Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 486 total)
  • And so it begins…? "mechanical doping" first?
  • Premier Icon Stoner
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    http://sporza.be/cm/sporza/wielrennen/veldrijden/1.2559655

    Turmoil at the cyclocross world championships in Zolder: UCI has found something suspicious in the cycle of promise Femke Van den Driessche. Precisely at this World Cup traces the UCI with new technology for motors in the cycle. “Our auditors have determined mechanical fraud,” said UCI coordinator Peter Van den Abeele.

    Premier Icon stevious
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    Some doubt on twitter as to whether it is a motor (lack of a reliable source, not yet confirmed by UCI) but if it is it makes me feel sad inside.

    Jamz
    Member

    The UCI needs to start banning people for life. As far as I can see it’s the only way you’re going to stand a chance of stopping people doping, mechanical or otherwise.

    Premier Icon matt_outandabout
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    The UCI needs to start banning people for life. As far as I can see it’s the only way you’re going to stand a chance of stopping people doping, mechanical or otherwise.

    +1
    For any sport.
    You cheat, you are gone. Permanently.
    Edit: Any related sponsor also gets 5 years.

    You can’t necessarily ban all related sponsors or you’d have no sport! IT has been confirmed there were wires, they couldn’t get the bottom bracket out and struggled! All over Sporza but need google translate.

    Sad sad day! Especially as she was rubbish anyway so it didn’t help her!

    Premier Icon zippykona
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    How many people would be involved in this? It seems unlikely she fitted it herself without anyone knowing.
    Ban everyone involved for life.

    OK, so no drugs, just motors….

    RE the bans issue, as long as unrepentant crooks like Vinokourov are involved in cycling, we have a problem.

    Some doubt on twitter as to whether it is a motor (lack of a reliable source, not yet confirmed by UCI) but if it is it makes me feel sad inside.

    The UCI press release is a bland holding statement but Sporza, the home broadcaster, has lots of attributed quotes. Looks like it’s more than an out of spec (eg. under-weight) bike, which would be simple enough to not need a holding statement?

    Her father’s excuse is up there with drug doping – someone else’s bike – but I somehow doubt she did this alone.

    Apparently her brother is a fellow racer currently suspended for suspected EPO use?

    Interesting as mechanical doping has been a ‘thing’ since, what, 2010 (Spartacus’ Flanders and Roubaix wins) so it’s not new, and the UCI have been checking bikes at grand tours for a while.

    NO DRUGS is a Belgian clothing brand, not a policy 😉

    http://nodrugs.be/

    Premier Icon rOcKeTdOg
    Subscriber

    +1
    For any sport.
    You cheat, you are gone. Permanently.
    Edit: Any related sponsor also gets 5 years.

    Tell that to all the Millar lovers on here

    NO DRUGS is a Belgian clothing brand, not a policy

    I see! A bold choice of sponsor, though!

    brooess
    Member

    Tell that to all the Millar lovers on here

    Respect for Millar is more nuanced than ‘forgive him for doping’ and not as morally simplistic as you’d like.

    For me at least, it’s that he’s explained in great detail how the culture and practice ingrained in the sport took him from being someone who didn’t want to dope, but ended up doing it. That revealing and the spotlight he’s put on it has gone a long way in helping people understand how it works, and therefore how to fight it.

    Of course he sounds like a hypocrite but his actions in the past and his actions now are different – he’s now helping a lot to end that era.

    I don’t support his doping but I do support his current stance. I do also support the ‘cheat once’ and get banned for life approach…

    xyeti
    Member

    This shouldn’t be a surprise to any one involved in, related to or even slightly interested in Cycling.

    The lengths to which some have gone to and still continue to do so with their own health i’d have thought that this was the easy option. Just like performance enhancers “were” niche 50 odd years ago this is or was 3 or 4 years ago, Hesjedal’s bike for instance, plenty of folk refused to acknowledge this was a possibilty, some folk even tried to fathom how they even worked.

    She’s probably done it because she’s in direct competition with some one who’s doing it, and so it goes…..

    It’s fair to them, “Why” Because it all boils to MONEY,

    ferrals
    Member

    If I’ve read this rightly it suggests if correct, the Belgian national team would be banned?

