Worth two minutes of time. We’ve a unique opportunity from CoVid to help cycling grow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDMdcC63Z0s&t=18s

What he said

Can’t disagree with much of that.

well said, despite not being a roadie, I started watching his strava KOM videos recently, he’s just honest and for some reason interesting to watch.

Wish that video had been around a couple of weeks ago when some idiot on a FB cycling group was posting to say that we as “the cycling community” should be helping new riders by telling them to wear hi vis and helmets.

I pointed out that it wasn’t helping at all, it was being a dick but by then the thread was overrun with the usual helmet anecdotes.

Great video. I like his stuff and his videos. Amazing rider too!

What’s wrong with hi-vis and helmets?

I wear them w/out hesitation now but then I’m not some ‘cool dude’ obsessed with having my campagnolo socks match the colour of my bar tape 😀

What’s wrong with hi-vis and helmets?

Nothing, but it’s a matter of personal choice. I never wore hi-viz on a bike, but I always used to wear a lid, even riding into town, and mine proved itself on one occasion when I came off at walking speed, hit my knee, shoulder, the side of my face, and if I hadn’t hat my lid on, I’d have suffered at least a severe bruise and scalp injury.
However, that’s just my one experience in roughly twenty-five years of riding, and I still can’t explain how it happened.
I would *advise* people to hear a crash hat, because head injuries when falling are very common, on a bike or not, but I wouldn’t legislate it.
Hi-viz, I hardly ever notice it on riders when I’m out walking or driving.

One good reason to wear a hi-vis and helmet IMHO is that in court it lends you credibility as a responsible cyclist and ipso facto that driver who hit and injured you was to blame.

Hi-vis doesn’t work with ‘the sun in my eyes’.
Oh, and that video is great.

Even promoting helmet use reduces the number of people that cycle thus decreasing the health of the nation.

Promoting helmet use makes a very safe pastime appear dangerous and puts people off cycling

https://www.cyclinguk.org/campaigning/views-and-briefings/cycle-helmets

The only research I have seen on hi viz showed no difference. Indeed it can make things worse by drivers assuming the rider is a roadside worker

Beware of unintended secondary effects

missing the point already……I wonder if people have watched the clip or just read the comments and jumped in.

As soon as we start treating new cyclists in this way, telling them what they can and can’t do, we create them and us, elitism and put people off. It’s not about helmets and hi-viz, it’s about attitudes.

Let them make their own minds up. Let them ask questions and answer honestly. We were all newbies once….

my answers were to the person who asked “whats wrong with helmets and hi viz”

Some really good points, but I personally am not a fan of the ‘us’ and ‘them’ slant. Lost me a bit early on with the ‘car drivers are dicks’ attitude.
We’re all people. Some are dicks. Most aren’t. No matter how they’re moving along our highways. Shame it had to be spoilt with that.

This isn’t going to turn into a helmet and hi-vis debate is it? If you want to wear them, do so. If you don’t, don’t. If you’ve entered an event or joined a ride with rules, follow the rules.

Great vid by the way. Phil Gaimon’s books are good too, he’s an excellent writer.

A brilliant ‘covid’ message from Phil Gaimon to new and experienced cyclists

Nah, he lost all credibility when he jetted from NZ to his second home on Skye.

missing the point already……I wonder if people have watched the clip or just read the comments and jumped in.

This. Don’t be dicks.

Nah, he lost all credibility when he jetted from NZ to his second home on Skye.

😁👍🏼

my answers were to the person who asked “whats wrong with helmets and hi viz”

I know. Which illustrates the point Crazy-Legs made perfectly.

We’re all people. Some are dicks. Most aren’t.

I actually think we all are…just not all at the same time or in the same circumstances…

As much as i hope we’re seeing a ‘new dawn’ happening unfortunately it’s just complete and utter fantasy. We’ve had a run of a number of weeks of stunning weather along with empty roads and people stuck at home with nothing better to do. Forward to a future where ‘normal’ life resumes and there is not a cat in hells chance even a small percentage of those same people will suffer a biting head wind and driving rain along with close passes from drivers, in the dark of winter as they battle on desperate to get to work in time to have a shower and make that 8am meeting. Not a cat in hells chance at all. Pre-Covid normal life will resume as quickly as possible. We might cling onto a few more recreational cyclists, but no way people are going to start leaving their car on the drive and doing the weekly shop or daily commute by bike.

The reality of regular all year round cycling in the UK is, more often than not, cycling in crappy conditions on crappy roads against a tight schedule that just adds stress to peoples lives with nothing pleasant about it. If Covid had struck a few months earlier in amongst the storms and floods sweeping the nation we would not have seen the cycling uptake we’ve seen.

