ST IN 'CAN'T LET GO SHOCKER'…. 😆

Feeling better Dave ?

The point I was making is that it seemed to me that the course designer seemed to have taken the best bits of other trails and transplanted them on the Brum hillside. The switch-backs leave a lot to be desired.

I hope it works out for you, but I wonder if anyone has taken the time to tell the Highways Agency that you're expecting thousands of riders across that busy main road. If not, may I suggest you take some legal advice as there seems to be a shortcoming in the business plan where "Duty of Care" is concerned, it seems to me.

If it's been three years in the making then there's no excuse for there not to be better signage both for the riders and the motorists & this is something that needs your urgent attention.

There should be sum bins around the course aswell.

Ti29er, the idea that Chase Trails are responsible for the safety of the people using what they've built is completely unfounded. That responsibility rests partly with the landowner (he Forestry Commission), but mostly with the users of the trail…

FWIW I haven't ridden the new stuff at the Chase but a mate up that way was comparing it to sections of the best man-made trails in Wales. To pull that off in a heavily populated area with very different topography and geology is no mean feat.

"If it's been three years in the making then there's no excuse for there not to be better signage both for the riders and the motorists & this is something that needs your urgent attention. "

Yeah but if you'd kept track of the chase trails blog you'd realise that CT were working to a tight schedule. Mainly because people kept riding the trails even though they were not finished therefore the opening of the trail was to some extent forced upon them.

The problem with something like this done mainly by volunteers is you'll never have enough time and it will never really be properly finished as there'll always be something else that could be added to make it better.

I do like the idea of some signage or markings on the road (particularly idea of some countdown markers) to suggest this is a crossing of some significance.

However this clearly is nt chase trails responsibility and Im pretty sure it would be illegal for them to start putting signs up on a public highway.

I imagine the forestry commission will need to gather data on how many people are using the cross now the trail is open before they can possibly push the local council for some kind warnings.

In the same bizarre way that if a council wants to drop the speed limit on a road to 20 mph they often build speed bumps drop the average speed to 20mph then record that the average speed is below 20 and they can then press ahead for the change to 20mpd.

Ti289er , just interested to know the basis of all your opinions?

Have you actually been involved in a trail build anywhere ?

I bet it would be possible to take a pop, or make a constructive (ie negative comment) about any trail in the country – easiest game in the world. So stop being negative and look at the positives that can then be built upon.

I am sure CT know what needs to be snagged and I guess they really don't need you to tell them.

ps i guess you won't be re visiting!

how about providing cotton wool suits and stabalisers at the start so nobody gets hurt

Will the stabilsers fit through the trees ? ( which were planted in the wrong place )

I rode it yesterday and found that the switchbacks are tight, but as already mentioned, that's part of the challenge. I wouldn't really compare it to Wales, the trails there are far more predictable with completely different terrain. I reckon the Monkey will take more time to master but is all the better for it. I am concerned about the amount of breaking bumps appearing though.. We may just see a few more sections re-named 'chain slapper' quite soon.

I thought it is an amazing trail, nice technical sections, and the hairpin climbs were a great challenge. I agree that some sections may cause accidents if speed exceeds the riders skill levels, but thats part if life.

Perhaps Ti29er needs a few skills sessions arranging there? Can Jedi help?

The point I was making is that it seemed to me that the course designer seemed to have taken the best bits of other trails and transplanted them on the Brum hillside. The switch-backs leave a lot to be desired.

I hope it works out for you, but I wonder if anyone has taken the time to tell the Highways Agency that you're expecting thousands of riders across that busy main road. If not, may I suggest you take some legal advice as there seems to be a shortcoming in the business plan where "Duty of Care" is concerned, it seems to me.

If it's been three years in the making then there's no excuse for there not to be better signage both for the riders and the motorists & this is something that needs your urgent attention.

Wow, are you really as sanctimonious and high-handed as that makes you sound?

Congratulations to the people who took the time and made the effort to create something. Whatever it is, it has to be be far, far better than the nothing that is likely to have existed otherwise.

re thinking my idea might need stabilisers with a folding button on the handle bars for the narrow bits and also might go for bubble wrap suits as the cotton wool wont last in the rain.

In my view for a trail to have long term appeal to riders it needs to throw in a few curve balls for the first few laps of even the most competent rider. If you ride it perfectly first time then the incentive to become a regular visitor is surely reduced

Absolutely, looking forward to get more and more familiar with it – there's a lot more laps to be had and a lot more speed to squeeze out!

Scruff, yes, much more better i think. Managed a reasonable 30km Saturday, stopped gobbing brown flem like chow-mein lumps up yesterday. Am bruised up again proper like, feel like I've had a scrap behind the library!

And I didnt like being in the B team. at all.

