Viewing 34 posts - 1 through 34 (of 34 total)
  • Darkside: Custom carbon fibre, Alu or Ti builders
  • mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    Hi there,

    Following a cyclefit at err cyclefit last year, I’ve become obsessive about frame fit. I suffer form bad knees. My current frame gives me a high diff between saddle and bars (about 8 or 9cm I think) even with a high angled stem. It seems I need a 58cm frame to get the right saddle height, but a 56cm for the right reach too.

    So, I’m looking at custom builds as part of my mission to keep knee surgery as a very last resort once I know everything else is as good as it can be re cleat postioning, bike positioning, flexibility, muscle balance etc.

    I’m accepting prof advice regarding my fit form cyclefit and therefore I’m tempted by cyclefits glider range since I’m willing to submit to their fitting phillosophy, i.e. minimal diff between saddle and bars height rather than fashinoable aesthetics (to a degree). Other frame builders examples I’ve looked at seem to subscribe to the bum in air is ok school.

    Anyone know of any bods in the UK who can get carbon or Alu custom frames custom made? Titanium I know of Setavnto, Omega, Sunday and err whats his name in Suffolk. Are there any others? I don’t want Steel.

    jfeb
    Free Member

    Are there really no off-the-peg bikes that come in a size that is suitable? What seat tube and top tube lengths do you need?

    I’ve not heard of custom frames in carbon or alu, I’m afraid.

    iamconfusedagain
    Free Member

    How about Zero four in Dorset. I have no experience of them, I was just looking for a custom frame and saw their site. They look v nice, maybe there are some reviews of their stuff somewhere. They certainly seem to have a decent fit service when makin you a frame.

    http://www.zerofourbikes.co.uk/index.php

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    leggyblonde
    Free Member

    why don’t you want steel? 953 is stainless and can build lighter than Ti.

    speaker2animals
    Full Member

    I was going to say a Rourke 953?

    Why UK built? Crumpton in US do bespoke C and then for Ti there is Indy Fab, Seven, Merlin, Lynskey etc

    Ed2001
    Free Member

    As leggyblonde says I would have thought steel would be better option as comfort seems to be a higher priority than stiffness or weight also you have a larger range of UK bespoke steel builders who will be happy to build you whatever you want.

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    I guess 953 is an idea. My centre BB to saddle height is 790mm. My reach from tip of saddle to centre of bars is 560mm. The height diff between saddle and top of bars in centre (i.e. by stem is 40mm)

    With many 56cm frames, I end up with a lot of seatpost out resulting in a bum in the air set up. With a 58cm set up, I’d need to run a short stem and probably a fair few spacers, so yes I could get away with an off the peg, but I’d be compromising.

    Lightweight is important, I originally thought Ti, but I’d like something punchy and stiff for road racing. It’s not so much comfort that is important rather than a set up which does not tilt my pelvis in casuening tighterning of the hamstrings and ITB. Do club riding, col chasing, La Marmotte etc. Starting racing this year.

    I’m currently thinking of the Glider Boxer, as as much as I love the idea of the Glider GPM in carbon custom made at £2k it’s too expensive really. Glider Boxer is £1K for custom, main triangle is Dedaccai Force Competition tubing with a Dedaccai Black Tail and Mono Box rear end

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    Doesn’t have to be UK built. Doesn’t even have to be via a UK ‘handling’ company I guess.

    Ed2001
    Free Member

    I would seriously consider a Brian Rourke 953 £1500 handbuilt, Im sure they will build you a bike that would fit and you would be happy with.

    leggyblonde
    Free Member

    Cliff Shrubb just built a 953 winter frame for my mum, was around £900. Beautiful brazing as to be expected from a guy who has built “hidden” tdf bikes. I’ll try and post some pics.

    He can also put in carbon stays if you want:

    some cliffy bikes

    aracer
    Free Member

    You do realise that not all production frames have the same geometry – ie there are various different 56cm frames with different head/top tube lengths (seat tube length is completely irrelevant for bike fit)? From the sounds of things you want a long head tube relative to top tube, so a sportive type frame would be a good place to look (eg Speccy Roubaix).

