Tories cancelling the corporation tax cut to fund the NHS … But but but lowering the tax rate increases the tax take?

Laugher curve.

Someone on LBC wants Corbyn to admit he will ‘press the button’ in the event of our ‘defense’.

Doomed.

I’m convinced the electorate just want to pain themselves into oblivion.

We all know what the problems are. They’re glaringly apparent to all. That’s not the issue. The issue is who offers the solutions to them.

The Tory’s under Joris Bohnson and the ERG have offered up the EU as a universal scapegoat for all these things and Brexit as some magical unicorn-based solution and pathway to the sunny uplands.

Labour should have countered this with their own strong alternative narrative. Unfortunately they’re been terminally hamstrung in this, from the off, by the fact the leader of the labour party is a life-long Brexiteer, as are all those around him.

So on the most important issue of the day (on which all other policies are dependent) they are also offering up a magical unicon-based fantasy Brexit as the starting point of their solution, which then, even more laughably they may or may not campaign either for or against (though I’m guessing strongly ‘for’ in grandads case, no matter what version of the May/Johnson deal he comes back with)

As strong counter-narratives go, its not a great starting point, is it?

As their hopeless polling and total failure to make any impact against this far right, incompetent bunch of sociopaths is depressingly proving

I am always infuriated by this; why is the answer to the NHS problem ‘more money’?

If they stopped pissing money away there would be a lot more to spend on sick people. Why does no party want to address that?

You think there’s just a dial somewhere marked ‘waste’ that they can turn down, and yet no-one’s thought of it?

Parties do want to address it – in fact, a significant part of the problem is that successive governments have pissed about with the NHS in the name of ‘efficiency’ with badly thought out ideas to grab headlines. The NHS is massive – so improving efficiency is a huge job. So you hire people to help fix it, then you get endless headlines about money wasted on pen pushers. Politicians like to push stuff through because they make vague promises in manifestos, and they end up screwing things up even more.

why is the answer to the NHS problem ‘more money’?

Because the boomers didn’t pay enough tax to support their future healthcare needs

NHS is struggling on many levels , staffing crisis being a huge one, we are utterly dependent on immigrants to fill jobs, but immigrant bashing is a political favourite . Removing bursaries for nurses was a similarly daft bit of austerity that’s seen trainees nurse numbers plummet , costing the NHS even more seeking agency staff from oversees

But austerity & restricting immigration are policies boomers love so …

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/inlineimage/2017-06-13/Age-01.png

Besides WTF is a boomer?

Exact definitions vary, but they’re all definitely worse than Hitler

why is the answer to the NHS problem ‘more money’?

Pretty simple, because it needs more money – straight forward supply and demand.
The demand is higher than ever due to increased longevity of the population yet funding (supply) has not increased in line with it.

You can either increase the supply to maintain the service of you can under supply and offer a lesser service (per last decade)

Social care should also be added to it as it is the same problem.

Ok Boomer.

The same would still be true if Labour won.

That’s what happens when both parties diverge away from the centre – you alienate more people and make a few people happier.

True … it’s a bit chicken and egg now with Brexit being used to push through what would normally be unelectable. (IMHO)

cinnamon_girl

Subscriber
But austerity & restricting immigration are policies boomers love so …

Change the bloody record kimbers.

look, I backed up my assertions with some numbers, I know you dont like me CG, but respect the stats!

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/inlineimage/2017-06-13/Age-01.png

look, I backed up my assertions with some numbers, I know you dont like me CG, but respect the stats!

The stat’s posted say nothing of the sort.
It just shows that fewer older people voted labour and voted conservative, it doesn’t show WHY.
It certainly doesn’t cover the droves of labour voters who voted for Brexit … many of whom did so because of their perception of immigration or perhaps due to the Labour position on immigration.
Nor does it really cover why older people seem to beleive there is no such thing as a free lunch regarding austerity and more puzzling why they thought leaving the EU was a free lunch?

If you can’t see the difference between Corbyn and Johnson for the benefit of the nation as whole, then you see nothing

I didn’t say that there’s no difference between them. Theres a yawning chasm.

But what they both share is the one essential quality when wanting to be put in power for the next 5 years – the total absence of the slightest shred of credibility when it comes to implementing the glaringly unicorn-based nonsense they’re both presently peddling.

You think either of those idiots are presently putting forward a credible economic position which they truly believe isn’t comically implausible?

They may be planning very different routes to economic calamity, but that’s where both their roads will take us.

My only hope is that neither think they’ll get a majority so they’re promising all kinds knowing they’ll never have to deliver it.

But then we all know what happened the last time someone did that…

But the beauty is … promising to increase borrowing to spend on public service hides the fact that both have no choice but to increase borrowing hugely to get us through Brexit. At least with Labour they do have some proper revenue raising plans as well.

i’m mostly puzzled by the 4% of UKIP supporters who voted remain…

At some point even some UKIP supporters realise sticking a dildo on a donkey isn’t a unicorn.

But the beauty is … promising to increase borrowing to spend on public service hides the fact that both have no choice but to increase borrowing hugely to get us through Brexit. At least with Labour they do have some proper revenue raising plans as well.

I don’t disagree … but had Corbyn got off the fence before the referendum and made it clear that Brexit was a train-crash for the working population we wouldn’t even have this mess.

the masses can all watch cat videos

Ok Boomer.

As if to prove the unicorns…. just spend money for the sake of increasing spending and push UK PLC further into debt in some bizarre belief that by increasing our GDP will actually make the people better off.

Understand how the money system works… The government spends first and taxes after.

i) Even the most middle-ground Economists agree that given the cost of UK borrowing – that kick starting the economy through rapid investment of infrasturcture would yield huge returns over the medium turn. The Tories failed to capitilise on this. Completely.

ii) Debt as a ratio of GDP is still not anywhere near post-war levels. When – guess what we needed to massively invest in the economy.

Post-World War II debt reduction

iii) A sovereign country that is the sole issuer of its own currency shouldn’t be concerned by debt per se. In fact a country in surplus (which very rarely happens) is a negative in the private sector. I.e No growth.

What did we do in 2008? Yep Q/E and it didn’t affect inflation to any notable degree.

Read Stephanie Kelton, Randall Wray or Richard Murphy.

Who is proposing that? I haven’t seen any “just keep people busy” or “build it for the sake of it” proposals from any party. In fact, most of it looks more like “other countries are laughing at us for not already doing that”… although some of it is likely to take much longer than currently proposed/presented (again, for all parties).

It’s simply been extended mileage from the backlash over Tory implemented austerity that itself was a backlash over Labour led overspending …. back and forth with one extreme or the other.

I am always infuriated by this; why is the answer to the NHS problem ‘more money’?

Because the two most expensive things the NHS spends money on are drugs and staff, and the cost of drugs is going up, and we have a staffing shortage.

Has anyone seen Diane lately, I haven’t seen much of her during the campaign.
Is she being kept in a bunker out of harms way or on jezzas allotment planting next years spring crops.