Two undered 8)

I really can’t understand anybody riding it at a weekend! I had absolutely no idea it would be full of 3 Peaks charity strollers.

If Snowdon can have a voluntary ban, then why can’t Ben Nevis?

Edit: just remembered, when I walked the Yorkshire 3 Peaks, there were mtb’ers coming down those without helmets and protection. Very busy trails too.

But hardly seems that they set out with an intention to harm or offend

Barnes [ their leader – bet he is lurking] was the ultimate big Hitter on here hence the debate. It was noted many times on the forum and he was utterly unrepentent about his affects on the countryside or how it impacted on the wider MTB community hence the reactions

JY – that may well be the case historically but is there any evidence of that on the video?

Interesting link to the case for the defence above (for both sides).

Thank goodness they were wearing helmets!! 😉

“Would it be wrong to say that the code is written with everyone in mind, including the inexperienced who need stricter rules. Is it possible that an experienced rider can pass walkers without dismounting or endangering them? “

This is the same argument as “speed limits and other moderately hard-to-enforce laws such as not using phones or eating pasties shouldn’t apply to me because I’m an experienced driver”. As a cyclist on the road I shouldn’t be expected to jump onto the pavement if an “experienced” driver accidentally spills coffee in his lap and loses control; nor as a walker should I be expected to take evasive action if an “experienced” cyclist accidentally clips a pedal on a rock. Drivers are expected to eliminate the risk of coffee/pasties/phones leading to an incident that harms others and it seems reasonable to expect cyclists to adopt a similar approach by not barging through on sections where control is difficult and walkers are forced into exposed positions. The code is written “with everyone in mind” precisely because it should apply to everyone, including the idiots who think they’re above it. The idea that “the inexperienced need stricter rules” seems bizarre, as if once you’d held your driving licence for five years you’d be allowed to drive everywhere with main beam on and a can of lager in your hand.

This is the same argument as “speed limits and other moderately hard-to-enforce laws such as not using phones or eating pasties shouldn’t apply to me because I’m an experienced driver”

True, except the law isn’t full of ifs, buts and maybes. Even though you can worm your way out using exceptional circumstances. 😉

But no body did get hurt in that video right?

“But no body did get hurt in that video right? “

Not really a pertinent criterion, though, is it? Again, a bit like justifying drink driving by saying you managed to get home without crashing into anything.

@16:15 that’s great, you could get so much speed up there if there wasn’t so many people in the way

let’s hope the walkers haven’t booby trapped the trails for the next lot of MTB’ers to descend in a more appropriately timed ride

paulrockliffe – Member
TJ, firstly, I’m not agreeing with riding down the Ben on a Bank Holiday and I don’t necessarily agree that all of that riding was responsible, but it’s worth bearing in mind that the guidance falls down as soon as a walker gives way to a cyclist.

In my experience of similar trails in the Lakes a majority of walkers will see you coming some way off and move off the trails before you would normally give way. In those circumstances it makes sense to carry on and effectively not give way. Though your guidance says you should stop and wait for the walkers to start walking again and pass you.

Incidentally, this seems to happen because most walkers aren’t bothered by the few bikes they see, they recognise that it’s easier all-round for them to move than for the cyclist to be interrupted and often they just want to watch someone doing something that they wouldn’t have considered doing themselves. I have had one incidence (top of Great Gable) where I was heckled by a walker for dabbing. Generally people are genuinely interested in what I’m doing and in no way offended, even if they have moved out of my way. If they don’t move, I’ll either keep away from them, or stop, as the trail dictates.

A lot of the passes in that video seemed to be common-sense walker moves out of the way affairs, though others were a lot more debatable.

That is probably the most balanced view of all of this that I’ve read.

One thing no one has mentioned is that the ‘gung ho’ video of lads riding down the Ben has been edited, and what hasn’t been seen are the sections of mild riding, perhaps even dismounting to give way to walkers… 😯 But don’t let this get in the way of a good flaming.

Having spoken to those involved, I think they were a little naive not to have expected the crowds, which doubtless somewhat spoiled their enjoyment of the downhill, but I know them all to be unfailingly gentle, considerate people whom I trust to tell the truth, so when they say the walkers were overwhelmingly supportive I believe them, and since it’s the impression made upon those folk which seems to trouble people on here most, I conclude it’s really a matter of “nothing to see here”

You’re right that I’m contemptuous of the nay-sayers on this forum but that doesn’t reflect my attitude to fellow trail users, to whom I’m unfailingly polite, and I often take time as I bimble along cautiously at the back of the pack to check with the walkers I meet that they haven’t been inconvenienced by the other riders.

I reiterate that the Bog Trotters are not ‘mine’ – I just happen to be one of them and for the most part they pay very little attention to anything I say and make their minds up for themselves 🙂

double post indicating that the forum bug I pointed out 2 years ago still isn’t fixed 🙂 If you post at the last slot on a page (40, 50?), it appears not to have worked and it’s some while before it pops up on a new page…

and what hasn’t been seen are the sections of mild riding, perhaps even dismounting to give way to walkers

Or…just as likely, but ignored by you…bits where they rode with even less regard for walkers?

i have to agree that on a bank holiday its a bit naughty but perfectly legal.. some of the edges of the path have some nasty falls too tight for bike and walker. motor bikes and even landrovers have been up there so why not cycles

i have rode down ben nevis. i did it in May when it was quiet. i had no negativity from anybody. people were amazed and impressed it was possible..
here is my video.

^ Snappy title

There’s probably at least 3 or 4 people scrutinising it as I type.

Good post Simon. Probably wont stop cyber bullies spouting off in ignorance though!!

