BTR Pinner or Cotic Rocket?

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  • BTR Pinner or Cotic Rocket?
  • amedias
    Member

    That BTR Pinner I mean seriously a frame for £2500 made of cheapo steel, gotta be mad to buy that

    The raw materials cost is a tiny fraction of the total, have you ever looked at how much CF actually costs for just the materials?

    It’s all in the labour and R+D, ~2K is the same as you’d pay for any custom built full suss frame with a CCDB whatever the material.

    Bang on, hence why thay only have one deposit for a frame on kickstarter (even at the “special kickstarter bargain” price of £2200) and the campaign failed.

    Didn’t it hit about 6.5k at the end? Must have been at least a few deposits there, if they had let it run longer and pitched at 2k or less then it might have had more luck, perhaps offering it with a cheaper shock instead of the CCDB might have kept the cost down too…

    Anyone else been keeping an eye on the Swarf news, the Curves are looking really swish 🙂

    Not sure what the final cost of the Curve is going to be but it’s funny how >2.5 K for a Santa Cruz/Spesh/etc. which is mass produced and is not custom at all and nobody bats an eyelid, but proper custom low volume frames and suddenly people think it’s not worth it, is it a big company vs little thing?

    Intrigued to know more about what’s going on with the Cotic Rocket/BM story though!

    wrecker
    Member

    Didn’t it hit about 6.5k at the end? Must have been at least a few deposits there, if they had let it run longer and pitched at 2k or less then it might have had more luck, perhaps offering it with a cheaper shock instead of the CCDB might have kept the cost down too…

    No mate, only one of the available deposit or BIN options was purchased.

    To be fair £2.5k for full custom individual geometry isn’t bad, even if it is steel. For a standard steel frame (even with a little bit of carbone) £2.5k is ridiculous.

    amedias
    Member

    No mate, only one of the available deposit or BIN options was purchased

    So it was, just had a look, shame, lots of backing on the smaller pledges though.

    Pretty sure both the BTR and Swarf frames are available with full custom geometry if that’s what you want.

    Anyway, anyone got more info news on the MB/Cotic thing?
    Was hoping to see some UK built Rockets appearing by now…

    Premier Icon doom_mountain
    Subscriber

    I’m also intrigued, I was looking forward to the new Rocket and really excited at the what Cy was doing…
    I really hope it all ends well.

    ajantom
    Member

    Well if you look at mickmcd’s flickr account https://www.flickr.com/photos/compositepro/14600920078 there is a picture of a Rocket frame saying that this is the only one that will be built there. Leads one to assume that they’re no longer working together.
    Having a look at all the other pictures it looks like a lot of work and time had been put in too.

    wrecker
    Member

    Just caught this thread from a while back;
    http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/cotic-rocket-to-be-uk-made

    Si’s comments;

    Today we are announcing the from now on all Cotic full suspension frame production is happening in the UK, built at a new production facility I have co-founded. This factory is Bicycle Manufacturing Limited, or BML for short. Does what it says on the tin!
    About 2 years ago I met Mike McDermid, who is my partner in BML and the manufacturing brains of the operation.We began working on this project after it became clear to Mike that using the latest automated techniques and equipment combined with high skilled hand made production, it would be possible to be competitive on price with Far Eastern supply on high end products with a flexible, high quality UK operation.

    Mikes comments;

    Bicycle manufacturing does not seem to be flavour of the month anymore, whilst its not officially gone pop yet its legs are wobbling

    However I’m sure the pat on the back for having a go will fall on cy turners shoulders and the blame failure on mine and the saviour of it on another builders shoulders who he would pay for actually doing work

    Did Cy co-found and establish BML only to let it die? What happened to all of the expensive equipment? Is it being sold off?

    mickmcd
    Member

    Sounds like Cy Turner has gone elsewhere and he won’t pay Mike?

    no nothing like that at all completely the opposite hes put a lot of time and money in ,in personal terms however for 18 months work one of my p60s looks like a monthly pay check for some so yes you have to draw a line somewhere

    The UK made Rockets will still be happening from the conversation I just had ONLY THEY WILL BE MADE BY HAND the first one was assembled yesterday it went together with the precision of a swiss watch

    amedias
    Member

    precision of a swiss watch

    bah! we don’t want any of that Swiss nonsense, we want good old fashioned British precision, that’s the whole point! 🙂

    Glad to hear they will still be being made, fingers crossed it works out well for all involved.

