without a second thought if I started again (mainly age related retirement).

    Premier Icon thegeneralist
    Full Member

    Minor thread deviation….

    If anyone has some second hand armour suitable for alps riding for a ridiculously skinny 5 foot 5.5 inch kid then let me know.

    ( Budget relevant ☺)

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    yeah, a 661 we don’t need any more 🙂

    Hard armour style… old compression suit.

    Yours for the price of £0.

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