Cancer and the Livestrong band

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  • Cancer and the Livestrong band
  • kcr
    Member

    [video]http://youtube.com/watch?v=FH2o5Rxc6F0 [/video]

    nealglover
    Member

    Nealglover and Crikey; I’ve reported you both to the moderators for trouble making, as you’ve added nothing to the discussion other than to try to get a rise. Either come up with something constructive, or just don’t bother posting at all.

    Well.

    I’ve read your points, disagreed with them, And I’ve explained why.

    That’s what a discussion is.

    If you can’t get to grips with that, it’s no real wonder that you failed to understand the simple point junkyard was making.

    Premier Icon unknown
    Subscriber

    Hence why I don’t feel…

    Redpanda you lost me at “hence why”.

    As for the OP, this might not be a popular viewpoint but weren’t the wristbands only ever really a fashion accessory that were trendy among try-hards for a couple of years a decade ago? I doubt most wearers gave much thought to cancer to be honest.

    crikey
    Member

    Either come up with something constructive, or just don’t bother posting at all.

    Um, it’s STW, not the Oxford Debating society.
    If we all have to come up with constructive comments it won’t work, Adolf.

    wukfit
    Member

    were they the first charity wristband?
    first i saw for a few years anyway, then it just got stupid and most of them weren’t for charity or anything just coloured bands

    wobbliscott
    Member

    The question is, and I don’t know the answer, what has the Livestrong charity actually done in terms of how much its raised and what its done with its funds? If the answer to that is positive, then at least it is one positive thing that has come out of this whole debacle. Other than that he’s clearly a cheating **** and he’s now been exposed as a cheat and a pretty arrogant and unpleasant character too.

    My brothers son has thankfully got through Leukaemia, and for the 2 – 3 yrs or so when he was suffering, there were many small charities that did alot of things that helped him and kids like him, as well their families, get through the nightmare they were facing. From small things like funding people to come into the wards and entertain them, to taking them and their families away for small holidays (in many tragic cases the last holiday they would all spend together), through to the cutting edge of research. All helped tremendously and are all worthy of support. If the Livestrong charity is engaged in similar activities that is bringing real help to sufferers and their families, then it deserves continued support. Maybe it should change its name if the Lance association is harming it. If there are lots of rich people out there who still like and believe in Lance, then at least the charity can benefit from their disillusionment. I’m assuming Lance has nothing to do with the charity anymore?

    redpanda
    Member

    If we all have to come up with constructive comments it won’t work, Adolf.

    Classy. I’m Jewish. Some of my ancestors died in the Holocaust.

    I’ve reported you because I find your comment incredibly offensive.

    You wouldn’t say that to my face, so why say it on here?

    crikey
    Member

    You are fully aware that my comments are related to this thread and this thread alone, and that I have no idea of your personal life. If you choose to take offence at that you are free to do so.

    I am more than prepared to apologise if my comments have upset you, they were not intended to do so.

    julianwilson
    Member

    Now a Livestrong Power Balance band, that would be something….

    bullheart
    Member

    What tyres for chat about mass genocide?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    unknown – Member

    weren’t the wristbands only ever really a fashion accessory that were trendy among try-hards for a couple of years a decade ago?

    Nah, they’re a cheap and easy fundraiser- cost nowt to make, and give people a feeling of getting something back for their donation, as well as being a little bit of useful advertising. They’ve done their job as soon as you drop money in a tin

    This is quite an interesting article

    http://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/athletes/lance-armstrong/Its-Not-About-the-Lab-Rats.html?page=all

    doh
    Member

    forget the nazi thing, prob better to compare it to a “jim fixed it for me” badge.

    i never got the whole band thing especially when i found there was roaring trade in fake ones???

    yunki
    Member

    sterling work by doh 😀

    although, won’t somebody please think of the children

    pondo
    Member

    For my money the important thing is the intent – I wore a band as a gesture of support for cancer sufferers and the charities that support them and look for a cure. If other people have a different interpretation, that’s fine – what was important was what it meant to me.

    higgo
    Member

    I am well aware of the origins of the swastika. I am also aware that most people in the western world associate it with the Nazi Holocaust that claimed the lives of countless innocent people.