    Premier Icon edd
    Subscriber

    fingers crossed it works out well for all involved.

    Agreed

    Premier Icon proutster
    Subscriber

    Rick Draper
    So are these Cotic Rockets still been made in the UK by bike manufacturing?

    Please tell me you’re not thinking of another new bike?????

    Premier Icon ratherbeintobago
    Subscriber

    Bicycle manufacturing does not seem to be flavour of the month anymore, whilst its not officially gone pop yet its legs are wobbling

    There does seem to have been one setback after another…

    Premier Icon ratherbeintobago
    Subscriber

    .

    Now, that’s cryptic.

    mickmcd
    Member

    No not really I’ve spat my dummy out and I’ve nowt else to say

    The flikr page has links to the parts we make for BTR I’m not biased towards any company and after a further chat today another project to add stability to the company will be done in carbon on something which will be brought bang into the 21st century

    I really hope this all works out well for BML, Cotic and anyone else involved. We’ve spent the past few weeks relocating our factory and right now we’re surrounded by piles of machinery, stock and building materials as we set up factory number four. It’s bloody hard making money by making things in the UK but I believe it’s the right thing to do and that in the longterm it will prove a good thing financially.

    Premier Icon Rick Draper
    Subscriber

    Please tell me you’re not thinking of another new bike?????

    Nar just intrigued by the UK built Rocket.

    Premier Icon nuke
    Subscriber

    Liking the geometry and the ability to run 26 or 27.5 in both 130 and 150 configurations on that Curve. Potential Hemlock replacement there. Bet its months and months away though 🙁 Wonder how the Bird Aeris is doing 😕

    Premier Icon benpinnick
    Subscriber

    Pleased to say the Aeris is doing just fine! A few last minute tweaks now resolved (stuff like moving cable mounts) all sorted now, and the full manufacturing pack has been shipped to the fabricator for the first production run. We’re currently planning on cutting enough parts for 250 frames, but welding up only 100 on the first run, but that could be expanded if demand is there. With 5 sizes, 5 colours, 5 shock options, 6 fork options and 4 groupsets, with all our normal custom stuff too, there’s an Aeris for everyone. Pre-sales go live around the 23rd of this month. FYI Framesets will start at £850, and all bikes & frames will ship early 2015.

    ska-49
    Member

    [url=https://flic.kr/p/oSvJRn]WP_20140807_001[/url] by mike mcdermid, on Flickr
    [url=https://flic.kr/p/ovhNFc]purple ronnie[/url] by mike mcdermid, on Flickr

    Just spotted these photos.. Look’s like there’s still hope! Personally liking the sounds of the Aeris. If the Rocket goes 650b or 29” I might be interested.

    The photos on mickmcds flickr are really good! Looks like some high quality manufacturing. I want to see more. I would happily spend a few more £££ for nice UK kit like this. A nice change from Hope, who seem to have dominated the UK manufacturing market.

    mickmcd
    Member

    The cotic connection is gone from BML the company is no longer manufacturing for cotic it is a shame as Cy had waited a fair while to pull all this together,and the company now has those procedures in place for other manufacturers it is still a going concern we are building tooling for bicycle framebuilders and they are envious of the people who have obtained them also we started work this week on a sub 600g gearbox which has worked in the past it has been proven and was one of the reasons for making and testing the ceramic chainrings it was shelved, there are also carbon and titanium frames being produced all made in the Uk

    The thing that is keeping us busy however is F1 machining work and machining and designing parts for Paris dakar and rally .

