There’s not much they can easily do about it, the route is the route and even with the number of Vans they run now – 8 at weekend, it’s a veritable ballet to get them up and down without blocking each other.

It does seem odd going downhill at points though. A circular route would avoid the passing problem, but that would mean either adding in a second lane or finding another way up/down.

some guy went to great lengths for compensation when his bike got damaged.
another persons brake lever gouged his forks .ever since then they drive like mrs daisy lol.

Strava times for the uplift route would seem to back that up, they really need to tarmac the road! Or a ski lift 😀

I was there a while back and the trailer snapped in half on the top bar on the way up, right next to my bike! Took me a second to realise why my bike wouldn’t release. The same trailer is still in use, albeit with a very large pair of plates welded on to fix it. Those buses and trailers lead a very hard life.

I aint done Gisburn since October just before the clocks went back, but I always dialled in a full day midweek, a quick loop of the lower of the 8 up to either hope or bottoms, bringing me to the cafe at around 11am to lunch time, and it’s always been open, another loop and drop in for a coffee before heading back to the van.
I couldn’t say about weekends as I never ride, but I’m sure it’s open as the dig team trail fairies speak of free brews from there

@ P-Jay
No worries and I promise not to take offence next time, unique writing style or not 😉

Sounds like you had a much worse experience than we did. Shane. I wonder if we were lucky or you were unlucky.

Might as well share my coaching story. Booked for me and my wife but it turned out my wife couldn’t make it so I tried to move it. They said it was possible but kept either not replying or being very vague. Just had to give up in the end and I went on my own.

No idea who my coach was supposed to be but he never turned up. After an hour or so waiting around a young lad was introduced as our replacement coach. He was ok. Obviously not very experienced or used to working with people. We did a few different skills. The cornering stuff was ok, we then did a bit on pumping rollers which was fine. Next, wheel lift stuff as a prelude to drops was very uninspiring with little feedback then the course sort of petered out which was a bit disappointing especially as we started late. One plus was I then had an uplift ticket for the rest of the day. It was actually a good format with coaching in the morning then a chance to practice some skills without expending too much energy. Overall it was an ok day, just a bit disappointing to pay for two courses and get about 2/3rds of one.

Just for balance I’ve been a few times now and bloody love it , all of it in fact
I have it’s worth mentioning on more than one occasion witnessed riders talking to the uplift drivers like they are morons and just generally treating them like shit
So it goes both ways I guess

Was going to go, but decided that the thought of booking in 6 weeks in advance and then waking up to lashing rain wouldn’t be a good day for us – so waited until the week before saw the weather was nice and went to snowdonia instead.

Looking at the bad press on here – rather surprised they don’t monitor it – I’m kind of glad i didn’t give them my money

go BMCC instead, uplift doesnt stop for lunch they are friendly and actually appreciate the business and the tracks are very good, i think we got around 15 runs.
After my last visit to bpw rude staff and a poor total of 8 runs and a lot of waiting around I wont ever go back again.

The issue I have with BPW’a uplift is slow. There always seems to be a queue at the bottom. Never an issue at Stiniog or Revo.

Last time I went you’d, after a massive wait you’d pass two buses pulled up next to each other chatting and in no rush to head back down. It took the edge off the day for us.

muddyground – Member 
Cafe at BPW … Worse even than Swinley.

Harsh! 😮 😀

All of those complaining about the speed of the uplift: are you on about the actual long drive up (which is long but dictated by where the forest road goes) or the long wait at the uplift queue that can happen?

It’s the waiting. The drive is the drive, nothing they can do about that.
Going as a day visitor is a complete waste of time, so unless you have the foresight to book 6 weeks in advance, it’s not worth the trip.
They started running them in pairs and that worked quite well (I got 14 runs in once!), but I suspect that they ended up doing lots of runs and so decided against it. Can’t think of any other reason.
I will say that every single BPW employee that I have dealt with has been nothing short of excellent, and the trails are amazing. I do love the place.
It’s a shame they can’t get their shit together when it comes to the uplift, as I said earlier I haven’t been in over a year and I have a gift vouvher which will run out mid-jan. Can’t do anything about it as it’s booked solid……

Last time I went you’d, after a massive wait you’d pass two buses pulled up next to each other chatting and in no rush to head back down.

That’s very common. It has to be throttling.

Last time I went you’d, after a massive wait you’d pass two buses pulled up next to each other chatting and in no rush to head back down.

That’s very common. It has to be throttling.