Furthermore, for a route that takes you out beyond the more populated areas, I saw no "Escape" signage, surely a given on such Red graded route?

I don't want a fatality or serious accident any more than you do, but it seems to me there are some glaring omissions here that could be exploited in a court of law.
This would not be a good development either for Cannock Chase nor every other Forestry Commission mountain bike area, so I'd be keen to see these loop holes closed thus preventing a legal precedent being established.

Sad to say, but this has been the only red graded trail where I mistrusted the trail builders / designers & so I took it easier than normal; contrast that to somewhere like Penmachno where you get a real sense of the designer's intentions and so it flows, ever faster & so seemlessly.

Wow, are you really as sanctimonious and high-handed as that makes you sound?

from previous experience on here and BikeMagic, yes he is.

I think the 'copied the best bits from other centres' was a cheap shot and rather unfair. You mean like climbs, descents, berms, switchbacks, jumps, drops, rollers etc – obviously shouldn't have incorporated any of those features as they've been done elsewhere. No no, Cannock must come up with something entirely unheard of. Clown.

Personally I think it's quite a unique trail with some original features that make you think and want to go back. To compete with Wales and Scotland centres without having the same big mountain geology is some achievement. If you can't find flow it might be rider error – let me guess, Deggy makes you think you're the mutt's nuts on a bike right?

Yeah some of the surface needs repairing but the weather hasn't been kind and it'll settle, as did the modificiations to S2 and S8 which are now holding up fine. And I fluffed up a couple of the switchbacks but I'll have em next time. Overall I think it's a grand job and Midland mtbers are finally getting a first class trail on their doorsteps.

Furthermore, for a route that takes you out beyond the more populated areas, I saw no "Escape" signage, surely a given on such Red graded route?

I don't want a fatality or serious accident any more than you do, but it seems to me there are some glaring omissions here that could be exploited in a court of law.
This would not be a good development either for Cannock Chase nor every other Forestry Commission mountain bike area, so I'd be keen to see these loop holes closed thus preventing a legal precedent being established.

Sad to say, but this has been the only red graded trail where I mistrusted the trail builders / designers & so I took it easier than normal; contrast that to somewhere like Penmachno where you get a real sense of the designer's intentions and so it flows, ever faster & so seemlessly.

I was kind of listening to you before, just doesn't seem worth the effort now.

'but this has been the only red graded trail where I mistrusted the trail builders / designers'

it's not mistrusting the trail builders it the fact that your riding whey faster than your skill allows you to, stick to the family trails next time your up cannock

Ti29er

Furthermore, for a route that takes you out beyond the more populated areas, I saw no "Escape" signage, surely a given on such Red graded route?

perhaps your tall wheels place your head in the clouds above the signage but I remember seeing at least 3 'short cut' signs along the route – they are grey in colour. The new Monkey route also crosses several paralel running fireroads that anyone with half an ounce of direction would realise lead back to the main road (my mate certinally did whwn he had to walk 3odd miles back to Marquis Drive)

I originally said I could kind of see some of the OP's points but I would now like to distance myself somewhat from his later posts
Yes the road will need signage ideally due to increased numbers crossing, but that is down to the Council not CT to do the studies and fund

With regards to trees, there are 2 trees just after the start of the first descent after the first big climb where the gap between was only just wider (3-4")than my handlebars (and they are only 680mm), also a tree that has been cut off at chest height on M6. Both these are just as you are picking up speed and are relatvely blind until you are upon them. They didnt cause me any problems but I can see they will for less experienced riders, and they definately could slow you down, therefore you could say this disturbs the 'flow'
Also there are some stumps on the edges of the trail just over humps or jumps, right on the landing area where if you mis judge slightly you could land on one, this happened to my friend and completely trashed his wheel despite only going quite slowly at the time
Familarity with the trail though will obviously help with this
Im sure will be less of a problem when the surface has bedded in as at the moment there is quite alot of loose top dressing that means grip is not great in some places (to be expected with such intense use and dry weather)
Not saying that the trail should be fireroad esque but there are the odd bit where I can see why people would complain it didnt flow

Certinaly not enough to ruin the trail though, which is pretty much fantastic and a great achievement so thanks to everyone involved
Compared to somewhere similar like Sherwood Pines or Thetford it certinally sets a new benchmark in what can be achieved

(oh and I saw the two kids with no helmets riding with a girl in flipflops on Wednesday, stupid attire, or lack of totally agreed but the two lads where reasonably proficient on their bikes and almost cleared the FtD skinny log when I was passing)

Furthermore, for a route that takes you out beyond the more populated areas, I saw no "Escape" signage, surely a given on such Red graded route?

I don't want a fatality or serious accident any more than you do, but it seems to me there are some glaring omissions here that could be exploited in a court of law.
This would not be a good development either for Cannock Chase nor every other Forestry Commission mountain bike area, so I'd be keen to see these loop holes closed thus preventing a legal precedent being established.

