Viewing 40 posts - 81 through 120 (of 141 total)
  • Combi DRILL and impact driver … what’s recommended?
  • singletrackmind
    Full Member

    Jolmes
    Dewalt on special, 899cf is the SKU iirc
    Then treat ypurself to either the Dewalt or Makita drill bit and impact driver carry case.
    Loads of gear in there, some you might never use but some of it essential.
    Register oline for the extended warranty for 3vyears peace of mind. Comes in a very robust carry case, charger and 2 x 2.0ah batteries which will be fine for half day diy.
    If you want to get onto adbanced diy and do decking, fencing or flooring then add a couple of batteries at a later date
    This set combined with an entry level Titan sds will do most households tasks with ease

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    Been thinking about replacing my aging (probably 12 years old :-O ) drill driver with a twin pack following this thread and doing a bit of work on a site with some more professional trades. Would say I’m a pretty heavy DIY user.

    Have seen the comments above about 12V but I’m still skeptical – I’d rather have power to spare than be forcing a tool. That said, I have a Makita SDS drill which gets used for the heavy duty stuff, and a bench drill which gets used in preference at home. Although next project will involve driving 3″ x 1/4″ screws into decking, so maybe I was right the first time.

    Always thought unless you’re using it for a living, as long as you have two batteries, you’re pretty well covered since you’ll always have a fresh one available.

    Don’t use any other cordless tools and unlikely too, so battery compatibility not really an issue.

    Current driver is an 18V Erbauer which, as above, has been remarkably long-lived.

    Erbauer twinpack with 2x2Ah looks decent at £150:
    https://www.screwfix.com/p/erbauer-eid18-li-ecd18-li-2-18v-2-0ah-li-ion-ext-brushless-cordless-twin-pack/542fv

    But for an extra £50 you can get a slightly more powerful DeWalt set, again 2x2Ah, with the confidence of a top brand:

    https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dck2060d2t-sfgb-18v-2-0ah-li-ion-xr-brushless-cordless-combi-drill-and-impact-driver-twin-pack/210hf

    Or the same with 2x4Ah for the same price (better value, but as above, not sure I wouldn’t prefer the 2Ahs):

    https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dck2060m2t-sfgb-18v-4-0ah-li-ion-xr-brushless-cordless-twin-pack/362jt

    (@jolmes have you seen that? Think it’s been added since I looked a couple of days ago and it fits your brief pretty well)

    WWSTWD?

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    Given what I said about batteries above, this also seems a decent buy, assuming it’s not some watered-down version for B&Q: same as the DeWalts in my previous post (AFAICT) but with 2×1.5Ah, £40 cheaper

    https://www.diy.com/departments/dewalt-xr-1-5ah-li-ion-cordless-combi-drill-impact-driver-dcz298s2t-bqgb/5054905282929_BQ.prd

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    singletrackmind
    Full Member

    All depends on use rates imo
    A few weekends a year for a few hours, go Erbaurer. Every weekend plus, go Dewalt or Makita. But budget for decent bits as all are supplied with none.
    Box of pz2 or as mentioned a carry case job from Makita
    For you decking, an impact driver will cruise tapping 75mm screws into wood.
    Just get a box of Spax and be done with it

    Better to have multiple smaller batteries thsn you can use 1 and charge 1 simultaneously and then swap over

    nickjb
    Free Member

    assuming it’s not some watered-down version for B&Q:

    It’s not brushless. Will be less powerful, less efficient and probably heavier, negating the benefit of the smaller battery.

    Probably fine for general DIY but I’d go for the better options from Screwfix

    duncancallum
    Full Member

    I’ve just bought a ryobi 18v kit as I have some older ryobi stuff and its mint.

    I know theres not a lot of love for ryobi but I like it performance vs pounds cant fault it.

    Ryobi and Milwaukee are the same business group.

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    It’s not brushless.

    Good spot. On closer inspection, some of the DeWalt part numbers are suffixed BQGB (B&Q Great Britain, presumably) and they all appear to be brushed, whereas Screwfix mostly have parts suffixed SFGB which seem to all be brushless. Some BQGB available at Screwfix (same parent company) but clearly differentiating the two target markets. Much like Bosch blue vs/ green, but more subtly (sneakily, if you’re cynical).

