Cotic Rocket to be UK made…

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  • Cotic Rocket to be UK made…
  • Premier Icon kelvin
    Subscriber

    If you want to see the full press release and some pictures of our production kit, head over to the Bicycle Manufacturing webpage to have a look.

    …assume it’s not live yet?

    That’s copied from the mailing list email, which had a link to a private page for mailing list and press people only. Everything from there is in the Singletrack news item now anyway : http://singletrackworld.com/2014/01/straight-out-of-south-yorkshire-announcing-bicycle-manufacturing-limited/

    wobbliscott
    Member

    Its only a matter of time until 26″ becomes as much marketting hype as 650b or 29″. Just because it was the first wheel size that MTB’s happened to have doesn’t guarantee its future. Its pretty much there already for some types of bikes with 26″ being reduced to appealing to the nostalgia crowd. What wheel size or sizes will feature going forward will depend upon the next generation of riders, not what we, the current generation think and currently buy.

    But irrespective of the eternal wheel size debate that will continue to rage on, I really hope this venture is a huge success for Cotic and BML. Good to see stuff coming back into the UK and will hopefully mean that companies like Cotic can improve their responsiveness to customer and market demands and get an edge on the competition. Working in a manufacturing company myself, though foreign suppliers can work on a cost basis, when it comes to product development its much easier and more effective to have manufacturing and design capability on your doorstep. Despite advances in IT and communications you still can’t beat sitting next door to the people you’re working with.

    Scamper
    Member

    Although I’m another who gave up on Rocket Watch and just gone from Bfe to Meta, this is good news and hope its a success. Will def be staying 26 so in the future who knows. πŸ˜€

    bigrich
    Member

    if they got their own factory, they can surely pump out stupid-sized in between wheel frames for hard of thinking consumer sheep easily.

    stupid-sized in between wheel frames for hard of thinking consumer sheep easily.

    It’s a hobby built arround riding in a circle with an element of life threatening danger, usualy in the cold and wet, often with mud and rocks rather than on the roads you’ve already paid for to make going places easier, and it costs a fortune to do for no rational benifit.

    And you’re picking up on the wheel size?

    robdob
    Member

    if they got their own factory, they can surely pump out stupid-sized in between wheel frames for hard of thinking consumer sheep easily.

    Love it! +1

    If I need a new frame, and I can afford it, it’ll be a Rocket for sure. I can even pick it up from the factory as it’s just down the road.

    Very best of luck, stick with the 26″ please!

    Premier Icon AlexSimon
    Subscriber

    Sounds great – good luck!

    Mugboo
    Member

    If I buy a new frame it’ll be to go with my 26″ wheels. Why the hell would I want to stump up for new wheels as well? If your buying a new bike it’s irrelevant due to lack of real difference in diameter.

    Top work boys and good luck indeed.

    One of my friends is a highly experienced engineering type, he is convinced that if we can improve our apprenticeship schemes, then the work will come back our way. Another friend that runs a recruitment company tells me, he can fill every CNC job 5 times over.

    Premier Icon ratherbeintobago
    Subscriber

    Good luck, Cy & Mike. This is excellent news.

    how is 650b any different from 29 from a marketing hype perspective

    29ers grew organically and took years to get established. 650b seems to have happened overnight, and is being pushed especially hard by the brands that were late to producing 29ers…

    oldejeans
    Member

    I too got a bit impatient whilst waiting for a new rocket, and so I plumped for…….a rocket (2nd hand)! A small part of me is disappointed that it’s not ‘Made in UK’ but then I do have this great bike, right now. Given how much I’m enjoying it I’m incredibly happy to see this news and wish Cotic and BML the best of luck for the future.

    and may I just echo what mugboo just said about apprenticeship schemes. We’ve got a really good one here at work and it’s fantastic to see so many youngsters getting proficient. It just opens up so many possibilities for getting small batches of stuff turned around quickly

    Premier Icon retrobri
    Subscriber

    Good stuff Cy. I’m not in the market for a Rocket, but great that you’re setting up this frames production in the UK and still flying the 26″ flag πŸ™‚

    Premier Icon bruneep
    Subscriber

    I though, I’d probably be playing around with swappable dropouts to have a bike that could swing both ways, or vary geometry a bit. assuming it didn’t affect price too much.

    Ive thought this for s long time. Excuse my frame building ignorance but would it cost that much more to do and would it change the geometry that much?

