Evening all. Hoping to pick the collective mind as I know there’s plenty of good photographers on here.

I have just acquired a practically new condition (bought and used a handful of times then stuck in a drawer for a couple of years) Canon EOS 1100d that was going in the bin. Some people eh 🙄

Anyway it comes with the original kit lens efs 18-55mm but without image stabilisation. How important would people say that was? Taken a few messing about around the house and all are clear but on a windy day, maybe I’ll notice. Would it be worth maybe finding the newer equivalent with IS?

As for lenses are these kit type lens with the wider range (as I understand it) good enough? I intend to use this for outdoors/landscapes, portraits of the kids and general ‘action’ of the kids out and about.

Can understand the benefits of multiple dedicated lens but ideally want, for now at least, a good compromise.

Would something like the Canon efs 50mm Prime be good for day to day and take the kit lens when I’m outdoors wanting to do landscape until such time I decide I may want a dedicated lens for that.

Also and finally(!). New or secondhand? Where’s best? Anywhere in Manchester City Centre?

Cheers for anything. Always fancied a ‘proper’ camera but never got around to it and this was too good an opportunity to miss so got a lot of researching to get up to speed.

My son is the camera buff but we bought him a white box lens for Christmas. Basically brand new but usually a split bundle. You will save quite a bit. His new lens has the better stabilisation. He has the 18-50, then a 70-300 but was missing the bit in the middle so got the Canon 18-105 lens that should have been about £400 but got it for around £250.

The lenses are the pricy bit. Learn how to use the camera first.

Oh I intend to learn the camera. Will be freeing myself of the Auto mode as much as possible once I’ve got to grips with it.

Trying to figure out if that’s a decent enough lens or whether something smaller/newer might serve my intended use better.

I appreciate it was never a high end camera and that it’s a few years old too but already I can see it blows both the iPhone and point and shoot away in the situations it’s been used, especially where poor light is concerned anthe speed seems silly fast.

For what it cost me (£0) I don’t mind swapping a lens from the off if it’ll better suit me.

I fully intend to get out and about when off work and get to grips with it and may find this lens works fine for me but hoping to understand what their options might suit and where to go looking for them.

I imagine like bikes there’s a group of must have the newest so there must be some decent sources, beyond eBay for used kit.

The 18-55 ef-s was/is a much maligned lens, but unfairly so in my opinion, it’s not the fastest glass out there and it’s not got the sharpness or clarity of an L series lens, but then it doesn’t cost anywhere near as much and gets you a usable focal range in a lens that will perform well enough in daylight.  The 50mm f1.8 is an excellent lens, I have owned two of the mk2 version (lost one somewhere!) and they are great in low light.  I used them for gig photography on both 35mm and digital and got some awesome shots.  I have since picked up a mk1version of the lens from cash converters with a free camera (old EOS 650 35mm) that is functionally identical other than a distance indicator and metal mount so my mk2 is sat doing nowt.

sigma lenses are always worth a shout, but best to check compatibility with digital as older ones may not work properly with newer cameras.

I doubt you’ll benefit too much from buying another lens with IS. It’s more useful when you are using longer lenses. I can’t comment on the actual Canon lens though as I’m more familiar with Nikon stuff. But I’d say put your cash into a prime lens like the 50mm. Try setting the kit lens at the focal length ie 50mm and shoot some pics. FWIW I bought a 50 but probably would have been better with a 35 for the kids, they love to run up to the camera and I’m always moving back to get them in shot. Try some Canon groups on Flickr and watch some you tube stuff, there is loads about.

You don’t need image stablisation for stills photography, it’s not quite a waste of time but it’s not far off unless you shoot video or very long telephoto sports, action or wild life in which case it might help.

The 18-55mm lens will have a field of view equivalent to about 28mm to 88mm focal lengths, which is a good working range. I personally prefer a prime lens but for starters, since you have that lens, it will serve you well and since you have this lens, it’s also the best compromise.

A 50mm lens on that body will have a working field of view of about 80mm, which is quite constrained and will be limiting. It would make your working distance for portratis around 3m to 4m which in an open space would be workable but for kids indoors it will be a struggle for anything other than head and shoulders.