    As leggyblonde says I would have thought steel would be better option as comfort seems to be a higher priority than stiffness or weight

    That’s only if you ignore the fact that it’s a total fallacy that a steel frame is more comfortable (don’t even think of trying the one about lots of people being able to feel it is – I’m sure I could find just as many who say carbon is more comfortable).

    philjunior
    Free Member

    I know Bob Jackson’s do a carbon back ended bike (steel front end I believe) – I’ve picked up the one on display in the shop, and it’s VERY light. Always had good service from them, parents got a nice custom (steel) tandem (cost a lot but I’ve had even better service since then!)

    Terry Dolan I believe do custom full carbon fibre frames, a friend of the family has one. I could be remembering the name wrong…

    Surely if it’s just a couple of cm you could get a different stem and/or move the bars up and down? (not trying to put you off, just trying to save you money – I know it’ll affect handling a bit but not by that much surely?)

    philjunior
    Free Member

    (oh, maybe moving bars up with your current frame would require a new fork and you’re thinking why not go the whole hog, as it’d look nasty with loads of spacers in…)

    leggyblonde
    Free Member

    I didn’t say steel was more comfy! My PA seems proof of that after a few hours….
    One of the advantages of fully custom (in any material) is that you can specify tubing diameters and thicknesses. Eg. slender thin seat stays and and OS downtube.

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    aracer, yes, I do realise one mans 56cm is another mans 58cm, and even some bikes are sized on the seat tube rather than the top tube and then we get into the c-c, c-t etc debacle, not to mention the spanner in the works that sloping top tubes give.

    So, if I said my ‘stats’ were: 790mm saddle height. 96mm tip of seat to c of BB, 45mm height diff between bar top at stem and top of saddle at mid point. 560mm tip of seat centre to handlebar.

    What off the peg frame is there that does this, without more than 50mm of spacers, as with a carbon steerer that seems to be the max that manufacturers advise. Having looked into it now and agin during the last 12 months, I’ve come to the conclusion that the ‘Sportive’ branding of many frames seems to be a misnomer, although a step in the right direction. They still won’t give me the required stats.

    Thanks for every ones help on this. I’ve learnt a lot since my fitting, and am now becoming quite obsessive…

    colnagokid
    Full Member

    Mugsy’s, would a high specialised and their personalised fitting service be any good?
    As for custom carbon- Basso I think, or what about independant fabrication who do a carbon tube Ti lug custom build.

    aP
    Free Member

    I think that you need to work out what those dimensions actually mean because once you’ve brought into consideration crank length, bar style/drop, saddle type and pedal type this will start to inform you as to what are the critical frame dimensions for you.
    I have heard some interesting things about the cyclefit custom frame sizing though.

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    aP, the fitting took into account all my present componentry i.e toupe saddle, 175mm cranks etc etc. Still chasing gold for this years Marmotte! After the fitting I was agahast at how much my sadlle went up: 45mm.

    I’ve got all the dimensons right on my current Planet X alu superlight, but the only one I can’t get is the saddle/bar height realtionship. I’m almost 3 times what they recommend with a high rise ugly stem (admittedly I’ve cut the steeer (pre fitting) too short. I’d still be out even if I went up to the next frame, and then I’d have a stubby stem because the reach would be too great.

    Care to expand on what you have heard? mail me if you want it off forum daniel DOT heywood AT scottwilson.com. I do wonder if they overegg the saddle/ bar height relationship a bit too much.

    The-Beard
    Full Member

    Enigma Bicycles – down near Eastbourne. They’ll do custom fit Ti and have a good range of options for the type of riding you want to do. I rode their Effusion last summer, it was a stunning bike. Would have bought it there and then if I could have afforded it…

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    Cheers The Beard,

    Engima was who I menat when I said Omega. I don’t know I’m just not convinced by ti or steel.

    I can only apologise for my spelling. I hang my head in shame!

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    try shorter drop bars? no need to raise the tops, and makes the drops 2-3cm higher than normal bars?

    Or just use forks with alu steerer’s?

    Or stretch your hamstrings out (the only good reason for having a high bar is your hamstrings are overly tight). My knees are bad, but theyr equaly bad on the touring commuter as they are on the race bike (a good 10″ down to the drops where i spend most of my time!)

    aP
    Free Member

    Gold on the Marmotte eh? I was 45 minutes over last year mostly due to faffing at feed stops and doing too much on the road up to Saint Michel de Maurienne.

    crikey
    Free Member

    Cyclefit is only one of the fitting types available, and might not be right for you. Obsessing about frame fit is ok, but not when it leads you to believe that the only way forwards is a custom build.