    Cheers @singletrackmind. Definitely the latter use case. Got plenty of bit sets and a lifetime’s supply of PZ2s.

    zilog6128
    Full Member

    Some BQGB available at Screwfix (same parent company) but clearly differentiating the two target markets. Much like Bosch blue vs/ green, but more subtly (sneakily, if you’re cynical).

    one of the reasons I like Makita is that they don’t have (AFAIK) a consumer brand alongside the “pro” one… Bosch blue/green like you say, De Walt have Black & Decker, etc. You can’t tell me that some parts from the budget range never make it into the pro ones for reasons of economics!

    nickjb
    Free Member

    one of the reasons I like Makita is that they don’t have (AFAIK) a consumer brand alongside the “pro” one

    They do but it’s pretty unpopular so you rarely see it

    eg https://www.diy.com/departments/makita-18v-1-5ah-li-ion-cordless-combi-drill-impact-driver-dk18015x2/642650_BQ.prd

    jamesoz
    Full Member

    Seen a few recommendations for urbauer on here. Wouldn’t touch them, boss picked one up and it worked fine but the battery lifespan was terrible. Binned it and went Hitachi, lasted really well and retired it to shed use. Got a Makita twin pack drill and impact driver. 4ah I think, absolutely ace.

    A mate took a urbauer drill back to Screwfix with a blown gearbox. Assistant said, ‘what do you expect, it’s urbauer’.
    I think they part exchanged it for something a bit more robust.

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    one of the reasons I like Makita is that they don’t have (AFAIK) a consumer brand alongside the “pro” one… Bosch blue/green like you say, De Walt have Black & Decker, etc. You can’t tell me that some parts from the budget range never make it into the pro ones for reasons of economics!

    Funnily enough, after my last post I went off to look at Makita sets as I thought the same. You pay for it though. Part of that is because the smallest batteries they seem to do are 3Ah (that B&Q one excepted), but I guess that makes sense if they’re aimed fair and square at the trade.

    Those bad Erbauer experiences seem to be the exception rather than the rule. As I said, my current driver has had about 12 years of reasonably heavy DIY use. I had the pair of (NiMH) batteries refurbed about 7 years ago, and they’re again getting to the end of their life, but that’s to be expected. The gearbox is starting to get quite a bit of backlash in it, hence wanting to retire it before it dies on me, but I think that’s not unreasonable.

    dyna-ti
    Full Member

    Ahh, 3 pages of conflicting advice, covering just about every brand available. 😆

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    Don’t forget generalisations based on a single anecdotal experience! 😉
    What else did you expect?!

    BigJohn
    Full Member

    Makita’a red MT range is for “discerning” DIYers. If your discernment starts and ends with the price tag.

    jamesoz
    Full Member

    Those bad Erbauer experiences seem to be the exception rather than the rule

    Possibly, my drill use is trade, I don’t have to get my drill out often but when I do it’s fairly relentless and often involves drilling stainless.
    Couldn’t say what sort of abuse my mate gave his but certainly trade use.

    bridges
    Free Member

    Quick slight hijack; I have some decking that could do with being taken up, and cleaned out underneath. I tried undoing one of the screws earlier, after carefully picking out the dirt that had accumulated in the head, and my 18V drill couldn’t shift it, and rounded off the head. I’m just wondering if an impact driver would be a better tool for that job, or would it just do the same? Yes, I know better quality screws should have been used, but I didn’t install the decking. I’d really rather not have to drill every single one out…

    goldfish24
    Full Member

    Yes an impact driver will have much much better chance of success.

    Along with ensuring you’re using exactly the right size bit and good quality to boot.

    Maybe get a pressure washer over the whole deck first?

    trail_rat
    Free Member

    Ryobi and Milwaukee are the same business group.

    And if Ryobi was anything like the same quality it would be red and say Milwaukee.

    It’s Ryobi batteries love of *keeping the house cosy* that puts me off.

    BigJohn
    Full Member

    Yes an Erbauer impact driver with a set of Bosch bits would get those decking screws out. An impact driver pushes as it turns so doesn’t round the heads (except I did earlier today fitting footstraps to a windsurfer as I mistakenly put a Posi bit into a Philips).
    I love all my Erbauer tools (except their sanders) as much as I love my Festools.

    duncancallum
    Full Member

    And if Ryobi was anything like the same quality it would be red and say Milwaukee.

    It’s Ryobi batteries love of *keeping the house cosy* that puts me off.

    Posted 2 hours ago

    Surely that can be said of any Li packs they’ll be made from one of the big battery players?