Probably wont stop cyber bullies spouting off

I hardly think it bullying, it’s more that they demonstrate how vacuous they are for our entertainment :o)

A few points to concider:
1 They started up at 5.30 am, it’s quite possible they started when it was quiet and saw few people on the way up to worry about, only going against the flow coming down realising the amount of people coming the other way.
2 Comparing it to Snowdon, in the last three years I have took/been with roughly 45 riders on the descent down Rangers, all riding as fast as they can get down and all the walkers that have ‘stepped aside’ have to a one been polite and friendly, took pictures, video’d us. Never had a bad word said. On BT video all bar two were the same… A few people critising BT on this thread were among them…

IMO, in hindsite prob not the best day to do it but after arriving at the top I would attempt to ride back down and I think most bikers would. No one got hurt, all bar two walkers didn’t seem that bothered… seems a lot of fuss about ‘what if’s’. And it’s still on my tick list.

T

And it’s still on my tick list.

I prefer natural trails myself.

So do I, and I still don’t know what a natural trail is, something made them all… but some things are there to be done and the Ben is one, purely because it’s the highest in England… ducks 🙂

purely because it’s the highest in England… ducks

What helmet for…..?
Parts of that track were just sooooooo manmade, a bit of tarmac and it’d have been sorted.

It’s ALL man made. Can you think of another animal that would go all the way to the top of a hill just to come down again?

Simon, no argument from me, it doesn’t look a fantastic descent but it is the highest hence the tick list…

Can you think of another animal that would go all the way to the top of a hill just to some down again?

Isn’t there a difference between climbing up a natural trail and climbing up a trail where rocks have been moved by man to make it more accessible/less dangerous then? I’m sure you knew what I meant though.

Hands up who reads the Daily Mail!

SFB how many kittens have you killed this week you evil evil man 😉

Won’t somebody ‘Think of the children’

I astounded that anyone has had the audacity to liken mountain biking on a busy path to drink driving, ffs get a bloody grip.

Thing is, there’s nothing wrong with drink driving if no one gets hurt…..

Watched the entire clip with baited breath expecting to see hoards of people diving out the way of a screaming herd of mountain-bikers.
Damn was I let down. What a beatup over nothing.
It looked a bit frustrating due to the people traffic but I don’t think the riders placed anybody in any real danger other than themselves.
I don’t mind a bit of mountain hiking from time to time, and stepping aside for 10 seconds to let a few bikers through is not a big deal really, whilst expecting them to stop and walk their bikes past me is a bit silly IMO.
Perhaps not being from this country I haven’t become so overprotective over trail access as many of you.
In Aus if I didn’t ride footpaths and illegal trails on crown land I wouldn’t ride at all but I digress.

Watched some of it, particularly the 15:50-1620, couple of passes looked a bit iffy, difficult to tell from the vid tho. Surely asking the what the walkers thought would be better. 2 complaints out of lots and lots of walkers suggest they weren’t riding heinously and TBH peterstuart (grough link) sounds like he’s bike hater anyway so can maybe discount that one as my mum riding her shopper down the highstreet would probably have him diving for cover (and then diving for the pen and paper to write a complaint to the council).

Bad time to do it yep sure but hindsight and all that.

I wonder if some of you dont not realise how steep, narrow and rough that path ism with big falls in places.

Our right to roam / right of access in Scotland is dependent on behaving in a reasonable and responsible manner. YOu do not have the right to ride like they were doing in that clip. You MUST give way when you are on a bike

Access rights extend to cycling. Cycling on hard surfaces, such as wide paths and tracks, causes few problems. On narrow routes, cycling may cause problems for other people, such as walkers and horse riders. If this occurs, dismount and walk until the path becomes suitable again. Do not endanger walkers and horse riders: give other users advance warning of your presence and give way to them on a narrow path. Take care not to alarm farm animals, horses and wildlife.

http://www.outdooraccess-scotland.com/out-and-about/recreation-activities/cycling/

PLease stick with this. Riding the Ben is acceptable at times when its not busy. Its probably one of a very few tracks in Scotland that get busy enough for this to be an issue.

Because there are so few occasions that you would find this or any other path as busy that it is reasonable to expect bikers to avoid the busy times

Our right to roam / right of access in Scotland is dependent on behaving in a reasonable and responsible manner.

actually it isn’t. Even if the law were to be changed (itself unlikely) Scotland is huge and largely empty (people were driven out by the English). Mostly there’s no one to stop you going where you want, same as in England and Wales (and Ireland from the bit I rode, the Wicklow Way)

I think Simon has laid out the situation quite well in his posts on here………how many more miles has this whinge-fest got left!?

simonfbarnes – Member

…..Mostly there’s no one to stop you going where you want

But plenty to tell you to stop going where you want 😆

how many more miles has this whinge-fest got left!?

Oh this is a ten pager, at least 😀

Yes, yes, this bickering is all very well, but have we raised the subject of whether they were all wearing helmets? You can’t really tell from the video

I believe there’s plenty of evidence that the walkers would have given them more space if they were not wearing helmets.:)

A Bogtrotter on Ben Nevis last week:
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7FThqI71aU&feature=youtu.be[/video]

I’m inclined to think that, having made a mistake of going up there when it was so unexpectedly (to them) busy, they would have been MORE disruptive if they had been pushing their bikes down as rider + bike are twice as wide!

Also it was illadvised of the walkers to turn up in such throngs which must have made the climb nightmarish on foot too, with faster walkers continually having to squeeze past and slower ones being always overtaken…

Simon – can I be the first to congratulate you on raising the bar on genius, satirical, comedy statements. That’s without a doubt. the best I’ve ever read 😆