    Really not good news, I don’t believe this could be done in isolation for someone at that level.

    amedias
    Member

    Oh bum 🙁

    At least they’ve been caught, and hopefully the penalty will be stiff enough to knock mechanical doping on the head before it becomes ingrained like the drugs

    hopefully the penalty will be stiff enough

    potentially a 6 month ban. Just at the end of the CX season. That’d teach em….

    hofnar
    Member

    If I’ve read this rightly it suggests if correct, the Belgian national team would be banned?

    http://cyclingtips.com/2016/01/more-details-emerge-about-motorized-doping-at-cyclo-cross-worlds/
    Really not good news, I don’t believe this could be done in isolation for someone at that level.

    Should be carefull with that article as it seems google translate quick grab together. He speaks about crankshafts while it was the bottom bracket they mentionned in the original text(I am rather fluent in dutch) Also he can’t even spell the name of the newspaper that’s his source correctly. Very interested in the EPO brother can’t find it anywhere doesn’t mean its not true but would have expected some trace on the interwebs.

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    Can’t see the manufacturer being involved.

    I’ve never really taken this seriously, so haven’t read much about it.

    Just watched the Hesjedal footage.
    😐

    On the upside, this obviously explains my placings at Hit the North.

    Premier Icon wwaswas
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    I can understand Teams, sponsors and bike Co’s being very anxious about this.

    Drugs you can blame an individual for, mechanical stuff needs collusion.

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    DP.

    Premier Icon Bregante
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    Rusty Spanner – Member
    On the upside, the bloke from the kebab shop reckons it explains my poor results at Hit the North.

    😆

    xyeti
    Member

    Rusty Spanner, What’s your thoughts regarding the Hesjedal Clip?

    Hofnar people are mentioning it along with her Father being hookie allegedly nice sporting family :-/

    More details emerge about motorised doping at cyclocross worlds

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    It’s odd.

    I’d like to see someone replicate the motion of the bike in the same position on the same road.

    I’m sure someone’s tried it, must be a video out there?

    The bike just doesn’t appear to behave the way a bike shedding energy in such a situation should.

    Premier Icon scotroutes
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    [video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN7HjwZI-k0[/video]

    hofnar
    Member

    Hofnar people are mentioning it along with her Father being hookie allegedly nice sporting family :-/

    http://cyclingtips.com/2016/01/more-details-emerge-about-motorized-doping-at-cyclo-cross-worlds/ I just see it mentionned in this article. The same guy that does the rubbish google translate stuff. I speak dutch and can’t spot any references to this except for Shane Stokes who doesn’t really inspire me .

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    Sorry, we’ve all experienced a bike behaving like one in the demo at some point.
    Hesjedal’s bike doesn’t appear to do that.

    Could be manipulated footage, technical limitations etc, but it’s definitely odd all the same.

    pk13
    Member

    But UCI will pull the bike apart and find the offending items no?
    I trust the UCI to be upfront and honest just like they have been over doping 😆

    Very odd all the same

    aracer
    Member

    rusty wrote:

    Sorry, we’ve all experienced a bike behaving like one in the demo at some point.
    Hesjedal’s bike doesn’t appear to do that.

    Oh that Hesjedal clip. It’s bollocks conspiracy theory stuff – yes Hesjedal’s bike does do much the same as the one in the demo, what do you think the difference is?

    For those thinking Hesjedal’s bike had a motor, where exactly do you think the motor is?

    Premier Icon scotroutes
    Subscriber

    rusty wrote:

    Sorry, we’ve all experienced a bike behaving like one in the demo at some point.
    Hesjedal’s bike doesn’t appear to do that.
    Could be manipulated footage, technical limitations etc, but it’s definitely odd all the same.

    IIRC there was some analysis at the time showing that the camera angle was giving a false impression of the (actually quite considerable) camber. That would have an effect on the motion of his bike.

    MTB Rob
    Member

    yes agree with you RS, as Hesjedal crashes, a lot of his weight/leg is on the bike, which will add pressure/friction tyre to slow it down, and as he getting up the bike is near enough stopped, then it speeds up……

    Anyway as for Femke, if it is true it be a bit unfair to ban Belgium, as she normally rides under a trade team, her normal normal support crew/helpers would be there. (And if true there is more than one person involved and it be more likely it be them)

    “The bike was in the pit but it is [belonging to] someone from her entourage, who sometimes trains with her”
    Not the first time a coach/training partner has used a “electric” bike to keep up/do pace work, but why would it be in the pits!!