    Which is why it’s really not an appropriate symbol to claim the LS brand is as ‘tainted’ as.I think you are confusing ‘band’ with ‘brand’. The Livestrond band was part of, but not the entirety of the Livestrong brand.

    To claim thus is to equate the two organisations in some way.

    In your head. It is you making the connection between the symbol and the organisation. JY was talking about the symbols being equally tainted.

    In fact, you could argue that JY is wrong that they’re equally tainted. The Livestrong yellow band is a short-lived thing and has only ever been linked to the cheating Texan. It is likely that, as a symbol, it is doomed – tainted forever. The swastika on the other hand has been around for millennia. It is quite possible that given enough time it will be rehabilitated.

    patriotpro
    Member

    Yawn city

    londonerinoz
    Member

    redpanda, I think you need to recognise you’re more sensitive to topics associated with the Nazis than most and that you’re taking offence from that perspective which would probably differ from most people. I’d imagine you’d want the Holocaust remembered, and in a sense an ordinary person using the swastika as an example in an unrelated discussion helps preserve that history in a very small way in the momentary allusion. A sure way for it to be forgotten is if people never mention it for fear of someone taking offence, especially when for most people it doesn’t have the significance it does for you, so why would they bother?

    belugabob
    Member

    I’m not totally sure, but I think that the red panda is an endangered species.

    londonerinoz – Member

    redpanda, I think you need to recognise you’re more sensitive to topics associated with the Nazis than most and that you’re taking offence from that perspective which would probably differ from most people. I’d imagine you’d want the Holocaust remembered, and in a sense an ordinary person using the swastika as an example in an unrelated discussion helps preserve that history in a very small way in the momentary allusion. A sure way for it to be forgotten is if people never mention it for fear of someone taking offence, especially when for most people it doesn’t have the significance it does for you, so why would they bother?

    You should try that method on some black folks, tell them they’re a bit more sensitive to racist jokes than most people, and they should recognise that and chill out a bit.

    belugabob
    Member

    You should try that method on some black folks, tell them they’re a bit more sensitive to racist jokes than most people, and they should recognise that and chill out a bit.-

    Excpet for that, in this case, Junkyard made no racist jokes (or any kind of joke, for that matter) and was merely pointing out that symbols become tainted by the actions of the people who use them. To give a simpler example, I’d never wear a hoody – no matter how comfy or practical they are – because their image has been forever tainted by the feral youth who show a preference for wearing them.

    Londineroz was simply noting that being scared to mention certain things, for fear of upsetting people, is in some ways counter productive, because that stops the subject from ever being raised in a constructive manner.(“Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it” is the phrase, I believe)

    Spin
    Member

    IMHO it is as tainted as the swastika

    Whether you intended it or not the above is a direct comparison between the livestrong band and the swastika and it’s understandable that redpanda thought it stupid at best and offensive at worst.

    In no way, shape or form can the livestrong band be said to be as tainted as the swastika.

    Redpanda’s suggestion that you apologise is entirely appropriate.

    Spot on BelugaBob

    Spin
    Member

    IMHO it is as tainted as the swastika

    If you want proof of how wrong this statement is then look around at the number of people still openly wearing Livestrong Bands.

    I’ll wager you’ll see more of them than Swastikas.

    Also, the whole Livestrong thing did have positive impacts. Many people have said that it inspired them to fight on or to raise money. These positive impacts stand apart from the downfall (pun intended) of Lance and remain positives. I’m not aware of the Swastika as used by the Nazis having any such positive connotations, so to compare their level of ‘taint’ is wrong.

    IanMunro
    Member

    If you want proof of how wrong this statement is then look around at the number of people still openly wearing Livestrong Bands.

    I’ll wager you’ll see more of them than Swastikas.

    Possibly not if you live in India though.

    Spin
    Member

    Possibly not if you live in India though.

    Yes, we all know the Swastika is an ancient religious symbol.

    nealglover
    Member

    In no way, shape or form can the livestrong band be said to be as tainted as the swastika.

    That’s your opinion, we have heard other peoples opinions already.

