Debt Collection Agency – Should i be worried?

We own a flat in a block with 3 others we all own a share of the freehold as a ltd company.

The first floor flat has a large wooden Georgian bay window it was rotten so we dicided to replace using the maintenance fund. We got 3 quotes and went with the cheapest (12k).

The company came and measured up took 10% up front and got the joiners to make the window. On the installation day they smashed out the old one and then realized the new one didn’t fit. It was about 6 inches too narrow.

They suggested they put timber in each side to fill the gaps. (its a full height 3 section bay) we said we’d rather it fitted properly as thats what we paid for. It was october last year and we had paid for scafolding so had no choice but to let them patch it as would take months to make a new one.

They then disappeared.

Its since leaked damaging the flat below.

We tried to contact them for a couple of months then went to the CAB. They gave us a template letter. So we wrote to them saying we would give them 3 moths to put it right else we would use the outstanding balance we are holding to commission another company to make a properly fitting window.

Heard nothing for 2 months. Today they have just countered this by saying we have 7 days to pay the remaining balance or they will refer us to a Debt collection Agency.

My wife is really worried by this. But as the work was billed to the company and the company has no real assets,  i’m not sure what they can do apart from go to court. They can’t come in and take my furniture?

I’d be happy with the court route as i have a independant surveyors report saying the window is not fitted properly  and two other quotes from sash window companies saying the window does not fit and to replace it, which are more than the original quote.

Am i mssing anything?

They can’t come in and take my furniture?

Nope, they would have to take you to court, and you’d have to lose the case and not pay any settlement in a timley manner for it to get to that stage.

And from what you have written, it sounds like thier case would be laughed out of court.

Let them refer it to a debt collector. Debt collectors won’t be interested when they realise there’s a genuine dispute about whether the money is due.

And then the freehold company should be suing them for the deposit it paid and the extra damage/costs they have caused it.

Also, as above…it sounds like its you who should be suing them for damage repair, and the cost getting the job re-done correctly.

Thank you, think my wife has been watching too many trashy programmes where they come in and leave with the TV 😂

Yeah that only happens if you get taken to court, lose, and fail to pay.

There’s a big difference between a court appointed balif and a debt collection agency!

Even if I was genuinely in the wrong and in debt I’d not be overly worried by debt collection companies!  I say this as someone owed a 4 figure some from a wedding supplier that failed to supply anything to our wedding!

No advice on Debt Collection but one thing I have learned over the years is that even if I measured up for the window, it’s imperative to run a tape over what you have before ripping out the existing. It’s happened a lot more than once!

They are trying it on. You don’t owe them money, they owe you. You have been more than reasonable.

As above, they would need a County Court Judgement for any debt to be enforceable.

Sounds like they are trying it on. Have you considered going after them for your £1.2k deposit back plus the additional cost to rectify? I would.

I’d take them to court –  I think the Small claims court can cover up to £10k now.   Get a judgement against them.   Then if they don’t pay up, you can pass that to your own debt collectors to go knock on their door.

(Edited. £10K. Not just a tenner !)

Sorry to go off topic a little. If a debt collection agency has bought the debt, can’t they apply to the court to have it enforced?

Yes, of course the op could contest it at court but can an agency actually apply to the court, I assume so?

There is no enforceable debt just because they say so. Has to be established via a court judgement. A debt collection agent has no standing to bring court action, has to be the person or company who was party to the contract.

^^ Thanks for the clarification mate. 👍

A debt collection agent has no standing to bring court action

It won’t stop a debt collection ‘agency’ sending you nasty letters though, insinuating various bad things.

@pat12 you’ve already given them a few months and incurred further damages…so keep records of all of those communications. If you are the representative of all the lease holders, I’d be filing a case myself, as I see it, they owe you for the cost of fixing the damage cause by the botch job, plus your deposit back, at the very minimum.

I’d get a few independent quotes in to re-do the window properly, and properly account for how much it’s cost the lease holders to repair/re-paint after the leak caused by the bad job, as back up evidence, and push for the cost of having it all done over again.

Yes, of course the op could contest it at court but can an agency actually apply to the court, I assume so?

Anyone can file a civil court claim against anyone else for whatever reason they like… it doesn’t mean they will win, or even get a hearing.