It’s not throttling, it’s a single track road with long stretches where you can’t pass so they run to a sort of timetable to keep it all flowing – they’re about every 15 mins and on full capacity days they’re running vans in twos so they’re taking up 144 bikes an hour. I spoke with one of the drivers a while back 8 vans is about the max they can run (which they do) without having too much over-lap and the whole thing grinding to a hault. To do any more they’d either have to build a circular uplift road which would be a massive undertaking or the thing that’s the ulitmate goal – a lift.

Looking at the bad press on here – rather surprised they don’t monitor it – I’m kind of glad i didn’t give them my money

I think they do, but possibly more on the mainstream social media rather than delving into forums. They’ve been particular hurt by comments about BPW being a faceless corporate entity, when to be fair, they really aren’t at their core. The founding directors are all very sound, very passionate and very dedicated people. They took a big personal financial risk going all in for this, and they’ve created something that at its core (the trails, the site) is totally brilliant. I don’t think anyone who knows wouldn’t applaud them.

But…that’s all well and good, but if you get grumpy service, or poor experience at coaching, or overly officious enforcement of rules, you must expect bad feedback. My feeling is that at its core the place is totally ace, but let down by perhaps poor training, some less than passionate people or even some total dead wood that shouldn’t be let near a customer facing environment, and they need binning.

Actually going tomorrow for the Manon Carpenter thing, but I’ll eat somewhere else because I’m sorry, I don’t care how cheap it is, I don’t want to run the risk of being served by someone with a face liked a slapped arse, who can’t even be bothered to muster up a please or thank you, they just extend their lardy hand outwards for the cold hard cash. If that makes me an SC riding, Audi driving pansy (I own neither of those forms of transport) then so be it. If they don’t like working in a café (I have, its hard but can be good fun if you have the right positive attitude) then they should cock off down the job centre.

so they’re taking up 144 bikes an hour

Which isn’t great really if they are full, that’s pretty much just one run an hour for everyone.

I love BPW. If you think of it as a DH venue like Antur then you may be disappointed. Treat it as a trail centre with techier bits (I’d say the reds would be graded black in most UK trail centres, etc) and even if you think the uplift takes a long time, where else will a rider of normal fitness be able to do 10,000′ of descending in a day?

The cafe staff cocking off down the jobcentre comments bring up some intriguing thoughts.

The jobcentre isn’t what it used to be, it’s not where you go to find work anymore, but where you face punishment for being out of work. They are forcing folk under threat of destitution to take any job, suitable for the individuals or not.
Another thought, what is the payscale for these workers? If it’s minimum wage combined with the jobcentre / benefits agency attitude, it could be a reason for the long faces. (I’ve a bit of experience with this, the mrs was a head cheese at Poundworld until dealing with what the jobcentre constantly sent over even when there were no vacancies on top of other corporate bulldust nearly sent her doolally.I encouraged her to quit and take a paycut, best move ever, we’re skint but happy )

It’s not throttling, it’s a single track road with long stretches where you can’t pass so they run to a sort of timetable to keep it all flowing

It doesn’t seem to be an issue at other places though.

Some leniency on cancellations and postponements due to other life activities , would go a long way without causing the place to become unprofitable.They could , with a little more training of staff , and awareness , that paying customers want and expect more than just good trails.This would turn a reasonably good place into somewhere first class.

This and andywoodhall’s comments sum it up for me, in basic form it’s tremendous, the trails are great the uplift is fine, but there’s a bunch of stuff that needs to be addressed, from a custom care perspective, that they could do to make it a “must tell everyone how great it is” destination.

edit: this has reminded me of a recent visit to a DR Martin store. My son has some boggo 8 hole DMs that had split at the heel, they were 18months old, we had the receipt but didn’t have high hopes with regards to a repair or some money off a new pair. In short we arrived, and the shop assistant (not the manager) looked at my son’s shoes, and said words to the effect of “that’s a bit shit, what size are you, I’ll get you some new ones”. No ifs buts, just replaced. We were all pretty gobsmacked, and I’ve told loads of folk about it since (The whole idea of the policy I assume) This is the lesson that BPW need to learn

It’s a shame they can’t get their shit together when it comes to the uplift, as I said earlier I haven’t been in over a year and I have a gift voucher which will run out mid-Jan. Can’t do anything about it as it’s booked solid……

That’s a bit shit, have you tried getting an extension before it runs out?

I have always had great experiences with the uplift at BPW.

I accept that I won’t get ten runs in as it is quite a long descent especially when running with a large group of mates (10 of us last time).