There is a decent second hand camera shop in Manchester, I think it’s a division of London Camera Exchange but I believe it’s a shop that’s been there donkeys years.

Happy to help with any other questions you might have.

Cheers. Some bits for me to investigate further there. Focal length etc.

Hopefully be able to get out soon and just start playing with what I have.

Plenty more q’s will surely follow!

As above, you don’t need IS for that focal length range.

I would go for good quality used 50mm f1.4 in preference to new f1.8; 40mm f2.8 pancake is worth considering.

London Camera Exchange, Wex and Dale Photographic are good sources for quality used lenses.

Stick with the lens you have until you feel that it’s holding you back.

I’d leave the prime lenses until you know what kind of photography you are into,m. And as Geetee says, the 50mm 1.8 is more like 80mm on your camera. The general love for them comes from using them on full frame bodies.

My advice would be to spend some money on a photo processing program such as Lightroom. This will make a far bigger difference to your photos than any lens, and it will help you to learn about your photos, photography and any eventual shortcomings in your equipment.

The ‘nifty fifty’ is a tremendous bit of kit for the money.  But,

Stick with the lens you have until you feel that it’s holding you back.

… is the crux here.  When you need new glass you’ll know it.

Does the 1100D kit lens really not come with IS?  It’s been standard issue on the EOSes since the late Jurassic.

<span style=”color: #444444; font-size: 16px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; background-color: #eeeeee;”>My advice would be to spend some money on a photo processing program such as Lightroom. This will make a far bigger difference to your photos than any lens, and it will help you to learn about your photos, photography and any eventual shortcomings in your equipment.</span>

Need to sort a computer back out first. Stuck with the iPad only at the minute, but something I will look into.

<span style=”color: #444444; font-size: 16px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;”>Does the 1100D kit lens really not come with IS?  </span>

As far as I can tell on this lens. The pictures I’ve seen of the newer lens have a switch on the lens body below the af/mf toggle whereas my lens hasn’t. Unless it’s built in and is un  switchable.

I’ve got a 50mm 1.8 for my Nikon & while it is a very good lens, I find it a bit restrictive for a lot of situations.

It’s useless indoors when taking family shots, because it’s far too ‘zoomy’

I would stick with what you have & replace it when you work out what the limitations of it are.

My Nikon D80 came with an 18-135 zoom, which for me covers most bases for general photography. If I was to replace it, I’d probably look for something faster & would happily sacrifice a bit of the telephoto end; so perhaps something like a 18-70 2.8.

IS can be pretty useful. My 70-300 lens has it and the difference between having it on & off is very pronounced; particularly when the light levels fall.

But, on shorter lenses, it’s usefulness is reduced.

The camera is a cropped sensor model – by a factor of 1.62 if you want to calculate other lens equivalents – so the ‘get a 50mm’ advice needs to be adjusted to ‘get a 28 or 35mm’ (x 1.62 = 45mm or 56mm), so roughly the same field of view as a 50mm on a full-frame sensor.

Now that’s something I need to get my head around. Why it needs consideration and pros and cons of going one way or another.

A lot to learn, but first I need to get out there.

As above, you don’t need (or want to) upgrade your lens to get IS….

IS is only helpful if you are taking photos of things that are not moving, and you want slow(ish) shutter speeds…

Taking photos of things like, people, biking etc etc it has virtually no value, especially on the zoom range of your  kit lens.

learn about; ISO, Shutter speed, aperture, and their effects on each other, and the images you get….

Then go out and take a lot of photos, experimenting with the far ends of each of their range….

Then, decide, what, if anything is limiting you….

e.g. you always wish you had more zoom, or a wider angle, your frequently shooting low light and have to use the aperture wide open, and still need a slower shutter speed than you would like… etc etc..

Then, and only then get a lens that addresses these issues…

I have a few very expensive lenses, and only the 100-400 that I have has IS.

Agree with everything above from fitnessischeating.

I’d add to stop reading too much about gear on online forums. You can always tell someone who’s read into forums too much when they ask if they should buy a 50mm f1.8, particularly on a crop sensor.

Lol. I’ve read very little. It’s what someone told me. I’ve no idea about crop sensors etc. It was just mentioned that it was a nice lens for out as about.