In cases like this though, if they are to be taken at face value, you would have ample evidence to have the case kicked out, of ‘struck out’ I think is the legal term,  before it even reaches the stage of a formal hearing where people have to attend and present in person.

So you would get a letter from county court setting out the claim against you… you then have ample time to refute the claim (or settle the demand) and respectfully request the case be struck out on the basis of ***all the evidence you have colated***.

it’s imperative to run a tape over what you have before ripping out the existing.

you’d have thought right? especially if you are going to smash the old one to pieces.

its not even a couple of mm out either you can fit your hand through the gap each side where its supposed to butt up to the wall.

One of the companies suggested they could repair the original window it by cutting out the rotten pieces and splicing new timber in but we all decided to bite the bullet and get a whole new window as a future proofing excersise, so its annoying as we kind of wanted it to be near perfect.

before he ghosted us he was trying to blame the joiner for making it to the wrong spec but the joiner was saying he made it exactly to the drawings, i tend to believe the joiner as they are quite a well known and respected company locally. I’ve not seen these drawing because as i explained to him its not really my problem.

If he comes back and sorts it all out then we are happy to give him the money. We’ve never insinuated even once that he wouldnt get paid. However this latest tactic give me reason to believe it might not pan out like that.

thanks for the advice

it’s imperative to run a tape over what you have before ripping out the existing.

Measure twice, cut once, as a wise man once said…

So, just to be clear, did you commission the window fitting company and the “joiner” separately? Or did commission the window fitting company who then commissioned a joiner of their choice?

(It’s sounds like these are two different outfits but maybe I’m mis-reading it)

The timescale suggests the joiner has run out of patience with not being paid by the window fitters, and they are trying to sort it by trying to scare you into paying.

Either way, you’re the ones who are currently out of pocket. They have your deposit, and you have no functioning window.

You could go straight down the Small Claims route or send them a letter before action first.

So, just to be clear, did you commission the window fitting company and the “joiner” separately? Or did commission the window fitting company who then commissioned a joiner of their choice?

just one contract with the window replacement company.

They then get the windows made. We had no dealings with the joinery firm until it went fubar.

the joiners don’t do installs or non-trade work apparently.

(however, we only got in contact with the joiner as the window guy had dissapeared and they have been very helpful – I think they are embarassed to  have their name associated with this they are sending someone to do a proper set of drawings/measurments FOC which they don’t normally get involved in. As they are the main firm in the area i imagine  they will end up making a replacment anyway and they have offered a discount should this happen. The windows themselves were good quality. This leads me to further believe the window fitter has cocked up the measurements.)

But as the work was billed to the company and the company has no real assets,  i’m not sure what they can do apart from go to court. They can’t come in and take my furniture?

Its almost certainly not going to get to that but beware “no real assets” doesn’t accord with there statements:

we all own a share of the freehold as a ltd company.

dicided to replace using the maintenance fund

the outstanding balance we are holding

IF the Ltd Co has a bank account with a Maintenance Fund – it has easily liquidatable assets, and any debt collector with a court order would much prefer to arrest money from a bank account than take physical assets and try and turn them into cash anyway.   If that money has now all been spend then I suppose a disgruntled debtor could attempt to force the liquidation of the Ltd Co so that the leasehold gets sold.  It would also be worth checking the terms of the Ltd Co.  Most often they are Ltd by Shares, but sometimes they may be Ltd by guarantee – often the guarantee is £1 each, but it could be higher, and there may be reasons why for a freeholder it makes sense to make it higher.

I’m sure it will not come to that as (a) its sounds like you’ve been quite reasonable; (b) the costs and time of getting the court to determine and then enforce the above would make it a waste of time.

we only got in contact with the joiner as the window guy had dissapeared and they have been very helpful

Presumably they know an alternative fitter who would be able to install on a day rate?

Getting the joiner onside is definitely the way forward. They will have the original drawings/measurements so the window company’s mistake would be clear as day.

The original window company had basically two jobs to do – accurately measure up – and then fit the temporary window so it would be watertight over the winter. They have spectacularly failed to do either.

Presumably they know an alternative fitter who would be able to install on a day rate?

They do and we have met him and would happily use him however understandably  he doesn’t want to get involved until we have agreed a resolution

Do you have legal expenses on your house insurance? May be worth a quick call if you do to see how you stand.