    DT78
    Member

    Good luck guys, as long as the price is competitive it will definitely be on my short list. Much prefer to support uk if I can.

    grum
    Member

    Excuse my ignorance but what does this mean?

    I though, I’d probably be playing around with swappable dropouts to have a bike that could swing both ways

    Can I please vote for a bit less white on the paint job, especially on the swing arm? πŸ™‚

    Premier Icon Shackleton
    Subscriber

    @shakelton how is 650b any different from 29 from a marketing hype perspective, how is it more likely to stay ? To me it sounds just the same as we heard about 29. If you keep bikes 10 years then it’s clear you don’t care about hype/having the latest thing for the sake of it – so just buy what you want

    True, however I am concerned by the availability of spares or new parts. Although my frame is 10 years old it is on it’s 3 set of forks and 2nd wheelset (currently on their last gasp). If I buy a 26″ frame and new wheels then when I need a new fork and wheel set in 5 years time will the top end parts that I want be available? Given how every company now seems to be 650b or 29er I’m not convinced they will be.

    OEM must account for the greater proportion of fork and wheel sales and aftermarket 26″ sales will get smaller as it gets harder to buy 26″ bikes and frames, and is likely to get worse. Although I would much prefer to carry on with 26″ wheels and see the 650b thing as marketing it is also a physical reality. When a manufacturer has to make a decision about losing products vs. introducing new ones I’m willing to bet that the 26″ product would get axed to make way for the 650b (or 29er) new product. The market is also primarily led by what America wants/does and 650b is very big news there at the moment. So we can whinge and whine all we like but I think 650b is here to stay and will in all probability oust 26″ as the main size purely due to how it is being pushed by the industry. 26″ may linger but won’t be a priority for manufacturers making getting good tyres, wheels and forks harder to get in 5 years + time.

    I do wish Cotic all the best and am pleased to see them being made in the UK. I am just concerned for them that in 3-5 years time there won’t be the support to make 26″ viable any more. Not a problem for serial frame swappers who will buy a whole new bike in 18 months time but for me where a frame is a major investment the long term view makes me nervous about investing in 26″. I would like to be wrong but I don’t think there is room for 3 wheel sizes in the mtb world, especially with 2 of them being so similar.

    Premier Icon al2000
    Subscriber

    Excuse my ignorance but what does this mean?

    I though, I’d probably be playing around with swappable dropouts to have a bike that could swing both ways
    [/quote]

    Banshee Spitfire (for example) has separate dropouts, which are available in 26″ and 650b flavours. Viable option for future proofing frames, at the cost of a bit of extra weight.

    (Oh, and nice one Cotic – a bold move, and exciting stuff).

    Premier Icon andytherocketeer
    Subscriber

    Banshee was exactly along the lines of what I was thinking.
    Or Liteville, perhaps, who do different length stays on every frame size, where some sizes cater for more than one wheel size.

    Especially at this point where things are in limbo, and seemingly every new bike is jumping on the band wagon, but 99.99% of what is actually being ridden is 26 with the occasional 29.

    I’d bet 50p on a 650b 2015 model, but not sure whether that’d be the Rocket Lite, a sibling to the Soul/Solaris with a new name, …

    mr plow
    Member

    Well done Cotic. :mrgreen:

    chambord
    Member

    LOL @ Genuinely cool news thread turning into wheel size debate

    Premier Icon slowoldman
    Subscriber

    Nice to see. Now then, who’s going to produce a home-brewed groupset?

    Premier Icon jambalaya
    Subscriber

    @Shakelton understood. I for one don’t see Cotic as wedded to 26, they Introduced 29’s and I’m sure if the customer support / demand is there for 650b they’ll respond, I mean Cy’s not going to allow Cotic to fold due to being stuck ideologically with 26. In fact it sounds like he’ll be more able to experiment with BML than before.

    Anyway good luck again with it (and I assume my 26 ain’t dead shirt got mailed yesterday πŸ™‚ )

    iolo
    Member

    This is excellent news.
    I wish you the best of luck I am considering your Rocket as my next bike.
    I will love it even more knowing it’s uk made. Employing local talent is the way forward.
    It’s a shame other northern bike companies didn’t follow your lead.