I intend to learn the camera and techniques the question was more would the lens I have be a hindering factor beyond skill/ability.

I wouldn’t bother buying any more lenses for your Canon as you’re not really too invested in with that body being worth £50-70, about £100 with the kit lens (unless you’re happy just buying 2nd hand ones and selling them later once you decide what you like).

I would just use it as it is until you get a feel for what you like and then possibly buy a better camera from another manufacturer as Canon are sadly falling way behind across most sectors of the market. So I’d personally avoid getting invested in lots of (admittedly quite reasonably priced) lenses unless they relase a great new body/sensor.

<span style=”display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: #444444; font-family: ‘Helvetica Neue’,’Helvetica’,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 14.4px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;”>I intend to learn the camera and techniques the question was more would the lens I have be a hindering factor beyond skill/ability</span>

Not at all – take a look at the Flikr galleries for that lens, I’m sure there will be hundereds of great shots to be inspired by.

I have no idea whether it’ll work for you, but rather than spend money on a so, so zoom, I’d look at a prime lens. The two I used most with an EOS100D – same crop sensor – are the Canon EF-S 24mm pancake lens, which is tiny, but super sharp and only around £100 new. It has a similar sort of feel to normal eye view.

Also have the 60mm EF-S macro, which is good for portrait stuff and, erm, macro. But the lens I use all the time is the 24mm one, not least because combined with a really compact body, it means I actually carry the camera on days when I wouldn’t bother with a bigger lens/body combo.

Not being able to zoom the lens in and out arguably makes you think a bit harder about what you’re doing and the sharpness relative to a budget zoom in particular, is impressive.

But it all depends on what you’re trying to do.

Not being able to zoom the lens in and out arguably makes you think a bit harder about what you’re doing and the sharpness relative to a budget zoom in particular, is impressive.

+1

Put the camera in iso 200, prime lense (cannon 50mm), aperture priority with spot metering, and go take some pics. By artificially restricting yourself like that you learn what you can control and then can introduce the other variables (ISO, ND filters, exposure compensation/shutter speed)

Personally I still prefer film for stills and portraits, not because it’s higher quality (it’s different not better), but because I have to sit there and figure out how to take the picture just right because you have to get it right first time (because the second time could be weeks away).

Digital is better for anything out of your control, e.g. kids, animals, moving objects, just hold the shutter down and one photo in 100 will be what you expected.

Cheers everyone. Appreciate the input.

I have collected a number of canon lens over the years (niffty fifty, 135mm, 18-55 etc), but the one I enjoy using the most is the EF-S 10-18mm IS STM. This is a surprisingly versatile lens, which i use both indoors to take shots of groups of people (e.g. birthday parties), plus outdoor to get the great outdoors scenery type shots. The super wide angle allows gives a pleasing photo and costs about £200.

Take pictures. Once you know what you want to do, you’ll know whether or not you want another lens. Or camera. But what you’ve got is fine.

Take a look at Darktable, Digikam and Glimp running on Linux, say Ubuntu. All free and high quality alternatives to Lightroom and Photoshop.

Don’t forget, whatever you choose to buy, don’t call it a lens. You’ll never be a good photographer, sorry ‘tog’, until you learn to call it “glass”. Or you could just go out and take loads of pictures until the “glass” is the weakest link in the whole business (it probably won’t ever be).

Damn it. Have I made a mistake already, the shame!

I’ll go figure out my glass then!

I’m quite comfortable with using my feet to zoom. I was only using my phone these days so no other option.

I’ll go figure out my glass then!

I think Nico was being sarcastic, as perhaps were you. Only ****puffins use the term ‘glass’, usually the same ones who also wet themselves over the glass’s bokeh.

I think Nico was being sarcastic, as perhaps were you. Only ****puffins use the term ‘glass’, usually the same ones who also wet themselves over the glass’s bokeh.

Indeed I was and yes I assumed Nico was too.

Now bokeh, I know that term, not a total lost cause!

Any alternatives to Lightroom that isn’t subscription based for the full package? Is it likely I’ll even need the full package?

Only have the iPad at present so limited. Have Snapseed which appears pretty feature rich but in comparison to Lightroom I have no idea.

As with all hobbies the marketing is very clever.

