Anybody gone back to square taper chainsets, are Hollowtech II rubbish?

Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 116 total)
  • Anybody gone back to square taper chainsets, are Hollowtech II rubbish?
  • Premier Icon cookeaa
    Subscriber

    HT2 would probably work a whole lot better on MTBs if they’d simply used 3/4” (19mm) axles, rather than the chuffing great 24mm things they’ve opted for (I presume to make it a nightmare sourcing aftermarket BB bearings) 2.5mm more bearing section would make the world of difference and you’d still have a very stiff set of crank arms…

    HT1 is the future. I fleeted with HT2, didn't last a second. Utter crud.
    Keep the bearings on the inside and they'll last longer, and won't knacker your BB threads either.

    BB30 on the road bike. HTII on the MTB.

    The difference in Q factor between them is alarming 😛

    I've run middleburns with a un72 on my bike since 2001 covered a fiar distance and do a fair bit of jumping and what have you.

    No problems at all – ever.

    Wouldn't know about stiffness not sure I'd notice the difference.

    I like HT2- no bother with either XTR or dura-ace BBs or chainsets,Its noticably stiffer, can be stripped out/ cleaned and replaced in a few minutes, lasts well and costs little to buy new bearing cartridges if something does die.
    I wouldn't go back to square taper if I could avoid it ( well, unless crap ISIS was the only alternative)

    Sum
    Member

    I managed to shear off the HTII axle (XT M760) on my SS last week 😐

    It sheared near the drive-side axle/crank arm interface.

    I was wondering if it was LX that was the problem? Apparently it's not actually a MTB groupset anymore. I'm reluctant to go up to SLX, worried that it'll happen again and will have wasted more precious pounds. Would deore be stronger than LX, albeit heavier?

    Sum
    Member

    I'm reluctant to go up to SLX

    SLX is the 'new' LX.

    Btw if you've worn out the splines on the LH crank arm you may be able to buy a spare LH crank arm.

    kamina
    Member

    Every frame I have not faced the BB has killed HTII bearings very quickly. Every time I've had the frame faced the bearings have lasted long enough. I'm pretty sure there is some kind of connection there…

    dobo
    Member

    Every frame I have not faced the BB has killed HTII bearings very quickly. Every time I've had the frame faced the bearings have lasted long enough. I'm pretty sure there is some kind of connection there…

    Imo theres no connection whatsoever, infact the frame that i got faced/chased the BB ripped out, stripping the frame thread.. unles you cant get the bb in and it dont look right then i certainly wouldnt bother, most modern frames are ready to go.

    i also lost an old marin frame due to the square taper BB being impossible to remove after it was in there for 10 years.. even lbs couldnt do it.

    i do like HTII apart from the fact that the BB just dont last, they have virtually no resistance to water whatsoever ever, killed loads of them now on various bikes

    Its not the bearings I have the problem with, although standard shimano ones don't last that long, its the splines I seem to have problems with.

    mikee
    Member

    the development of technology for most stuff these days is to
    create a better profit margin
    not a better crankset /washing machine /tv etc
    square taper works fine even un52 b/bs are ime longer lasting
    then the newer stuff especially the raceface stuff
    middleburn sq/taper un72 for me

    btw spinny spinny bearings .. yeah your right clean the grease out
    and they're much better ..

    Premier Icon letmetalktomark
    Subscriber

    I'll be honest and say my riding tastes lie predominantly in all that is retro 🙄 but….

    I have run square taper cranks and BB for over 15 years now with the most recently replaced (shimano) lasting 8 years. I also run an XTR specific (forgets name) specific BB that is a take on square taper – again with no problems.

    Having said this I do run two outboard BB set ups ( Truvativ and Shimano) both with no problems to date – about two years.

    My observations as a lay person are that the square taper stuff seems better sealed than my external BB's and whilst the gap is wider between crank and BB shell they don't seem to clog up at all.

    Where I ride is quite sandy and am aware that graunching occurs 👿 when sand gets between the crank and the bearing on my outboard – this cannot be doing the seals any good.

    TBH external seems the way forward but I would be the first to stockpile if square taper was withrawn.

    Ramblings on a man who has/hasn't* had enough coffee……I think so.

    * delete as required

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    It's about progression, of a sort…

    Square taper is fine and dandy if most of your riding is of the "going around in a big circle in the woods" sort of thing, nice big bearings, axle strength is more or less OK, but folk started to jump, and fling their bikes around generally more, and the axle on trad. BB (a road bike hang-over) started to be the fail point, so larger diameter axles, Octalink and ISIS…Trouble is in the UK that means smaller bearings, and that suddenly became the big issue, hence external BB's large bearings, check, large axle, check, mostly the answer to every-ones issues and a product that will retro fit every-ones frame, as an idea is brilliant, now that's not to say there won't be product failure, there always is, but really, it's a much better solution all round.

    JIS sqaure taper FTW!

    Lots of brackets out there. I get mine here:-

    http://shop.ebay.co.uk/essybeam/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=25

    martyntr
    Member

    UN52's only…. they stopped making the UN72 a couple of years ago…

    I changed my BB to a UN52 18 months ago and it's still running as clean as a whistle on my Superlight.

    bonzodog
    Member

    A couple of new UN72's on ebay. Over in the US (but they may ship em over)

    UN72

    Just used my old school XT square taper chainset for the first time and can't say I noticed any flex, tho' that could have been because of the fire in my lungs and my calfs. Looks good too.

    now that's not to say there won't be product failure, there always is, but really, it's a much better solution all round.

    so, good if you like hooning your bike and don't mind the exposed bearings seizing ?

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Or alternatively don't mind looking after your kit. My bearings have never seized…

    Well I'm fairly slim and don't do much hooning around and as I seem to be able to knacker the splines on HII then its back to tried and tested for me for a bit.