    But from the first reports it soounded like her bike broke, went to the pits then UCI, looked at it (the broken one) and found issue with it.

    Anyway just have to wait for UCI to release a proper report/press release (in English as it is the universal language of cycling)

    xyeti
    Member

    I’ve never seen the clip of the guy demonstrating it on his driveway before, which is flat, and there was no motorcyclist there to run over his rear wheel,

    I bet the rider of the motorbike has seen cycles go down in front of him before, he doesn’t correct his line because bikes don’t go down and then skim the Tarmac, then torque round on an axis against the gradient whilst appearing to pick up speed, I think it looks odd, of course that’s just my opinion, I could watch the bloke on his drive try and convince me but my minds made up,

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    IIRC there was some analysis at the time showing that the camera angle was giving a false impression of the (actually quite considerable) camber.

    I can quite imagine that, given the possibilities of distortion, post production shenanigans etc.
    As I said above, be interesting to replicate it on the same road.

    Aracer, I said it looked odd, not that he was cheating.

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
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    yes agree with you RS, as Hesjedal crashes, a lot of his weight/leg is on the bike, which will add pressure/friction tyre to slow it down, and as he getting up the bike is near enough stopped, then it speeds up……

    I’m sure this was done to death at the time, but just for old time’s sake, have you seen how the seat-tube motors work? They don’t spin the wheel at that sort of speed, they turn the cranks. Hesjedal’s cranks remain stationary w.r.t. the bike, you can clearly see the pedal stays stationary relative to the seat tube, and likewise, you can clearly see that Hesjedal’s foot stays clipped in (and not turning the cranks) whilst the rear wheel is dragging the bike around.

    So if you believe that he had a motor, it must have been some hitherto unknown hub mounted motor, including battery, which is somehow so small that it doesn’t raise any comment. And how would you switch such a motor without cables? 🙄

    xyeti
    Member

    Aracer, Is that a tongue in cheek question or have you not read any of the links to wires from seats, seat posts and frames and not being able to get the crank arms or bottom bracket off?

    At a guess I’d say the mechanical parts are located somewhere near the the pedals? Say maybe bottom bracket area as riders would probably benefit more from assistance pedalling than they would if you hid a worm drive in the head tube to assist with steering on the twisty bits? No…….

    Premier Icon Rusty Spanner
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    you can clearly see that Hesjedal’s foot stays clipped in (and not turning the cranks) whilst the rear wheel is dragging the bike around.

    Eh?
    He’s on his feet, running after his bike.

    However, as you say, the cranks remain stationary.
    And the front wheel continues to roll downhill, which suggests, as above, camera flattening.

    Still odd though.

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
    Subscriber

    When he goes down and the spinning rear wheel starts to drag the bike after it, his foot is still clipped in.

    My point being IF he had a seat-tube mounted motor, it would need to drive the cranks round in order to drive the rear wheel. His foot being clipped in and not turning the pedals is going to prevent that (which is a moot point anyway as once he is unclipped and chasing the bike round in circles you can see that the pedals aren’t turning).

    xyeti
    Member

    I’d also like to say that I DO think Hesjedal was cheating, the fact that it’s not been proven and that his pedals didn’t move bare no credence to me as im fully aware of what goes on in professional sport,

    At half 9 this morning everyone thought the Dane wasn’t guilty, now she is, well not her in fathers eyes, and neither is his son, Neither are the Russian athletic team, all Rugby players are clean and so are footballers, the recent scandal surrounding tennis was a hoax, the Lance Armstrong fiasco was also a hoax oh and the moon is made from Green Cheese.

    I bet Darts players aren’t taking EPO?

    Edited: I’d also like to say that the none pedal turning “Moot Point” is also bollox as the bike pivots round on the pedal they can’t both turn, he goes down and the only thing going through his mind is Shoite, best get hold of this quick, he’s been down before and kept control of the bike, it’s not the first time he’s come off, this looks like it takes him by surprise and makes him look like a novice.

    Now it looks like some ones actually been caught with a device fitted in the frame and still there are people refusing to believe it. And this is why we see folk trying to argue innocence, simply because some one some where refuses to believe it’s happening.

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