    I dont know req quality. Mine are used DIY wise and my auto drive 18v is 10yrs old and still in good nick. Used it to renovate my old gaff and countless other jobs.

    Pays your money etc

    goldfish24
    Full Member

    An impact driver pushes as it turns so doesn’t round the heads

    Not quite, the impact is a rotational impulse force. It doesn’t “push” down on the screw. Because the torque (the rotation force) is delivered an impact, the bit doesn’t get a chance to “torque out” of the screw before the next impact arrives.

    bridges
    Free Member

    Yes an impact driver will have much much better chance of success.

    Oh that’s marvellous. I only wish I’d bought one in a set, when I bought my drill last year or whenever it was. I’ll get a DeWalt, because that’s what my drill is, and I can swap batteries, but which one?? There seem to be loads just in the DeWalt range! And what’s the difference between an impact ‘driver’ and a ‘wrench’?

    Do I need a Festool?

    nickjb
    Free Member

    Impact wrench will have a 1/2″ square tip for sockets for car stuff. You want a driver with a 1/4″ hex socket

    As for models, brushless is better if you can find one at the right price. Other than that it’ll be about power and modes.

    pedlad
    Full Member

    Looking to invest in a twin set ahead of some bigger diy projects so read the opinions on brand choices above….one thing I’m potentially keen on is over time widening my use of the batteries to a mower (preferably with roller) and strimmer.

    A Quick search shows ryobi, makita and dewalt do them but they seem to be just wheeled mowers. Anyone know if any of the brands do a roller mower for their battery system?

    bridges
    Free Member

    Impact wrench will have a 1/2″ square tip for sockets for car stuff. You want a driver with a 1/4″ hex socket

    As for models, brushless is better if you can find one at the right price. Other than that it’ll be about power and modes.

    Nice. So; from DeWalt’s very extensive range, which one?? I want something that will last, obviously, so not the very cheapest, but it’s not for daily use either, so not a full on ‘pro’ model. 18V, so I can swap the batteries if need be. Don’t need multiple batteries either.

    nickjb
    Free Member

    So; from DeWalt’s very extensive range, which one??

    This looks pretty good value:
    https://www.ffx.co.uk/product/Get/Dewalt-Dcf809N-0885911593182-18V-Brushless-Impact-Driver-Bare-Unit

    But i’d probably pay a tenner more and get the three speed model
    https://www.ffx.co.uk/product/Get/Dewalt-Dcf887N-5035048616130-18V-Xr-Brushless-3-Speed-Impact-Driver-Bare-Unit

    bridges
    Free Member

    But i’d probably pay a tenner more and get the three speed model

    Many thanks. I think that’s the one I’m going for. Now, the only dilemma is whether to get the kit with battery and charger, and have yet another big plastic box to have to find somewhere for/get rid of, or a bare unit and single battery. I prefer the smaller, lower capacity batteries, because not only do they make the tool a good bit lighter and easier to use, they are quicker to charge and I don’t really need many hours of use out of them. The 1.5AH one I have with my drill, I never use anywhere near it’s capacity. A spare charger might be useful though…

    pedlad
    Full Member

    I’m in the same boat re needed small bursts of activity generally and a loghter tool seems sensible but is the AH figure just about storage capacity of the battery or does a bigger number deliver a bigger punch to the motor as suggested in a youtube video I saw?

    nickjb
    Free Member

    Generally its for longer run time but I have heard it said that higher capacity batteries have a lower internal resistance so give more power. Can’t say I’ve noticed a difference between my 5 and 3 Ah batteries though so for me if they do it’s pretty marginal.

    bridges
    Free Member

    I have heard it said that higher capacity batteries have a lower internal resistance so give more power.

    But surely, 18v is 18v, right?

    Seems you can get a 2Ah battery, which is the same size and weight as the 1.5 (which I think is just a OEM version they ship with budget packages). But I could get a kit with case, charger and 2 batteries, and flog off the case, charger and spare. If I can be bothered.

    nickjb
    Free Member

    But surely, 18v is 18v, right?