The 18-55 will be great for landscapes. There are only 2 ways that the lens will hold you back

1. Image size. A better lens might allow larger prints. In Dpreview people will always bang on about this lens isn’t sharp enough. A tiny % mean I can’t print at the size I want from this lens. The rest mean when I zoom into 100% it’s not quite as clear as I hoped

2. Zoom range. It might be nice to go wider or longer. Personally I’d go with a wider range zoom in one lens if you are generally walking about. Something like the 17-85. But I don’t really know Canon lenses

For portraits it’s nice to have a faster lens for shallow depth of field this is where the nifty 50 comes in

I did 6 years with just the Nikon 18-70 3.5-4.5. I really enjoyed and taking the pictures and was happy with the results. I was amazed just how versatile it was. But I did stitch to go wider

Of my top 50? or so flickr photos only number 9 “Houghton House Shadows” wasn’t taken with this lens

Any alternatives to Lightroom that isn’t subscription based for the full package? Is it likely I’ll even need the full package?

You know for the moment you could just shoot in JPEG and not worry about post processing. Yes you choke off a lot of image quality shooting JPEG but a good photograph is always still a good photograph irrespective of what made it.

I don’t know how easy or effective post processing on an iPad is to be honest. If it’s an iPad pro and you have an Apple pencil then it might work quite well. I haven’t tried it myself as I use Capture One which isn’t available on the iPad althouygh LightRoom is.

Oh yeah. I’m less worried about processing and more about getting out and comfortable with the camera and the settings.

One thing I wonder, and I know that the point of these things is the extra control, but when in situations where you haven’t really the time to set everything up, do you ‘cheat’ and go auto or one of the defined modes such as ‘sport’?

Say im in the park with my kids and they are all over. Is there too many little variables going on to be fully manual and still get the shot? Do you risk losing the moment because the setup was off?

Also, how important do people find the lens hood? I haven’t got one and they aren’t exactly expensive, but do you generally use them?

Not using fully manual is not cheating at all, why do you think it would be?

Kids in the park, outdoors in daylight just use auto, P or whatever – it is capturing the shot in all the activity that is key.

I don’t personally see it as cheating. Certainly right now I’m sure the camera can work out what’s ‘right’ far quicker than I can. It was maybe a bad choice of word but more a case of interest in what those that are experienced do in such situations.

Where I have the time to play I will. For everything else I’ll keep the stabilisers on for now!

Active kids in a park, need to keep shutter speed high so can either use aperture priority and have the biggest aperture or shutter priority and have a decent shutter speed or just use P and change it to get a decent shutter speed.

In good daylight those are easily possible without having to go high on ISO.

Slightly different approach to all of the above: instead of the usual middle aged dad photographer approach learning all the tech and buying all the toys, why not spend a little on a photography evening course at your local college and learn how to actually ‘take’ a photo?

They’ll cover all the aspects like lighting, planning, framing a shot etc and allow you to really get the best results.

*I keep meaning to do this as my professional photographer daughter keeps nagging me

I rarely use fully manual unless I know the camera will get it wrong (like using off camera flash at night for photographing foxes and badgers).

I normally use aperture priority, (eg. open to blur the background, stopped down for landscape or when you want most stuff in focus) set the iso so as to get an acceptable shutter speed for the situation and let the camera sort out the exact shutter speed.

Or if you needed a particular shutter speed to freeze the action then use shutter priority and let the camera sort out the aperture. Lots of people use auto iso but I have never got on with it.

I think this is what most people use when not on P or full auto, rather than manually setting all 3 values.

Also, how important do people find the lens hood?

They’re vital for some lenses, but they usually come with one. The hood stops light entering the lens at an angle where it can reflect off the barrel of the lens, causing flare and haze, and softening the focus and contrast. Of course, shoot any lens in the direction of a light source and you’ll usually get all of the above, so a hood will/might somewhat increase the scope of where and when you can shoot. Bear in mind that all of those effects are sometimes desirable – character and all that.

One thing I wonder, and I know that the point of these things is the extra control, but when in situations where you haven’t really the time to set everything up, do you ‘cheat’ and go auto or one of the defined modes such as ‘sport’?