    Redpanda’s suggestion that you apologise is entirely appropriate.

    Is he apologising because his opinion is different to someone else’s ?

    There is nothing remotely offensive about the comparison he made. Even if its not a very good comparison in some peoples view, so what ?

    Spin
    Member

    There is nothing remotely offensive about the comparison he made. Even if its not a very good comparison in some peoples view, so what ?

    I’m being critical of what he wrote not what he meant by it. He has clarified that he didn’t intend a literal comparison. If he had said “like the Swastika, the Livestrong band has become tainted by subsequent events” I would question the taste of the statement but not its veracity. Unfortunately he didn’t say that but made a direct comparison between the moral taint of each. This is offensive and I’m sure you understand why.

    wukfit
    Member

    but made a direct comparison between the moral taint of each. This is offensive and I’m sure you understand why.

    I don’t think is offensive.
    you could claim its wrong, the symbol is tainted but not AS tainted as the swastika
    but not offensive
    IMO

    nealglover
    Member

    I’m sure you understand why.

    I understood what he meant when he wrote it. And left it at that.

    You seem to need to find something offensive about it. I’m sure if you try hard enough you will twist his meaning around enough and you will succeed.

    What he wrote still won’t actually be offensive though.

    Good luck.

    Euro
    Member

    Here’s a topical LOL for the boringly argumentative amongst us. You must constantly have black eyes if you get on like this in real life.

    Spin
    Member

    I don’t think is offensive

    It’s offensive because he said that the taint is equal which implies that the cause of the taint is morally equal. This grossly belittles the suffering caused by the Nazis in WWII.

    I’m genuinely surprised that you don’t see this.

    Spin
    Member

    You seem to need to find something offensive about it. I’m sure if you try hard enough you will twist his meaning around enough and you will succeed.

    I don’t need to twist it. That’s my whole point. He directly equated the level of moral taint on a Livestrong band with that of Nazi use of the swastika.

    nealglover
    Member

    which implies that the cause of the taint is morally equal. This grossly belittles the suffering caused by the Nazis in WWII.

    He didn’t say that bit though, you made it up.

    But keep twisting it, it’s getting more offensive the more stuff you make up.

    Spin
    Member

    He didn’t say that bit though, you made it up

    Have you considered the possibility that statements can have interpretations and ramficaions other than those intended by the writer?

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    IMO, JY has nothing to take back or apologise for. Guilty of minor hyperbole perhaps but that often makes threads interesting and frankly any more stuff on LA needs an angle!! I agree the Livestrong brand and by association Livestrong products are tainted. Similarly, in relation to Nazism, the swastika is a tainted symbol although not in all associations. If there is any trolling here, it’s to make an issue of something that clearly was neither intended nor even there in the first place.

    nealglover
    Member

    Have you considered the possibility that statements can have interpretations other than those intended by the writer?

    Are they the bits that you are making up so you can find it offensive ?

    Premier Icon teamhurtmore
    Subscriber

    Have you considered the possibility that statements can have interpretations and ramficaions other than those intended by the writer?

    Indeed, so turn this on its head. We have a choice to be offended by what we read or to ignore it. IMO, the latter would have been the best policy here for those who say offence in the first place.

    Spin
    Member

    Are they the bits that you are making up so you can find it offensive ?

    I think you need to read my posts again but to summarise in case you can’t be arsed:

    I’m satisfied that JY did not intend to suggest that LA’s actions were comparable to those of the Nazis.

    However,

    His statement that the LS band is as tainted as the Swastika is open to such an interpretation and therefore has potential to cause offence.

    nealglover
    Member

    His statement that the LS band is as tainted as the Swastika is open to such an interpretation.

    Then I think you should be apologising for misinterpreting what he wrote.

    Despite the fact that he was forced to explain it by the first person who chose to misinterpret it so they could be offended.

    Spin
    Member

    We have a choice to be offended by what we read or to ignore it. IMO, the latter would have been the best policy here for those who say offence in the first place.

    Well firstly I’m not sure we do have a choice about what offends us and secondly if someone is offended by a statement whether intentional or not it’s important to say so.

Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 108 total)

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