coke is a lower dose of caffine per unit volume and does not contain taurine.

You are taurine deficient?

OK – I realised ages ago this had reached an impasse but now it is also no longer amusing me.

some of you need to open your eyes and minds and accept that there are people who have a different world view.

you fail to understand that the object is not the referent, the product is not the brand. Because of this you cannot accept that it is possible to buy things for what they are not for what they are branded

I cannot explain this any better – I have tried.

is your comprehension that limited? really that is ridiculous.

You have failed to understand an basic cornerstone of the debate and are not open minded enough to accept that.

Yep limited comprehension and failed understanding. That’s me.
I can’t think why I got the impression you considered yourself a superior being…

In this thread you have openly stated that you dislike fussy (winky) logos, you do like traditional logos, you have dismissed versions of your name based on their appearance, and expressed a preference for solicitors based on their logos.

Yet you maintain that you are immune to branding.
I don’t think it is me that has the closed mind!

Ok, and you fail to see that you were sold on the idea of Red Bull

It is also a product – can you not see this -there is an object with inherent attributes there. Its a high dose of caffine in a convenient form
this is the bit you seem unable to do – separate the onject from its branding

no its not – its a brand, they sell a high energy caffeine drink that is branded as red bull.

A hoover is not a hoover, its a vacuum cleaner, but the brand is so dominant it has cornered the market (until dyson came along) – if you can’t grasp this there there is no hope, or you’re a stubborn old bugger.

the

Is that your way of agreeing that price and taste are both part of marketing? 🙂

mastiles_fanylion – Member

“coke is a lower dose of caffine per unit volume and does not contain taurine.”

Agreed but are you ever in such a desperate need for more caffeine than a can of Coke delivers? And if so, why not just a coffee? Or a ProPlus?

yes – 3 am on a night shift when I have to remain awake for 6 more hours. I have no access to decent coffee. Proplus would do but i don’t like to be seen swallowing pills

TandemJeremy

the object is not the referent, the product is not the brand.

“no its not – its a brand, they sell a high energy caffeine drink that is branded as red bull” 🙄 so there is no inherent attributes to teh object?

But I buy it because its a high caffine drink not because its red bull. I will buy a diffenrt cheaper one if it is available

jackthedog
….A couple of years ago I realised I found the whole branding sector – the sector my professional life had been dedicated to based on decisions I made when I was 14 – vapid and soul destroying. I was creating brands for products I thought had no relevance. I was just a cog in a big money making machine. I was just on this planet to help sell crap to people who didn’t need it. So eventually I walked out in a strop. I had a bit of a breakdown.

I came home in tears and stayed in bed for two days wondering what went wrong with my life. Wondering how I become a pawn in the corporate world I so despise. When I managed to gather my thoughts, I went back to work to hand my notice in and made myself wilfully unemployed right in the middle of a global financial meltdown.

I don’t know how to do anything else, so I became self employed and turned my skills to branding charities and community sector organisations. I use what I’m good at to help do good. And like I said before, I don’t have to sell my services. People now come to me, and they go away happy. I benefit their organisations, and they’re grateful.

What I do actually helps…..

WOW! Good on you – much respect for saying enough is enough.

Fancy thinking me up a company name and logo? I’m stuck and skint!

I think people understand that, TJ. The reason this has gone on so long is that people don’t belive you when you say you’re not influenced in any way by branding.

Going back to the drinks: You’re saying that if the soft drink fridge in the newsagent were filled with Red Bull, Relentless, Monster, Coke etc etc, but all in identical clear plastic bottles, with standard form labels with just the Companies House registration number of the UK subsidiary, nutritional information and a brief description of the taste (“Tastes like sugary medicine, peppery”, “Tastes like sugary medicine, strawberry” etc) you’d choose the same drink as you would have done if they were all branded up?

No ignoring the labels you don’t recognise, no being put off by colours that jar, no comfort with familiar logos, just reading all the labels in turn and finding the best balance of caffiene, sugar and cost?

That’s what you’re claiming, and that’s what people find hard to believe.

nedrapier – Member

That’s what you’re claiming, and that’s what people find hard to believe.

Yup. I do my very best to do so.

That must get very dull. Freedom is slavery.

Edit: and I still don’t believe you. well done for “trying your best” but I don’t believe zero influence.

Binners – nearly the 700.

Does the girl come with it?