    TBH, I've never felt the need to move on from square taper.

    Dry bearings was a big thing in the late 1960s with trackmen. Yes, if correctly set up with cup bearings and the pedals removed, it would spin for ages but of course, this was without the lateral forces of legs on pedals.

    IIRC, we had to change the bearings after every 30-40 miles of racing.

    pypdjl
    Member

    Or alternatively don't mind looking after your kit. My bearings have never seized…

    Hmm, I'd rather not have to take my cranks off and regrease the bearings after every wet ride. None of the current options are that great, oversized BB shells is clearly the way forward.

    mocha
    Member

    Anyone tried the SKF square taper bb? Just ordered one with a Middleburn and am a bit curious. Bit late I know…

    Bring back Octalink!

    I've got 2-3 year old octalink XTR on one hardtail, still works a treat.

    My Truvativ external jobby on the other bike just seized after 5 months sporadic use, so its off and awaiting some lovely octalink XT I found on Ebay.

    It seems unfair to tar Octalink with the ISIS brush. Years of using it on different bikes and its never let me down.

    Premier Icon cynic-al
    Subscriber

    sq taper on jey bikes, HT2 on the ones that made sq taper cranks creak & loosen.

    AndyP
    Member

    UN72s all the way.

    Premier Icon thisisnotaspoon
    Subscriber

    mmmmmm square taper,

    There were two standards for the axels remember,

    bendy

    and

    bent

    Also:
    They needed bedding into new cranks which meant carrying big allen keys on every ride.
    They didn't last as long as people seem to remember
    If they didn't bend they snaped
    The canks would shear off at the first hint of a bad landing
    They weren't exactly light (yes there maybe some lightweight, £400, niche-core out there thats lighter than a £50 SLX setup)

    AndyP
    Member

    mmmmmm square taper,

    There were two standards for the axels remember,

    bendy

    and

    bent

    Also:
    They needed bedding into new cranks which meant carrying big allen keys on every ride.
    They didn't last as long as people seem to remember
    If they didn't bend they snaped
    The canks would shear off at the first hint of a bad landing

    this is non-shimano square taper you're talking, right?

    boxfish
    Member

    Got fed up with HTII bearings dying. Went back to square taper (UN52). It was also an excuse to get a shiny Middleburn crankset 🙂

    Premier Icon DoctorRad
    Member

    @pypdjl

    > Hmm, I'd rather not have to take my cranks off and regrease
    > the bearings after every wet ride.

    Use SunTour XC Pro with GreaseGuard then, still readily available on eBay 🙂

    Premier Icon FieldMarshall
    Subscriber

    I expect much depends on where you ride, i.e. what the local conditions are like.

    I was getting through HTII bearings in a couple of wet/gritty rides.

    Swapped back to SqT and have never looked back.

    Am now running SqT on all 4 of my bikes and no issues at all, i.e. Middleburn cranks on 2 of them, shimano on one and White Indsutries on another.

    No creaking, no loosening (never had a need to bed them in!)

    Have never had a failure/snapped crank and I'm not light!

    Or alternatively don't mind looking after your kit. My bearings have never seized…

    whereas with square taper there's nothing to look after…

    Aidan
    Member

    Reading these posts, you have to wonder whether HT2 is the result of industrial espionage…

    Middleburn send one of their designers out to Japan

    He designs a rubbish chainset with poor durability

    Shimano sell loads so they're happy

    Middleburn are one of the few companies making nice square-taper, so they mop up all the disappointed customers

    ChrisE
    Member

    BB30 is the way forward…

    C

    mmmmmm square taper,
    There were two standards for the axels remember,
    bendy and bent

    might you be a "larger gentleman" ??

    being an unadventurous lightweight I've never bent an axle

    clubber
    Member

    I'm definitely a larger gentleman and have still never bent a square taper BB despite having broken quite a few sets of cranks.

    gtkid
    Member

    As I have never bent an axle, had one come loose or the crank come off (threadlock) and can't be arsed fettling bearings I never left sqr taper. Isis was and is pants but octalink seems good quality too.

    adstick
    Member

    I'M 11 stone and fairly smooth on a bike yet I've twisted square taper axles. HT2 are noticeably stiffer and lighter than square taper and the BBs last fine if you don't submerge or jetwash the bike. I've not seen the splines fail, was it done up properly?

    billysan
    Member

    Appologies for digging up an old thread, but I just stumbled across this and found it quite interesting. It seems the majority of the voices in this thread prefer the old school taper axles, and that a few people have had HT2 fail on them.

    Personally I cant understand why this is. My first HT2 was on my roadbike, 2008 tiagra so nothing great. 4500 miles on and its perfect. Have completely removed the cranks numerous times and the BB cups a couple of times to clean them. No problems.

    Next I got a Cannondale with a 2008 Truvativ GXP system. 2500 miles later, its still perfect. (Yes I know its not stricktly HT2, but its external bearing so the similar arguement applies). Again Ive had the cranks off at least every week to clean, post every ride in the winter.

    I recently bought a new condor track bike, it came with a decent quality square taper BB. The level of flex was ridiculous. So guess what, it got changed to Truvativ Omnium with GXP BB. Now it too is perfect, nice and stiff.

    The only way I can see them failing is due to poor maintenance, or poor instalation. But with such a simple process of disassembly there is really no excuse for neglect. Im sure one of mine will fail at some point. but when it does I'll happily replace the bearings and carry on where I left off.

    Maybe the only way old UN72's are superior is in their fit and forget nature. As far as I can see, HT2 is superior in every other way.

Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 116 total)

The topic ‘Anybody gone back to square taper chainsets, are Hollowtech II rubbish?’ is closed to new replies.