@taxi25 never mind kids, would you be terrified if you met this cuddly bundle of fluff?:

https://www.itv.com/news/calendar/2019-10-17/dog-attack-victim-thanks-the-brave-men-who-came-to-her-rescue/

Exactly, these animals are terrifying, bred to be fighters and killers. Why any sane person would own one is beyond me.

children shouldn’t be “terrified” of dogs. If they are it’s generally because the terror has been instilled in them by adults.

In my experience, that’s complete horseshit. Kids are just instinctively nervous of toothy animals running at them. As a parent you’re left to talk them out of that fear, not into it.

As a parent you’re left to talk them out of that fear, not into it.

As an exception to that rule, my two grew up around farms and were actively told to be wary of any dog which they didn’t know or wasn’t directly under the control of a grown-up. TBH, it’s probably a decent rule for younger kids anywhere given the number of owners who make no effort to train or control their animals.

Not sure this relates in any way to the OP, of course. It seems only polite to give a dog owner at least five milliseconds warning so they can desperately grab for the collar as you hammer through.

In my experience, that’s complete horseshit. Kids are just instinctively nervous of toothy animals running at them. 

Again in a thread about people being more civil to each other someone wades straight in with an aggressive tone and language 🙄.
Yes children can be nervous of large toothy animals running towards them, but that’s different from being “terrified” in general about dogs approaching them.
My thinking that it’s been instilled is by a parent of the terrified child stating “I’m a dog/dog owner hater”
And yes geomickb I’m a dog owner so feel free to hate me 👍

grab for the collar

I’ve never seen a dog owner do this. They’ll just yell and yell it’s name whilst it resolutely ignores instruction, when what they should be doing is grab the collar and drag the animal out of my goddamned garden and away from my own pets that the dog wants to eat (for example…).

I’ve never seen a dog owner do this.

Must be a Yorkshire thing! Always a bit disconcerting when the beast is straining away wanting to eat me and being only-just-held-back by some five foot weakling. The collar-grab is normally an indication that this is the only way the owner thinks they can control the thrashing monster, so extra care is taken.

My favourite is being accosted by a dog with the owner nowhere in sight, or even better, when some tiny but aggressive breed decides to have a chase so you soft pedal along keeping it interested for about half a mile while the owner puffs along in pursuit, yelling impotently.

My favourite is being accosted by a dog with the owner nowhere in sight

I vastly prefer this to the dog owner being visible complete with lead(s) but associated canine occupant nowhere in sight.

Often followed by said owner, at precisely the moment I’m least able to avoid both human and hound, in an attempt to ease our passage by one another, shouting the previously oblivious dog causing it to dart back for treats, discover none on offer so proceed then to either directly chase me as no ball has been thrown, or dither in the track like a pheasant trying to outwit a car.

Keep your smelly dogs off the trails folks.

The only thing I have taken from this debate so far is confirmation that there are a lot of F&*k Tards in the world that like to air their views on forums….

Basic manners and looking out for each other has been going downhill rapidly in recent year.

Welcome to the modern day 🙁

What I find interesting is the way stereotypes develop. Substitute ‘I hate dog owners because dogs misbehave’, for ‘I hate cyclists becasue they jump red lights & ride on the pavement’. Why can’t people accept that some members of a group behave badly without blaming all members of that group for a minority’s actions?

grab for the collar

I’ve never seen a dog owner do this. 

Loads of dogs on my local trails, I’ll see this a few times every ride, it’s what I do.

What I find interesting is the way stereotypes develop. Substitute ‘I hate dog owners because dogs misbehave’, for ‘I hate cyclists becasue they jump red lights & ride on the pavement’. Why can’t people accept that some members of a group behave badly without blaming all members of that group for a minority’s actions?

I know of loads of well behaved dogs and responsible owners, I’m always pleased to see them, I’m not for a minute lumping them in with the ever increasing amount of lazy **** who think dogs are the latest must have fad.

That would just be silly, wouldn’t it?.

The only thing I have taken from this debate so far is confirmation that there are a lot of F&*k Tards in the world that like to air their views on forums….

Social media is:

And inevitably this:

And as we know from this thread a dog can never do anything wrong in the eyes of most owners, such is their blind devotion. Contrary to statistics, laws put in place to prevent humans being injured by dogs. Real world experience both reported and unreported, which demonstrates people being bitten (but not seriously injured) is much more prevalent than official statistics suggest.