TandemJeremy – Member
TandemJeremy
the object is not the referent, the product is not the brand.

“no its not – its a brand, they sell a high energy caffeine drink that is branded as red bull” so there is no inherent attributes to teh object?

that doesnt even make sense, youre contradicting yourself – we’ll agree to disagree

Not sure. Anyway, Beyonce, Jay Z and I have got the Champage on ice for 700. Its Armand De Brignac champagne. If that matters 😉

and, of course…..

Okay I’ve got a scenario for you TJ:

You are out and about, and you suddenly have a insatiable craving for a Falafel & Chicken Wrap.

There are three food outlets nearby and by some happy coincidence all three have signs announcing that they have just started stocking Falafel & Chicken Wraps that very same day.

The signs on these food outlets proclaim that they are:

1) McDonalds

2) Le Petit Poulet – home of the world’s best chicken wrap. 2 Michelin Stars

3) Ernie and Bettie’s Fairtrade Organic Wholefood Bistro and Tofu Knitting Supplies

Now you’ve never had a wrap from any of these places before and for all you know they could all be selling exactly the same wrap.

So tell us: how would you choose which one you’d buy from?

Would you really go to each store, ask to see a sample wrap, then dissect it, quiz them on the nutritional content and the freshness of ingredients, maybe ask for a tour of the kitchens and a copy of the most recent Environmental Health report?

seven’undred

Surely GrahamS, those stores are advertising what they ARE in the name.

If I want a Fairtrade and organic chicken wrap I will go to Number 3, just as I would go to a bike shop to get a bike rather than a travel agents….

I have no doubts that branding and advertising will have an effect on people, cognitively people like to hear words that they have heard before, so will be more likely to trust or pay a premium price if it is a well known brand. That is a fact.

But you can consciously chose to ignore this if you have motives (such as you want to pay the least amount, or you want to support local shop owners, or you want to reduce your carbon footprint by only eating things in season and grown in the UK). It would seem TJ has ulterior motives…. 😯

Graham- the only possible answer to that is “mu”

Graham- the only possible answer to that is “mu”

Okay.. well to state it differently:

Would you say that, since only the actual product matters, you are as happy to buy stuff from McDonalds as you are from a local organic fairtrade supplier or from a local award-winning business?

(Stumbles into thread in a rather hungover state. Reads first couple of pages. Loses will to live)

TJ; what in the name of the Sweet Little Baby Born In Bethlehem are you banging on about? Seriously?

I don’t think I’ve ever seen anybody wronger than this on the forum.

You are so wrong, that in the Scale Of Wrongness, you are a Custard Yellow Fiat Multipla driven by a naked man with blue-painted testicles and an echidna up his bottom.

Please stop. Please.

I don’t feel very well….

(Is too upset by it all, has to go and have a lie-down)

And I don’t even know what an echidna is. That’s how upset I am. 😥

PS, I read page 17, and surely TJ could chose RedBull based on prior experience of the drink…The question is why did he chose it in the first place.

It’s hard to create arguments using real life examples as people HAVE had prior experiences directly or indirectly with a brand/product. Create one that has no basis in reality… should be interesting.

And getting back to signage;

EDIT- an echinda is a monotreme (same as a platypus) looks like a fat ugly hedgehog and despite being a mammal lays eggs. It feeds its young milk by diffusing it out of its sweat glands. YUM

TandemJeremy – Member
nedrapier – Member
That’s what you’re claiming, and that’s what people find hard to believe.

Yup. I do my very best to do so.

bollox – and if you do, you’ve clearly got too much time on your hands

Hiya elf – you have missed a load of fun. Custard Yellow Fiat Multipla sounds fun. Can you sell me one? can you believe this is heading for 800 posts?

actually – re – reading that post – if they were all on the shelf in vanilla packaging, you would have no choice but to read the label. it probably wouldn’t give you any idea of what the product tasted like though, unless you regularly mix your own E-numbers and stabilizers. This is the point of marketing/branding – it lets you make an informed decision on which drink to buy – it saves you time.

Tyredbiker – This was my favourite sign. I used to ride past it every day. Its not there any more 🙁

TJ – do you act like this on a day to day basis – your missus must be a bloody saint!

M6TTF – Member

This is the point of marketing/branding- it lets you make an informed decision on which drink to buy – it saves you time.

do you really believe that? 🙄