    Yes, but power =v²/r so a lower internal resistance for the same voltage will give more power. As I said it’s not been noticeable for me so I wouldn’t worry about it. That impact driver will be plenty powerful

    As for kits vs bare, I like to buy bare tools as it tends to work out cheaper (other than the odd bargain deal for a drill kit to get you hooked into their system). The cases are always rubbish.

    zilog6128
    Full Member

    As for kits vs bare, I like to buy bare tools as it tends to work out cheaper (other than the odd bargain deal for a drill kit to get you hooked into their system). The cases are always rubbish.

    yeah, I’ve got a few batteries now so always look out for deals on bare tools… bought a Makita cordless SDS at virtually the same price as corded a while back! I think their cases are decent, definitely help with storage & transportation when you’ve got a few! Bought a cordless multi-tool recently without one and regret it now 🤣

    Northwind
    Full Member

    bridges
    Free Member

    But surely, 18v is 18v, right?

    Sure but you need voltage and current to make things happen and some batteries can deliver a lot more amps than others. Same as how pretty much all car and motorbike batteries are 12V but some can spin over a big cold diesel and some can’t.

    Different batteries will droop differently too as they discharge- so you’ll see less than 18V under load. But that’s managed more and more by the electronics.

    footflaps
    Full Member

    I have heard it said that higher capacity batteries have a lower internal resistance so give more power.

    Correct, they have multiple cells in parallel so have lower internal resistance and can deliver more current.

    18Vs is normally 5 cells in series, say at 2 – 2.5 Ah per cell gives an 18V 2Ah / 2.5Ah battery pack.

    a 4/5Ah battery pack will be two sets of 5 cells in parallel, which can give twice the current.

    6Ah battery pack will be three sets of 5 cells in parallel, which can give 2x the current of a 2Ah battery pack.

    I normally just use 2Ah battery packs as they are light and small but occasionally my drill driver gets stuck and I have to use a 4AH pack so it can drill through something tough.

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    You’re right that a 4Ah pack could theoretically supply roughly (ignoring internal resistance) twice the current of a 2Ah pack but there must be some other limit on the current… either in the battery management chip or the converter. There’s no way a driver supplied with 2Ah batteries is only operating at half it’s rated output power, or that they’d supply a battery that was compatible and capable of supplying twice the rated current.

    footflaps
    Full Member

    You’re right that a 4Ah pack could theoretically supply roughly (ignoring internal resistance) twice the current of a 2Ah pack but there must be some other limit on the current… either in the battery management chip or the converter.

    A 4Ah battery pack has half the internal resistance of a 2Ah battery pack (assuming most of the resistance is in the cells themselves).

    The cells themselves will have a max current draw limit based on their own internal resistance – I suspect this will be the ultimate limit on the max current draw. They might cap it with the battery protection cicruitry but I’m guessing that’s quite tricky to do reliably. Someone on Youtube will have done a proper tear down of a battery pack and looked at the control circuit.

    goldfish24
    Full Member

    Foot flaps has it spot on

    Trust me, I’m a doctor of electronic engineering.
    I also enjoy using my 1.5ah battery with my combi and impact, but use the 4ah packs on other tools that need as much power as they can get. Put it this way, I’ve never felt impact driver lacks power, but the circular saw on the other hand can struggle. So I always use the 4ah on the saw and it makes a significant and noticeable difference.

    jolmes
    Free Member

    @thenorthwind I ended up getting this – https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dck2060m2t-sfgb-18v-4-0ah-li-ion-xr-brushless-cordless-twin-pack/362jt

    Been using both all weekend to remove and refit a kitchen and both have been amazing. The impact took a few mins to get used to as it was so forceful compared to my ryobi. It twice snapped a couple of screws in half removing them. User error I’m guessing or old screws.

    Got the extended warranty and the 100 pack of drill bits, also invaluable as it had some parts I didnt even know I needed, the circular hole drill bit was awesome for the pipe work.

    Didnt ever think I’d be so happy with a drill purchase. They’ve come in handy so much, living in a house built with engineers bricks is horrific.

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    @jolmes good stuff mate!

    thenorthwind
    Full Member

    Trust me, I’m a doctor of electronic engineering.

    So am I as it happens, but my area of expertise is in electromagnetic design so I’m not so familiar with battery stuff but have colleagues who are.

    The maximum discharge rate (i.e. current) of cells is generally specified as a function of capacity: e.g. a 2Ah cell with discharge rate of “2C” can source 4A. I doubt this would change depending on how the cells are configured in a pack, so a pack with 2 2C cells in parallel should have a theoretical discharge rate of twice the pack capacity, i.e 8A.
    The internal resistance shouldn’t be significant, except maybe at low state of charge.

Viewing 40 posts - 81 through 120 (of 141 total)

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