Of the issues that need tackling in this country injury and death caused by obnoxious/any cyclists is extremely rare compared to that of motorists and attacks by dogs for example. Yet we all know which one gets the most media focus and exaggerated could-of claims, where a lack of courtesy, sometimes on both sides results in nothing more than a bit of handbags.

Malvern rider that’s funny and so very true .

Some pretty sad opinions in this thread.
I have a dog and I ride a bike too!

I’m aware of bikes when walking the dog but it really does help if you ding your bell round blind corners etc.

Equally if I’m riding I’ll ring my bell and slow down accordingly. Even more so if I’m not convinced they are aware of me.

It’s amazing how many people can be completely oblivious to a furiously back peddled Hope hub in conjunction with loads of bell rings.

In which case you just slow the hell down accordingly.

Don’t be dicks people.

I know this happened in Englandshire but ASSUMING this wasn’t on a dedicated bike trail

Be considerate to other users of the outdoors such as
walkers and horse riders; slow down and alert them to
your presence. On narrow paths give way or dismount if
necessary

Bike rider would appear to be wrong according to the Scottish outdoor access code.
plus bike going downhill possibly at speed (too fast to stop in time) plus not all dogs are the most intelligent and would regularly stand sideways on a path (mine do)

My thinking that it’s been instilled is by a parent of the terrified child stating “I’m a dog/dog owner hater”

But I’m not sure why you’d think that, given that I’ve seen various kids instinctively fearful of dogs in spite of their parents telling them it’s all fine (including both my own kids, me as a kid and—albeit anecdotally rather than observed—my wife as a kid). I’ve never once seen an example of your thinking.

Sure, “horseshit” is a confrontational phrasing, but come on, you were essentially accusing parents of being the sole cause of any childhood fear of dogs 😉

I mean, to me it seems odd to say

9.9million dogs in the UK, they’re a fact of life. Children need to be taught how to safely interact with them because they aren’t going away any time soon.

because if you swap “dogs” with “children” you get your own counter-argument. Except with a bigger number.

The Durham County Council visitor charter for the use of rail paths (miles of them round here, all shared use) sums it up quite well I think – basically, everyone should be civil to other users (or put another way: shared use, shared responsibility).

Extracted from the link above:

Walkers
Do
Keep your dogs under close control when cyclists or horse riders are nearby, remember horses may be spooked by loud or sudden noises
Listen for cyclists and horse riders who may be approaching you from behind
Be prepared to let cyclists or horse riders pass you, step out of the way if you can
Take extra care in areas with poor visibility
Do not
Obstruct the passageway for other users by taking up the full width of the path

Cyclists
Do
Give an audible warning and slow down when overtaking other users
Take extra care when approaching children, horses and dogs
Take care in areas with poor visibility
Limit party size to ten cycles
Do not
Ride too quickly, the paths are not racetracks and should not be used as if they were
Brake hard,deliberately skid or do anything else that is likely to damage the surface of the path
Ride on the embankment or other rough areas off the surfaced path

I’ve left out the sections for other users.

Now, I’ve been doing this MTB thing for a few decades, travelling widely and often on a bike. One thing I can tell you is dogs will chase bikes and bark/bite as that’s what instinct tells them to do.

My children have been harrassed by dogs on many occasions, with dog owners doing little to effectively prevent this, or stop it when it happens. They often say, “it’s fine, they won’t hurt you” but it’s not fine. Not fine at all. I teach my children to be very wary of dogs.

I’ve been chased and bitten by dogs when on my bike too, with much the same approach in response from dog owners. Not fine.

One thing I’m sure of, is that this was not the first time these dogs have chased/barked/bitten people. They’ll do it again too, as the owners don’t really seem willing to prevent it by keeping them on a lead, or training them better where possible. Whilst I appreciate people have a right to keep dogs, they don’t have any right to allow them to threaten and harrass other users of the outdoors.

There are of course good dog owners. But IMHO the numbers are testament to a majority being less than responsible. I even see friends of mine with dogs, who are cyclists, losing their sense of proportion when they have their pooch and not a bike with them.

When riding off road with my children, I now keep a little water pistol in a holster on my handlebars, full of grapefruit juice as when squirted at the offending pooch, this acts like tear gas to them and sends them packing pretty quickly.