    Premier Icon soundninjauk
    Subscriber

    Goodness. I tested a Rocket way back in August 2013 and loved it, and was told they would have them by the end of September. One delay after another, then I injured my knee which took me off the mtb for a while, and over a year later you still can’t buy one. It’s a shame because I thought it was a lovely bike.

    Anyway, picking up a Whyte G150S on Saturday…

    mickmcd
    Member

    There’s a lot more went on than people know BML was a seperste company not a pet project

    Hello,

    I have just read the new “11/12/14 – The Rocket Situation” and I am disappointed with the fact that Cotic gives up to build a 100 % made in Great Britain bike.

    This bike stands out and I appreciate all the efforts made by some manufacturers to build differents bike. All the bikes are nowadays alike (same Suppliers in Taiwain, same suspensions, brake…).
    In my opinion steel is a very good option for bike frames. Ally is not much lighter, but very convenient for the mass production in the taiwan factory…

    There is the real innovation with a bike TS steel and the good look.

    For the moment one of rare all suspended steel is the french Caminade.

    Steel Frame
    27?5 or 26? full suspension (enduro or all mountain use)
    lifetime guarantee
    easily recyclable materials and made to last

    Some reading on the website http://caminade.eu/bikes/one4all-bike/?lang=en
    do you know it ?
    I hope i do not divert the post ! Just show a bike which goes out of the ordinary and I do not work for this company.

    Have a nice day !

    ajantom
    Member

    Hmmm, that French bike above….Shock placement would not really suit UK (or even French) weather.
    And it may be an optical illusion, but the chainstays look looooong.

    @ajantom : theres also mud in France even in Provence.. but I believe you’ll have to search it first.
    https://www.facebook.com/caminadebikes/photos/a.367763429970353.86856.334126190000744/763522077061151/?type=1&theater
    The bike is sold with a small mud guard to protect the shock and was long tested in winter conditions.
    No problem.

    v666ern
    Member

    looks like a similar placement to the cube stereo’s from 2010…its not horrendous, but its also not great. BPW in the mud is not the place for that

    A photography which shows the mud guard :

    http://caminade.eu/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/shootingmars2k14-9-1030×643.jpg

    The shock is so placed on all the all-terrain motorcycles for more than 20 years (except yamaha cantilever 🙂 )
    http://www2.yamaha-motor.fr/actu/IMG/jpg/05_yz125_img_ar.jpg
    And the companies put a mud guard.

    The most important is the functioning of the suspension… no ?

    scruff
    Member

    Anyone else reading cyrilleparis’s posts with a French accent? 🙂

    M6TTF
    Member

    that french thing is mingin

    wrecker
    Member

    Anyone else reading cyrilleparis’s posts with a French accent?

    I have him speaking like the policeman from Allo allo 😀

    Don’t worry, french riders have been speaking about Cotic since 2007 😉
    http://forum.velovert.com/topic/94327-cotic-lalternative-europeenne/page__hl__cotic
    So there are more people speaking of english bikes in France than people speaking of french bikes in Great Britain 😉
    and I’ll receive no sales bonus !!

    ska-49
    Member

    I would like that if it didn’t have that hideous front triangle. It needs a normal straight tubed front triangle.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    cyrilleparis – Member

    I have just read the new “11/12/14 – The Rocket Situation” and I am disappointed with the fact that Cotic gives up to build a 100 % made in Great Britain bike.

    According to the update, they’ve not yet given up on UK made bikes- they’ve abandoned the 26 inch Rocket but still looking at UK building for whatever else they do, 650b or 29.

    I can see why they’ve doen that with the top tube but it’s not great for standover height and bothers me aesthetically. Chainstays are on the longer side for a 27.5 and even more so for a 26. Interesting suspension design but I do prefer bikes with the shock kept well away from the tyre and drivetrain filth.

    v666ern
    Member

    The shock is so placed on all the all-terrain motorcycles for more than 20 years (except yamaha cantilever

    Yes but arent those mainly coil shocks 😕

Viewing 39 posts - 81 through 119 (of 119 total)

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