The drivers are friendly and conscientious, they ensure the bikes are secure and are paying attention in the van, they told off a young lad for sticking his head out the window which given how much the van bounces about is sound advice.

The Cafe isn’t great food but its acceptable, it would be good if there was more than one pay point for those not wanting to faff about ordering hot food.

The toilets/showers could do with being open later especially in the summer.

Overall I like the place and have always found it a pleasure to visit.

I have also been to:

Triscombe – landrover and a trailer with wheel holes cut in it!

FOD – great service, bit steep for parking on top of the uplift.

Cwm Carn – quick enough given the distance they have to travel.

UKBikepark – shut down now, lot more waiting and you got battered by the uplift.

BMCC – Good uplift, non existent services.

Swinley – terrible cafe, average facilities.

Is the grumpy tall guy still working in the shop area there?
Probably the most miserable, rudest employee i’ve ever met.

he was still there when i went in March….proper ray of sunshine he is

i get that they are within their rights to refuse but it is very poor customer relations to not honour the voucher as they already have the money for a service they havent provided.
i get the feeling from the times that ive been there that the staff in the bike shop and the main counter arent the best at dealing with customers. the ones in the restaurant are quite good and the drivers are a really good bunch

The thread title implies that a valid voucher wasn’t honoured, so is misleading. Probably not legally actionable, but I would venture to suggest it is a dishonourable way of describing the actual issue.

It’s a shame they can’t get their shit together when it comes to the uplift, as I said earlier I haven’t been in over a year and I have a gift vouvher which will run out mid-jan. Can’t do anything about it as it’s booked solid……

Surely you just have to redeem the voucher before mid-Jan, not actually attend an uplift day before then? A quick look on the website shows plenty of spaces running into mid-March so not sure what you mean.

BPW seems to be one of those “love-to-hate” places when it comes to internet moaning. Surely the fact that the uplift is always booked and the cafe is busy etc means that they’re doing something right to draw that many people in?

I’ve been going since not long after they opened and have had a few bad customer experiences mixed in with the good ones, but ever think that perhaps they’re real humans who might be having a bad day? Especially when having to deal with the entitled attitudes that come along with the SC-riding Audi-driving stereotypical bikers?

BPW seems to be one of those “love-to-hate” places when it comes to internet moaning.

I want to love it, and I’ve enjoyed the riding there. They do however need to make sure that the staff understand that the ongoing viability has very much got to do with people wanting to go back (its a motorway drive for most folk) They are consistently failing to do that, and customer service is a pretty easy and straightforward thing to do right.

but ever think that perhaps they’re real humans who might be having a bad day? Especially when having to deal with the entitled attitudes that come along with the SC-riding Audi-driving stereotypical bikers?

The world they live in is one of high customer expectation (for better or worse) that’s the world that EVERY business is in that deals with customers. I don’t care if the staff are having a bad day, they shouldn’t be bringing that to the job, they should be as a minimum courteous and professional, and while they get that right, as this thread shows, they don’t always.

Especially when having to deal with the entitled attitudes that come along with the SC-riding Audi-driving stereotypical bikers?

Ah, but the OP doesn’t have an Audi or a Santa Cruz. Sorry your stereotype has failed in his case.

Only been once but all seemed fine to me. Pleasant enough staff, decent enough food and a good days riding was had.

The cafe staff cocking off down the jobcentre comments bring up some intriguing thoughts.

The jobcentre isn’t what it used to be, it’s not where you go to find work anymore, but where you face punishment for being out of work. They are forcing folk under threat of destitution to take any job, suitable for the individuals or not.

Perhaps I was being too glib, you are quite correct (I also have dealings with the Job Centre), I meant in a general sense of finding a new direction suited to their skill sets. 🙂

I’d be surprised if the staff / management aren’t looking at this thread.

The feedback is a mixed bag really.

Any business that wants to succeed and maintain their customer base needs to listen to what the customers want.

Hopefully, they can address some of the easier issues quickly, I want to see them succeed being a local.
Status quo and not improving the satisfaction levels to us is a sure way to end up being unprofitable.

cba

I just think it’s a real shame that somewhere with so much potential that is getting it right or almost right in so many ways is being let down by some pretty fundamental basics.

I remember the first time I went, I wrote a FB post that went along the lines of if I woke up with Freida Pinto in the Seychelles with a copy of my winning lottery ticket on the wall it still wouldn’t top today as the best-day-ever day (to be honest, I was a bit hasty there 😉 )

But suffice to say, I loved the place and it could be fantastic but the way they treat their customers combined with the slow uplift (which admittedly is no easy fix) means I can’t see myself ever returning.