I’ve yet to use it on a dog owner, but I’m sure it won’t be long before someone from this group of entitled and self interested tw*nts take umbridge at my approach. Just like hanging poo bags in trees, or putting them on the floor next to a full bin, this sort of behaviour is not ok. Dog owners need to compelled to behave better, as I can’t see them doing any form of self policing, some sort of mandated control needs to be implemented.

And yes, I do know dog owners who are responsible for their dogs. Even they are concerned with the quantity of people who own dogs and are not attempting to be responsible for them at all.

Maybe this is more of an issue in the UK, or at least certain areas of the country, as i’ve really not had many issues with other trail users. Certainly seen far more issues with other humans than with any animals.

Maybe this is more of an issue in the UK, or at least certain areas of the country

100%, the Lakes being a perfect example. I love the place, but it’s choc full of folk who have moved there and have their own ideas about what the place is.

And as we know from this thread a dog can never do anything wrong in the eyes of most owners

Statistics or it didn’t happen

Maybe this is more of an issue in the UK, or at least certain areas of the country, 

Could be true, but it’s also possible some people take their issues with them wherever they go ?

I do think the problem is exacerbated in the more populated south of the country, where access to outdoor spaces is more limited and busier.

Emptying your dog is easier at the local woods, as there’s fewer people to see you/fine you for fouling.

Interestingly the forestry commission now advise dog owners to adopt the ‘stick and flick’ method of dog egg clearing. I think the theory is it’s one less plastic bag being used and it breaks down quickly in the under growth. I don’t adopt that as the woods I walk the dogs in are where I build trails so there is only one way that will end!
One dog stays on lead as he is a ****. Other runs around chasing squirrels as she is stupid. I have only ever seen one of my mates on the trails I walk though. Not high traffic!

Could be true, but it’s also possible some people take their issues with them wherever they go?

Could well be.

Let’s be civil shall we?
Ok great, let’s stop the keeping of predatory carnivorous animals as pets. Shows how insane society is that this is ‘normal’.
How would you like to be completely domesticated and reliant on an owner for your own existence? Yeah, you wouldn’t.

How would you like to be completely domesticated and reliant on an owner for your own existence?

Beats working.

Ooh this could go off topic fast!

Interestingly the forestry commission now advise dog owners to adopt the ‘stick and flick’ method of dog egg clearing.

They can **** right off with that nonsense as well, just pick the thing up ya lazy bastards!.

Like I said I do. Although we are all the same no good shit chucking idiots that make their fighting dogs attack small children apparently so what do I know!

And if you are wondering why dog presents should be picked up:

https://www.kingdom.co.uk/articles/issues-and-dangers-surrounding-dog-fouling/

“The parasites lay eggs, which are released via the infected dog’s faeces. The eggs can remain active in the soil for many years, long after the dog mess has been washed away by the rain. If the eggs are then ingested by someone, for example a small child, they may hatch into larvae and thus lead to toxocariasis. So, the child doesn’t necessarily have to pick up dog faeces in order to become infected – they could just be playing with soil which had dog faeces on it years ago and still contains active eggs. ”

How would you like to be completely domesticated and reliant on an owner for your own existence?

I’m married, no difference really 😉

What if it was shown scientifically that the outdoor-scent of dog-poo deters vegans and that walkers deter cyclists, but that vegan cyclists effectively deter walkers, wives and dog-owners whilst simultaneously making bacon free for e-bikers?

Peak Daily Heil?

Hang on a minute I’m a vegan cyclist dog walker! I don’t know who I am anymore!

Basically everyone hates you, probably even your dog.

Sorry.

Tough times! To be fair to the dogs there are no left over meat pieces anymore, I bet they can’t believe there is another cauliflower in the house! I would hate me if I wasn’t so righteous 😂

The thing is this…..

If your a Self opinionated, angry, selfish, sorry excuse for a human being then you are a….

Self opinionated, angry, selfish, sorry excuse for a human being on a bike or a

Self opinionated, angry, selfish, sorry excuse for a human being walking a dog or

Driving a car , walking a footpath , sitting on a train , taking your children out for the day , in the pub ………….

If you feel that this cap fits you then perhaps you should try and change, the world would be better if there were less people like this.

Its the individual thats the problem – not the thing they happen to be doing when they briefly and unpleasantly collide with your life !