    It sounds like you’re a tall rider who doesn’t like bending over much, so go look at big bikes.

    I’m a short arse, and I ride a 56, because I’ve got short legs but I like a long stretched out position; if I took the fitting advice available I’d end up on a 52 or 54 with a stem about 8 feet long.

    I would also caution against setting a postion in stone, particularly when starting to race; after a couple of hours in the drops chasing some fat dutch guy, even riding on the tops feels like you’re on a chopper.

    My own personal predjudice for bike fitting is look at the size of the head tube; particularly with ahead systems, there is much less adjustability at the front end than elsewhere, so aim to get that right before bothering with the seat-tube height.

    You need a bigger bike and a shorter stem, and you need to accept that riding road racing bikes is a matter of you adapting to the most efficient position rather than starting off comfortable.

    iamtheresurrection
    Full Member

    Have a look at the geometry on the Cervelo RS…

    MrSmith
    Free Member

    rourke or parlee.

    molgrips
    Free Member

    Why does getting the reach right help your knees?

    Also, if your hamstrings are being pulled, have you tried physio to gain flexibility?

    Just wondering with a bit of lateral thinking.

    Merak
    Full Member

    Having read through your posts I think you may be getting too hung up on bike fit to be honest. Its easily done. I know that for sure.

    A custom built frame may not make your knee pain dissipate, it may be more to do with the way you pedal, the length of your left leg as opposed to your right and vice versa, crank length, the pitch of your foot at the downstroke, saddle angle. The list goes on.

    I would compare and contrast other fit systems with the one you paid for. Try wrenchscience.com, there are loads of them just to see what else you can come up with.

    Im sure you could find the right frame off the peg, having said that, go for whatever makes you happy.

    Incidentally Van Nicholas can build you a custom frame I think.

    I’m just saying you may pay alot more for a custom frame that doesn’t cure any pain/ fatigue issues.

    Good luck 🙂

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    I do like the cervelo RS, it has always been on my list. It does seem a tad long though… I’m not 100% convinced I need a custom build, it’s just that I have the chance to get a custom built frame in alu with a carbon rear end for £1000, and yes I agree that I need to allow for some adjustment.

    I can’t help but thinking that A-heads are a step backwards…with quills couldn’t you adjust the height whenever you wanted….then you start looking at old pictures even less than 10 years ago and see that bars were a lot higher than they are now.

    Thanks for everyones help.

    PS AP I was a bit more off than you…..but If I remember rightly there was only a couple of places between us….different age brackets I guess. So I need to be a lot faster… not sure now, you’ve sown seeds of doubt! MUST try and get in with a good group this year, esp along the valley.

    aP
    Free Member

    hehe! I went on the front along the valley, I must admit that I don’t believe in sitting on wheels even though it cost me dear on the l’Alpe.
    I’ll drop you an email later on.

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    More thanks for your ideas. Have had lots of physio work done to improve flexibility. They and many other physios I talked to, reccomended cyclefit above the others they had heard of (admittedly not a lot, i.e joe bloggs bike shop round the corner…)

    I am now a lot more flexible, and cyclefit said I was quite loose (ahem)it just seems to be theirs and Serotta’s philosophy to have a minimal saddle to bar height difference. I know it’s not going to be an instant cure, I believe sorting this is likely to be the result of several small changes. It is only really a problem after say 7 hours in the sadlle, but can creep up easier if I’ve been trainng hard etc. I have wedges, and a stack on my right leg all fitted by cylcefit. Stack is to cover a 5mm discrepancy in my right leg (the troublesome leg for last 2 years) but have had same pain with left leg.

    Ok, So I love the Cervelo RS. BUT there’s no more 2008’s around it seems in a 58cm, so I’m looking at £1600 for one. £600 more than I can presently secure funding for really…. any ideas in a tall headtube frame for £1000?

    aP
    Free Member

    How about Sabbath?

    iamtheresurrection
    Full Member

    There’s a taller headtubed carbon Giant frame… Or Cannondale synapse maybe?

    UK-FLATLANDER
    Full Member

    Cyfac do custom carbon frames

    mugsys_m8
    Full Member

    Those Cyfacs look drop dead gorgeous. Too much though.

    Laughed when I realised Sunday had to change their name, and decided on Sabbath!

Viewing 34 posts - 1 through 34 (of 34 total)

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