I had the day off yesterday and went on a big bike ride in the drizzle and mildly blustery conditions we had around here….hardly a sniff of many other cyclists other than the usual keen and hardened cyclists would be out anyway.

Nice idea and always good to have a hopeful and optimistic outlook on life, but unfortunately it’s just a pipe dream. What good may come out of it is councils and the government might start investing in some proper cycling infrastructure to try to entice people to use their bikes more often….but that remains to be seen when the real scale of the economic impact of the lockdown starts to bite. There will be much bigger and more important fish to fry then.

I love Phil! His channel is great.

His everesting was great to watch, and I still feel for him about his track crash – derailed a potentially great Olympic dream. And typically for him he’s made it a part of his journey and used to to focus attention on how broken US healthcare is, moved on and found another path.

Neil, not so much.

Edit also, his “please don’t kill me to death with your car” video a few months ago is worth looking up and posting to places.

The only research I have seen on hi viz showed no difference. Indeed it can make things worse by drivers assuming the rider is a roadside worker

Beware of unintended secondary effects

You could be right but otoh I’d rather adopt a precautionary principle based on a balance of probability.

If hi-vis is useless then perhaps I should wear a camouflage suit? 😀

People always find slivers of sceptical arguments to resit the adopting of new safety measures and technology. In the 70’s and 80’s many said seatbelts were dangerous because they would rather be ‘thrown clear’ in the event of a crash. 😀

rydster – the difference is the science did not support the seatbelt arguement. It does support the “non promotion of helmets”

Read the link I posted.

Follow the evidence. Follow the data.

If you have to wear this just to ride a bike, many won’t

If you can just do it in normal clothes, many more will

funnily enough when I google searched images, these came from another post on stw. https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/why-do-runners-wear-hi-viz/

Its a bit chicken and egg, we need more people to be riding to justify the need for better facilities to get more people riding.

As for drivers being dicks, well most are ok, but even those ones pass too closely, or can get distracted, if we get more people riding, maybe we can justify building separated lanes, so per Phil, lets do our best not to screw this opportunity up.

Of course many won’t stick it out, but many will, and cities are already reallocating road space for cycling or wider spaces for pedestrians. There’s a chance some of that might stick around in a permanent way, especially if this covid situation lasts, or people are unwilling to get back on a bus or train.

I have to agree with wobbliscott for the most part. I was out a few weeks ago when the lock down was first introduced and saw hundreds (and I mean hundreds) of cyclists in the sunshine on all manner of BSOs. Out yesterday in cool, overcast, windy conditions on the same course and never saw one, not even a committed cyclist. Having said that seeing anyone out cycling on a sunny day has to be a positive thing.

Although there has been a lot of rhetoric I can’t see councils wanting to spend much money on cycling infrastructure on the back of the financial crisis we are creating either.

One good reason to wear a hi-vis and helmet IMHO is that in court it lends you credibility as a responsible cyclist and ipso facto that driver who hit and injured you was to blame.

It’s exactly this kind of thinking that we want to get away from. It infers that somebody without is somehow an irresponsible cyclist despite any evidence to the contrary.

It’s something that really seems to be most prominent in western cultures: The UK, The US, Australia. Many other places, people just ride bikes, they hop on and go, no thought required. No pressure to conform to any special standards other than basic road etiquette, it’s just a simple mode of transport a bit more efficient than walking.

Some of the thinking around this stuff in our culture is really toxic, which is the whole point of the video.

Although there has been a lot of rhetoric I can’t see councils wanting to spend much money on cycling infrastructure on the back of the financial crisis we are creating either.

Councils are already looking at things like pop up cycle lanes and increased pavement space because things are potentially going to grind to a halt if people start returning to work and social distancing has to be maintained long term. Public transport is not going to cope with reduced passenger density and everyone driving will just result in complete gridlock, so trying to get more people walking and cycling is actually looking like an immediate solution, rather than a long term aspiration.

. I was out a few weeks ago when the lock down was first introduced and saw hundreds (and I mean hundreds) of cyclists in the sunshine on all manner of BSOs. Out yesterday in cool, overcast, windy conditions on the same course and never saw one, not even a committed cyclist.

That’s what I’ve seen as well. I’m expecting the vast majority of people who bought bikes in the last three months to leave them gather dust until they sell them, or whatever.

But if only a few percent carry on riding that would be good.

The message is great, but I don’t understand why he’s standing on a random “sidewalk” turning round on the spot while reading a script?

What a nice guy.
I agree with pretty much everything he says.