Sad to say, but this has been the only red graded trail where I mistrusted the trail builders / designers & so I took it easier than normal; contrast that to somewhere like Penmachno where you get a real sense of the designer's intentions and so it flows, ever faster & so seemlessly.

I saw at least two shortcuts.. clearly marked!

Have you ever ridden Penmachno? Great trail but some of those 90 degree corners completely ruin the flow. Not a great example!

great troll.

Thought the new trail was very good, rode some sections at "my" high speed (not that quick really) and some at a more controlled speed to enable me to read the trail ahead as I didn't know it. Only put my foot down on one switchback that I tried to take too tight as I was talking to the wife.

I'm not a great rider and rank in the bottom half of most groups so can't see an issue with what is a red graded trail. I do think the trail will improve as it beds in though.

You presume to know what bike I was riding.
An incorrect presumption.

If there are short cuts / escape route, then two of us missed them. If they exist, then I stand corrected, although we both missed them on our ride.

The points are still valid, the only thing that's changed is that 1/2 way along the thread you'll see that the comments have become ever more personal in nature, it’s only to be expected from some members, especially if you don’t agree with some of what’s been said or done.

I posted the original comments as I felt that some of these issues were being glossed over by other posts which centred on back-slapping and perhaps not addressing some of the concerns agreed with and expanded upon here earlier. As you say yourself, there are stumps and such like that can ruin a ride unnecessarily. There is no harm in exploring these in a public forum without the seemingly inevitable trend for personal assaults which serve no purpose.

Ignoring the flaming, signage for a road crossing doesn't strike me as a bad idea overall!

Is there a map for the new stuff yet? Just interested to see where it leaves / joins FTD.

I like trails that flow seemlessly. 🙂

Is there a map for the new stuff yet? Just interested to see where it leaves / joins FTD.

Here you go..

The Monkey Trail

Click the nearby routes tab to overlay FTD.

Er, I think there are some already in place, might be for the crossing point to the Cop though.

Blinding….thats my opinion. I had a quick job in cannock in the morming today so i lobbed the bike in the car and came up from Milton Keynes, job took 45mins so off to the trails. it's my first time at Cannock so i did both follow the dog and the monkey and loved them. i was on a single speed decade frame with some small block 8 tyres on and it was dry, the grip around the trail was untold, and although i was a little concerned about being out too long (due back to work in the afternoon) i was round in about 1h.30 mins and now cant wait to go again. take it from me all the naysayers, there may be a few faults but it's miles better than anything we have in MK. Overall opinion was top notch for a free trail. Will definatly be coming back..thanks cannock.

The only sign that is needed is a big arrow pointing 'right' at the top of the big berm after the jump (sorry don't know what section of the Monkey it's on). For some reason i thought it went straight on (too busy looking at the jump/landing spot) and had to slam on the brakes (sorry i skidded :oops:)

Went up on Saturday. Amazed how much it's changed and how much work has gone in to it. The trail design it's self is great. Really fun and flowy. Ok its always going to look man made and it needs a season of weather and compacting as it's so loose in places but I am really impressed. The climbing is interesting as opposed to fire roads and the switchbacks are almost alp like. Ok much smaller but you still have to know how to ride them and not roll around mindlessly. I was still taken back by how many idiots with no helmets on £50 bikes there were walking down the trails though. Glad I went early as I imagine it would be a frustrating waste of time later on at the weekend but any way, well done the chase trail builders.

if we can't cross a road, then maybe we shouldnt be in control of a speeding bike?

Haven't ridden the trail so can't comment much, all I know is that if we build a trail here, someone will complain about some part of it being too dangerous. If we fix that part, someone will complain that we sanitised the only good bit. You can't win. But still going by the overall comments you've come pretty close 😉

i'm still waiting for the monkey impressions

i'm maybe going this weekend, my 1st trail centre!, will i die?

how wide are your bars?

Field of Dreams – "Build it – they will come"
Monkey Trail – "Build it – they will complain"

I don't know what it is about Cannock Chase, but of all the trail centres I've ridden, it's the one location where I come across riders with a profusion of Halford sourced bikes but more importantly in a wooded trail, without lids.

Which in turn leads me to believe that those who are familiar with the FtD route will naturally graduate to the Monkey Trail. It's these guys and girls that I have concerns for (such as 2x crossing the road!) more than the atypical STW rider who is most likely a more switched on, alert & experienced rider.

The Monkey Trail is a completely different proposition to FtD and that's part of the unease I feel as the transition is almost too great. There's talk (above) of riders queueing, of riders walking bikes down the trail – not ideal – so a weekday does seem the best time to ride the Chase trails.