Like I say, a real shame.

Incidentally UK Bike Park’s venue reopened earlier this year as Okeford Hill Bike Park. They have a Landrover + trailer for uplift and run at quite a lot of weekends plus Wed evenings in the summer. And have had a couple of DH races there this year.

Maybe I have a rose-tinted view of BPW because I’m so bloody cheerful that I’m getting to spend a whole day just riding my bike downhill, so being grumpy at me would be like kicking a puppy? 😉

I was just looking back through Strava and I’ve been to BPW four times, the first time in autumn 2013, the last time ten days ago. I managed 9, 11, 10 and 10 uplifts. And none of those visits were when the days were long, so the uplift was curtailed early due to lack of light. I’m not slow but I’m not super fast (as my enduro racing confirmed!)

The Pilot – Member

I just think it’s a real shame that somewhere with so much potential

Potential to do what though? Fill up all spaces 3 months in advance?

My opinion of it is that it’s fine for an uplifted trail centre. The uplift being so far from the car park is a bit crap, the food was crap (hot stuff not being served hot and a massive queue were my over-whelming memories) but otherwise it’s just fine.

Better facilities than Innerleithen mind, although Inners does have the best trailers

Are people that sensitive that a great days riding can be spoilt by someone being miserable in a cafe 😀

Potential to give people a good day out without pissing them off!
Sure, they are fully booked up now but carry on as they are and they will run out of customers eventually.

the food was crap (hot stuff not being served hot and a massive queue were my over-whelming memories)

The trick with the cafe is to break for lunch on the penultimate uplift. Then there is no queue, you can have a rest & get sorted & be back at the uplift at the front to get the first one after lunch!

Even doing that I still always get at least 10 runs in. I find going full chat down the trails is pretty knackering, wouldn’t want to do any more runs really and run the risk of losing focus & doing something silly.

Often go on my own so chat to people in the queue or on the bus. Literally never spoken to anyone who had anything bad to say about the place, everyone just raves about how awesome it is (which it is!) Obviously just this place that attracts the moaners 🙂

I got 12 uplifts in the last time I went. I was solo so not waiting for people and had no mechanicals. I thought that was good, and there was a bit of waiting for van involved at times.

At Antur I’ve had 17 runs in a day, which is ridiculous efficiency. I also had a downlift as I’d punctured and not noticed until I took my bike off the trailer.

I’ve had good food at both, the welcome at Antur is very friendly.

The trick with any of these venues (FoD, Antur, BPW etc) is to go midweek…i know this is difficult for some people but it’s so much nicer, quieter and efficient….shift worker here so I always book midweek when I’m off.

In my opinion BPW can get away with poor customer service as the trails are so much fun, I personally think FoD is more natural and challenging but the runs are short and not clearly marked….it’s easy to go off piste and get lost coming down, no bad thing as the unridden stuff there is great too…..but BPW is longer and easier to navigate down and you can link up the trails, the riding is appealing enough that moody drivers, rude cafe staff and monosyllabic work shop staff are easy enough to forget and just enjoy the trails.

I understand the OPs frustration but it could have been sorted with much earlier communication…as I said early in this thread I’ve never had a problem with BPW (or the others) when moving bookings when I can’t make a particular date.
Maybe it’s because I ride midweek but they’ve always helped me out.

The uplift being so far from the car park is a bit crap,

eh ❓ seriously?

Not experienced workshop staff as never needed them, all other staff have been fine. We always jump in the front of the bus and have a natter/craic with the drivers, leave the cowabunga dudes to discuss strava in the back.

As above – break just before the last lunch uplift have lunch early then go sit in the lift queue ready for them starting again.

IIRC they cant tarmac the road as its a fire break (?)

Stiniog is awesome for uplift, always have a good day there

RustyNissanPrairie – Member

The uplift being so far from the car park is a bit crap,

eh seriously?[/quote]

Yup. Inners, Antur, etc you go to the top, smash your way down, grab a quick drink/snack, jump on bus, repeat. BPWs setup is rubbish compared to that.

I actually like the swooping, fast, short trail to the uplift at BPW, the slight uphill ride or push at the actual uplift start is a bit of a ballache but it wouldn’t put me of going there…in fact I think the trail with its humps, berms and drops is a nice warm up for the actual DH trails