These are good questions though there are a few things wrapped up together here. It might help to briefly highlight the options you have for automation.

The first is obviously auto focus. I don’t use AF myself  as the way I like to work means that manual focus is either more accurate and reliable or faster (it’s never both though). But if you’re a beginner or if you’re photographing kids of course, AF is the most useful thing you can have as the little monkeys never stay still! I get around that in other ways including things like lots of practise and something called hyperfocal or zone focusing, but you don’t need to worry about that!

The second levels of automation are your exposure modes; P (programme), A (Aperture), S (Shutter) and M (Manual). The purists and the masters all swear by shooting fully manual but even this isn’t quite what it used to be. Now with cameras that can expose with high ISO gain, you can set the aperture and shutter speed manually and let the camera manage the exposure by varying the ISO gain. That can be quite useful but it’s not really ‘manual’ as you’re not calculating the exposure directly. But certainly doing that is a very rewarding way to shoot and it’s a good way to really learn about how to photograph.

Most people move from being a beginner to being an intermediate by switching from shooting in P (full auto point and shoot) to A (aperture priority where you set the aperture yourself and you let the camera take care of shutter speed and ISO gain). The aperture has the most obvious effect on the look of the image through depth of field, which is why it’s usually the first step to taking more control over your camera and thus the end result. It’s also made easier by being able to set minimum and maximum limits with things like shutter speed and ISO gain. Most cameras will let you specify a minimum shutter speed, for example one or two over the focal length or a set time like 1/125 and a maximum ISO gain like 6400.

I shoot about 80% of the time in A and the rest in fully manual, where I use a light meter to calculate the exposure and the ISO gain I need to make it all work.

What’s nice about this way of working is that it slows you down and makes you really think about what you’re photographing and why and therefore how best to execute that. The worst thing in the world is to just hold the shutter down and hope you get the shot. Take fewer photographs but make more of them count is the best way to just get better. Of course, it’s also useful to ask what it is you want to shoot. It sounds like you want to document and record your growing family and that’s a fine thing to select as you interest. If you’re interested, there are a few photographers who focus on just this topic in a way that elevates the result to fine art, heck a few have even ended up as finalists in the Taylor Wessing competition (which is to photography as the Turner Prize – no relation – is to painting). Have a look at the following:

• Colin Pantall – http://colinpantall.com/his focus is on his growing daughter, wonderful work, very sensitive and very engaging. It shows how fine art crosses many boundaries

• Sian Davey – http://www.siandavey.com/again wonderfully sensitive and inspiring work. Her themes are very much engaged with childhood and developing identity. She was a finalist in the Taylor Wessing prize in 2015 with a portrait of her daughter.

• Sophie Harris-Taylor – http://www.sophieharristaylor.com/filter/Projects/Sistersshe has recently had a book commissioned called ‘Sisters’, which is fabulous.

• Sally Mann – http://sallymann.com/selected-works/family-picturesSally’s work is world renowned (and has been controversial because of the puritanical nature of American culture) and is utterly sublime. Her work on her family is perhaps her most well known and is just so gorgeous to look at; sensitive, poignant and beautiful. It’s all shot with a huge large format film camera, the old fashioned style where the photographer hides under a blanket at the sharp end to take the image and the film plates are fully eight by ten inches! This is how you get that pristine clarity and resolution (digital doesn’t even get close at any price point) so don’t expect to be able to replicate that look but the themes are what are important here.

Also, how important do people find the lens hood? I haven’t got one and they aren’t exactly expensive, but do you generally use them?

A lens hood can be good for protection. ie in case you bash the lens into something, could stop it getting damaged/scratched.
Also helps to keep rain off the front of the lens.

I usually have a lens hood on when out and about. Most of my lens included them as standard.

Cheers all. Plenty more useful pointers. Will definitely start with the priority modes and move from there.

Couple of days of work next week so in between the million and one other things that will no doubt suddenly need doing I’ll hopefully get out for a play and also actually be at home the same time that the kids are actually still awake. Shifts, pain in the bum!

Had a look at those links too geetee1972. Nice and more candid than I expected. Not feeling the last one but then that’s the thing with art. It speaks to us all differently.

Thanks for all the help. I’ll be back for more I’m sure!