    Premier Icon Shackleton
    Subscriber

    jambalaya – I don’t think customer demand comes into it in this country, I really don’t think there is much. I think it will come down to the supply of parts from manufactureres.

    brakes
    Member

    all you need now is a an adjoining brewery and you’ve got it made.
    factory/ brewery tours would be AMAZING!
    oh, and a test facility in the local woods.

    Sancho
    Member

    Shackleton I will have to disagree with you completely on that one
    We have had one 26″ enquiry in the last three or four months all our sales and enquiries are for 29 & 650b
    26″ sales dried up middle of last year.
    We are stocking and selling what customers are asking for

    brakes
    Member

    who do you work for Sancho?
    what brands do you have?

    Sancho
    Member

    Lbs in leeds
    We do kona, lapierre, transition, genesis, saracen,

    Still fixing lots of 26″ mtb’s but new sales have shifted

    dragon
    Member

    Yep 650 / 29ers are where it’s at, 26″ is yesterdays news.

    Premier Icon scotroutes
    Subscriber

    Cy is still making 26ers for those that want them and have a stock of bits they want to keep using – WIN!!

    Cy has a facility in which he can more rapidly prototype, develop and manufacture changes to accommodate new standards –
    WIN!!

    Premier Icon wwaswas
    Subscriber

    new sales have shifted

    That’ll probably be ‘cos pretty much all of those brands don;t do 26″ bikes at an enthusiasts price point any more πŸ˜‰

    Premier Icon jameso
    Subscriber

    Brilliant news, best press release I’ve read in ages, a turning point hopefully. Every time I go to a factory in Taiwan I’m a bit depressed that there’s so few opportunities like that in the UK. UK made really is becoming more viable and I’m sure they will show how well it can work. I think or hope there’s more to come in this area. Good times.

    fasthaggis
    Member

    Great news,if I decide to get a new FS frame,it will be a Rocket.

    Premier Icon amedias
    Subscriber

    We have had one 26″ enquiry in the last three or four months all our sales and enquiries are for 29 & 650b
    26″ sales dried up middle of last year.
    We are stocking and selling what customers are asking for

    out of interest, are people coming into your shop and saying:

    “I’d like to buy a 650b MTB please, what have you got?”

    or are they coming in saying:

    “I’d like to buy a MTB please, what have you got?”

    and then being sold a 650b bike because the bikes/manufacturers you stock at that price point are 650b?

    ie: trying to work out if people are genuinely coming in to your shop with 650b as a requirement?

    plus one
    Member

    Good to see a forward thinking Brit company producing a quality 26’r rather than jumping on the 650b/29’r going nowhere fashion wagon πŸ™‚ πŸ™‚

    fasthaggis
    Member

    I worry more about press fit BBs than wheel size πŸ˜‰

    grum
    Member

    ie: trying to work out if people are genuinely coming in to your shop with 650b as a requirement?

    I suspect even if most people do want 650b it’s only because they don’t want to end up with a bike that’s hard to get parts for. I don’t know anyone who’s convinced by the advantages of 650b.

    Euro
    Member

    That really is a…

    I think you’re on to a winner there Mr Cotic. Well played and good luck!

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    For those asking, putting 27.5 wheels into a Rocket isn’t the work of a minute, and does (in my opinion) require an entirely revised frame layout. Switchable ‘both wheel size’ frames are just a dogs dinner of compromises in my opinion. The Rocket is quite tightly packaged and bigger wheels just run into everything all over the place. For the first production run it’s prudent to stick with something known, and we still have plenty of demand for the Rocket as it is. There are changes to the construction because we can do things differently here, and that was enough to work through.

    I’d say we’re wheel size agnostic. The aim is to support all three as and when, and give people choice. Our current experience is that 26″ frame sales are still strong and still the majority of our business. 26″ complete bikes aren’t selling that quickly, as people buying all new bits will inevitably try and futureproof themselves, but a lot of people still have lots of nice 26″ kit to put on nice Cotic frames.

    In 3-5 years time, my crystal ball gazing says you’ll still be able to get 26″ wheels and tyres. There’s just too many 26″ bikes out there for that not to be the case. 27.5 forks aren’t massively different to 26″ so putting some of those on your 26″ bike isn’t going to ruin it, so that’s forks dealt with.

    Premier Icon andytherocketeer
    Subscriber

    I worry more about press fit BBs than wheel size

    hear hear
    and another reason the Rocket was on my shortlist (hoping the new UK fabbed frames will also be proper user serviceable BSA)

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    Yes to threaded BB’s!

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